mystery brewing powder - probably CaCl. How can I identify it?

[timsch]

I have a half pint canning jar with what I think is the CaCl powder I bought this summer, but failed to label it.

Is there a simple way that I can positively identify it?

I researched a bit online, and found that it will give off a red flame when a sample is put in the blue flame of a Bunsen burner. I had no BB, but did have a propane torch that has a blue flame that I used. The powder did not react to the flame at all.

 

[RPh_Guy]

It's so cheap. 1lb for $5
https://www.morebeer.com/products/calcium-chloride.html

 

[TallDan]

On TV and in movies, the cops always cut into it with a knife and taste it.
It's almost always cocaine.
I'd assume it's cocaine.

 

[TallDan]

More seriously, I'd try to identify it by look and smell, maybe add it to water. If you're very sure that it's something related to homebrewing, you can probably identify it that way.

Otherwise, maybe just dump it.

 

[Bilsch]

I have a half pint canning jar with what I think is the CaCl powder I bought this summer, but failed to label it.

Is there a simple way that I can positively identify it?

I researched a bit online, and found that it will give off a red flame when a sample is put in the blue flame of a Bunsen burner. I had no BB, but did have a propane torch that has a blue flame that I used. The powder did not react to the flame at all.

Home atomic emission spectroscopy, I love it. We used to use this quick and dirty trick in the lab all the time. Since you probably don’t have platinum wire handy.. use a 6-8” piece of stiff nichrome resistance wire. Hold the tip of the wire in the torch flame to heat it up and burn off any other residue. Then while still hot dip in your suspected calcium salt to melt/fuse on a sample. Then back into the flame at the tip where there is no blue color. You should see flashes of deep orange red, this is calcium. Unfortunately all calcium salts will show this color so might not be too helpful in a brewery By the way sodium will be bright yellow and potassium light purple.

 

[BeerFst]

Home atomic emission spectroscopy, I love it. We used to use this quick and dirty trick in the lab all the time. Since you probably don’t have platinum wire handy.. use a 6-8” piece of stiff nichrome resistance wire. Hold the tip of the wire in the torch flame to heat it up and burn off any other residue. Then while still hot dip in your suspected calcium salt to melt/fuse on a sample. Then back into the flame at the tip where there is no blue color. You should see flashes of deep orange red, this is calcium. Unfortunately all calcium salts will show this color so might not be too helpful in a brewery By the way sodium will be bright yellow and potassium light purple.

in High school we dissolved a salt in some water and used a mister/spray to spray into the flame.

any reason that wouldnt work?

 

[timsch]

Thanks for the replies. Buying resistance wire would be as expensive as new CaCl, so I'll just buy new powder. It'll be my penalty for being careless.

 

[Bilsch]

in High school we dissolved a salt in some water and used a mister/spray to spray into the flame.
any reason that wouldnt work?

It takes quite a bit of energy to boil off the water vapor then vaporize the salt and then heat it until it emits light. You’d need quite a fine spray and a hot plasma torch. Incidentally this is how an ICP works. Are you sure it wasn’t methanol or ethanol you dissolved the salts in for the high school color flame trick?

 

[BeerFst]

It takes quite a bit of energy to boil off the water vapor then vaporize the salt and then heat it until it emits light. You’d need quite a fine spray and a hot plasma torch. Incidentally this is how an ICP works. Are you sure it wasn’t methanol or ethanol you dissolved the salts in for the high school color flame trick?

am i positive, no... it was some 15 years ago, but i was pretty sure it was water. it was definitely a Bunsen burner though.

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

If yours is a powder it is not likely to be CaCl2. Calcium Chloride is available in flake (broken chunks of sheet) and prill (agglomerated round bead) forms. But not (to my knowledge) in a powder form.

 

[kh54s10]

Send a sample to a lab. They can analyze it and tell you what it is. But as you noted, that would cost much more than replacing it.

When you buy more you could compare the two and see if they are the same. Maybe by looks and taste? I just read it is dangerous if you ingest any. But maybe just a tiny amount on the tip of your tongue??

Make sure it isn't CaCl2. That is for melting the ice off your driveway!

 

[khannon]

I was going to say taste it and hope it's not PBW..

 

[mongoose33]

The CaCL2 I use is in the form of little white balls, not powder. MgSO4 (Epsom Salts) is in the form of crystals.

The only water amendment I can think of that's a white powder is Gypsum. Baking soda is similar but it's a little less white.

If instead of using Campden tablets, crushed, you use powdered sodium or potassium metabisulfate, that would be a white powder.

I've got some pickling lime but I've never had occasion to use it. I'm guessing it's also a white powder.

So, the question would be what have you used in your beers, what have you bought, and can you narrow it down that way?

 

[RPh_Guy]

Make sure it isn't CaCl2.

CaCl2 is the chemical notation for calcium chloride. It is indeed what we're using to adjust beer/water minerality.

Calcium ion always has a +2 charge and chloride ion always has a -1 charge, so 2 chloride ions are always bound with 1 calcium ion to form a neutral calcium chloride salt.

 

[kh54s10]

CaCl2 is the chemical notation for calcium chloride. It is indeed what we're using to adjust beer/water minerality.

Calcium ion always has a +2 charge and chloride ion always has a -1 charge, so 2 chloride ions are always bound with 1 calcium ion to form a neutral calcium chloride salt.

So what is the difference between CaCl and CaCl2? Or is there? I know I can look it up but I am being lazy right now.

 

[Silver_Is_Money]

So what is the difference between CaCl and CaCl2? Or is there? I know I can look it up but I am being lazy right now.

There is no such molecule as CaCl. It might briefly exist as an ion with a charge of +1, but personally I've never heard of such an ion as CaCl+.

 

[RPh_Guy]

There is no such molecule as CaCl. It might briefly exist as an ion with a charge of +1, but personally I've never heard of such an ion as CaCl+.

Beat me to it.
The charges in a salt need electrostatic balance (as I explained in the previous post), otherwise it won't exist in any kind of stable form.

Calcium chloride does vary in the amount of water also bound with it (the hydration state).

 

[RPh_Guy]

CaCl2

To be clear, the "2" denotes that there are two chloride atoms to every one calcium atom.

 

[kh54s10]

Thanks. I guess that I won't use the stuff made for melting the ice in my brewing though.

 

[Bilsch]

If yours is a powder it is not likely to be CaCl2. Calcium Chloride is available in flake (broken chunks of sheet) and prill (agglomerated round bead) forms. But not (to my knowledge) in a powder form.

I have about 2 kilos of CaCl2*2H2O in powder form that came from Noah Technologies. It just depends on the manufacturer.

 

[Soulshine2]

On TV and in movies, the cops always cut into it with a knife and taste it.
It's almost always cocaine.
I'd assume it's cocaine.

probably a kilo of Columbian Bam-bam...

 

[Bobby_M]

I have a half pint canning jar with what I think is the CaCl powder I bought this summer, but failed to label it.

Is there a simple way that I can positively identify it?

I researched a bit online, and found that it will give off a red flame when a sample is put in the blue flame of a Bunsen burner. I had no BB, but did have a propane torch that has a blue flame that I used. The powder did not react to the flame at all.

Calcium Chloride is usually variable sized balls a little smaller than BBs. A fine powder is likely Gypsum or Chalk (though I'd throw it away and spend the $2 to make sure)