My latest beer stinks, was it my hop schedule?

[chewyheel]

Recently made a rye pale ale, I've used this same grist several times before, but this time I used different hops and did a dramatically different hop schedule, 60 minute boil.

The reason I think it's the hops is because the rest of my brew day went fine, nothing in my process was flawed as far as I can tell. Fermentation went well and was an adequate pitch which stayed between 64 and 68 the whole time, attenuated fine.

First off the aroma is terrible, it doesn't smell like citra or centennial at all. It's hard to explain, but it basically just stinks, catty is the closest think I can think of. The flavor is equally off putting, the initial taste isn't pucker inducing, but more like an eyebrow raising 'what is that?' kind of hay like bitterness. And it finishes very harsh on the back of the throat. Basically it has no redeeming qualities. Anyone with experience doing hop stands like this have a similar experience or possibly know what happened? I've never done a hop stand like this before. Thanks in advance.

Grains
4 lbs golden promise
3 lbs 2 row
2 lbs flaked rye
8 oz honey malt
4 oz munich light
4 oz vienna

Hops
1 oz centennial 7.7% FWH
1 oz centennial 7.7% hop stand starting at 170 for 30 minutes
1 oz citra 13.3 % same hop stand

 

[MGamber]

It's pretty hard to screw up a hop stand and I don't see anything unusual in the schedule. It sounds to me like low quality or old hops.

 

[day_trippr]

When Centennial goes wrong it's onions and garlic or worse. Is that what's going on?

 

[madscientist451]

Everyone has different taste. One brewer might say and ounce of Centennial and Citra used in a 30 min. hop stand tastes great, but you might not like it at all.
Maybe your hops were crappy as has been already suggested, or perhaps your individual taste would prefer a more "juicy" or tropical hop in the hop stand like Denali or Pacifica?
Maybe it would have been better to just use Citra in the hop stand and leave out the Centennial?
I really don't have an answer these are just wild guesses.
I'd suggest next time you want to experiment with after flameout hops, split up your post boil wort into 2-3 batches and try different combinations.

 

[soccerdad]

I'm just the opposite. I can brush my teeth with Centennial. Citra often gives a cat piss odor. Not that cat piss in a beer isn't delightful.

 

[day_trippr]

Nothing wrong with Centennial in good shape, I grew it and used a hella lot of it for 6 years (Centennial SMASH on tap year 'round) but when it's picked late or heavily oxidizes over time it gets pretty rank...

Cheers!

 

[FatDragon]

I had a bunch of hops that went bad on me without my realizing it relatively early in my brewing career. That IPA was gut-wrenchingly bad...

 

[chewyheel]

Thanks for the input, I didn’t really check the date on the hops and just assumed they were fine. I’ll know for next time though.

 

[soccerdad]

Thanks for the input, I didn’t really check the date on the hops and just assumed they were fine. I’ll know for next time though.

In most cases (according to my limited experience) a sight test and smell test is a good guide. Sight, look for green not fading to gray or yellow. Smell, fresh hoppy, not grassy, onion, or garlic. You can taste them too. They will keep better in the freezer v. the fridge.

 

[LarMoeCur]

Sounds like Dimethyl Sulfide (DMS) to me. How did fermentation go? What type of yeast and how much did you pitch? How long did it ferment? What was the OG and FG? At what tempurature?

Hop stands can leave DMS in the finshed wort. SMM is coverted to DMS at 140F or above. I've tasted pale ales and IPAs with the exact flavor you are describing. DMS is a sulfur compound and can be catty like although mostly discribed as cooked or creamed corn. After trouble shooting these beers, it boiled down to a fermentation issue. It was either unhealty yeast, not enough yeast in the pitch, or the beer was taken off the yeast to early before it had time to clean up the DMS. Or a combination all three.

 

[chewyheel]

Sounds like Dimethyl Sulfide (DMS) to me. How did fermentation go? What type of yeast and how much did you pitch? How long did it ferment? What was the OG and FG? At what tempurature?

Hop stands can leave DMS in the finshed wort. SMM is coverted to DMS at 140F or above. I've tasted pale ales and IPAs with the exact flavor you are describing. DMS is a sulfur compound and can be catty like although mostly discribed as cooked or creamed corn. After trouble shooting these beers, it boiled down to a fermentation issue. It was either unhealty yeast, not enough yeast in the pitch, or the beer was taken off the yeast to early before it had time to clean up the DMS. Or a combination all three.

Fermentation went well, or so I thought anyway. OG 1.050, FG 1.010, it was in primary for 11 days, then bottled. starting at 66 degrees for week, then moved it to a warmer room where it got to 74. Pitched one rehydrated pack of US 05.

I’ve used 05 plenty in the past and never had this problem though. 10 or 11 days in primary is a typical length I use for fermentation as well.

 

[ncbrewer]

Is there a chance it was lightstruck (skunked)?

 

[chewyheel]

Is there a chance it was lightstruck (skunked)?

I don’t think so, I bottled in the garage with the door open, but keep the beer in the shaded area. Then it does right back inside in boxes stashed in the closet.

 

[bpgreen]

@soccerdad already mentioned this, but Citra can give off a "catty" aroma. There's an aroma that is usually described as black currant in hop profiles, but to some people (I'm one), it smells like cat urine.

I've used Citra in beers and didn't detect the catty aroma from them, and I've read that some batches of Citra seem to have it more than others.

I think that when hops go bad due to age, they smell cheesy. I had some hops that did this once. I bought a pound of hops that I had never used before from a LHBS that was going out of business and that's when I discovered that I smell cat urine when the description says black currant. Needless to say, they didn't get much use and I threw them out when I opened the package and got a strong whiff of cheese.