My First Stout

[kd7enm]

Hey all. I'm new to home brewing and just made my first batch of beer. But it left me with a few questions.

First off, my OG was 1.060, and FG is about 1.024. Does this sound right? I kind of assumed that it would be a little lower, like 1.014? It only took about 4 days to finish fermenting. Its been sitting in a second fermenter for about 11 days, and I just bottled it tonight.

Second, since I made a stout, I expected the final alcohol content to be higher. Isn't that the definition of a stout (a high alcohol porter)?

-Tyler

 

[Smokeater233]

Leave it fermenting - she ain't done yet. Stouts can take several weeks since they are bigger beers than your average ale. If in a few days your hydrometer readings show no difference, then you might lightly rouse the yeast and keep the carboy warm to help wake up the little yeasties...

As for the ABV - if you get your FG (assuming your OG and FG readings were taken at the same temp) to around 1.015 you will already be at 6% and you will hit nearly 7% at 1.010. That's on par for a stout - you can always increase your ABV by using more fermentables or you maltose in the boil for a spike...

 

[eppo]

the same thing happened to my Double chocolate stout that i made last year. it finished at 1.022. at the time i thought it was good. i made it again this year, paying close attention to fermentation temperatures. i started at 66F and kept creaping up the temp to about 72F. this beer finished a lot lower, 1.14 i believe.
has a much better drinkablilty, the one last year was much more sweet.
try rousing the yeast and bringing the temp up a bit, hopefully you can get the yeast active again and bring your gravity down a few points.
just an FYI, last year i made the extract version, this year was all grain.

 

[Docjowles]

We need more details to help figure out what happened.

* Could you post the recipe (or link to the kit if it was a kit)?
* Do you know what temperature it fermented at? And was that constant or did it swing throughout the day?
* How did you decide it was "done"? 4 days is possible but very fast
* What yeast did you use and how, if at all, did you prep it before pitching?

 

[kd7enm]

Ok, here's the recipe:

8lb Dark malt extract
1/2lb 120L crystal malt
3/4lb roasted barley
1/4lb chocolate malt
2 oz Perle Hops (1.5oz @60min, .5oz @10min)
White labs Irish Ale yeast (liquid)
1tsp irish moss
3tsp gypsum

3/4 cup corn sugar for bottle priming

I pitched the yeast in at 80F. It fermented about 72f-76f. It bubbled pretty good for the first few days. Eventually it was down to once every 3 minutes. I was then advised to transfer it to a "secondary fermenter". I took a reading of 1.026 at that point. I don't recall it bubbling at all while in the secondary. Now 11 days later it was about the same, 1.024. So I bottled it.

Hope this helps.

-Tyler

 

[dcp27]

congrats on your first brew! unfortunately though, it sounds like you made a few mistakes along the way:

First off, my OG was 1.060, and FG is about 1.024. Does this sound right? I kind of assumed that it would be a little lower, like 1.014? It only took about 4 days to finish fermenting. Its been sitting in a second fermenter for about 11 days, and I just bottled it tonight.

while 4 days is in some cases enough to finish fermenting, bubbling is not a good indicator of activity. this is pretty evident in the fact that your brew dropped a few more points after racking. however, because this was under-pitched and an extract recipe, 1.024 is a possible FG. also, just because the yeast were done eating sugar, doesn;t mean the yeast were done working. there are tons of side-products that the yeast clean up after, in the future give it more time, like 3-4 weeks in the primary. also, you can skip the secondary when going this short.

Second, since I made a stout, I expected the final alcohol content to be higher. Isn't that the definition of a stout (a high alcohol porter)?

thats a misnomer. dry stout is one of the smallest beers.

I pitched the yeast in at 80F. It fermented about 72f-76f. It bubbled pretty good for the first few days. Eventually it was down to once every 3 minutes.

you fermented too hot. anything above 70F and you will get extra esters and risk creating fusel alcohols. in certain beers these qualities are looked for and enjoyed so its not such a bad thing, but they do take time to fade if you dont like them. patience is a very needed virtue when it comes to brewing. hope this helps for future brews.

 

[kd7enm]

Thanks for the info guys. After reading some more posts on here, I see that the secondary fermenter isn't really necessary. I was told that I needed to rack the beer off the yeast and sediment within a week after the bubbling stopped or it would pick up a white bread / yeasty bite. I think next time I will just let it set in the primary for about 3 weeks.

As far as pitching the yeast, I understand that 80f was a little high. However, the yeast said to ferment at 70f-75f. So how is anything over 70f too hot? Wouldn't that depend more on the type of yeast used and the kind of beer a person is trying to make? I understand that lagers should be fermented much colder.

I am also confused about the yeast being "under-pitched". The yeast vial I used said it was for a 5 gallon batch. If I understand correctly, using more yeast would only ferment the wort faster, possibly changing the flavor profile as well.

Another question - "DCP27" mentioned this being an extract recipe as a possible reason why I have a high FG. Do extract brews normally have a higher FG compared to all grain brews, or do extract brews require more yeast pitched?

On a side note, the beer tastes good. Its flat, and a little green, but good.

-Tyler

 

[dcp27]

As far as pitching the yeast, I understand that 80f was a little high. However, the yeast said to ferment at 70f-75f. So how is anything over 70f too hot? Wouldn't that depend more on the type of yeast used and the kind of beer a person is trying to make? I understand that lagers should be fermented much colder.

I am also confused about the yeast being "under-pitched". The yeast vial I used said it was for a 5 gallon batch. If I understand correctly, using more yeast would only ferment the wort faster, possibly changing the flavor profile as well.

Another question - "DCP27" mentioned this being an extract recipe as a possible reason why I have a high FG. Do extract brews normally have a higher FG compared to all grain brews, or do extract brews require more yeast pitched?

dunno why it said 70-75F, Irish Ale yeast's optimum is 65-68F. however, that is wort temp. was your 72-76F ambient or internal temp? active fermentation will cause the wort temp to rise 5-10F.

despite saying its good for 5gal batch, its really not. the yeast will reproduce to the appropriate size (assumming enough aeration and nutrients are supplied), but when its less than recommended you risk lower attenuation as well as more esters. check this out for future yeast pitching: http://www.mrmalty.com/calc/calc.html

as for the extract recipe, many have stated difficulty getting below 1.02 for an FG with extracts. there are also those who have not had such an issue, so take it as you will.

I don't mean to worry you about your brew, I'm sure it'll be great. these are just things to advance on it the future

 

[kd7enm]

Since this was my first batch, I assumed that I would screw up somehow. I sanitized with bleach, pitched yeast too hot, didn't pitch enough yeast (maybe), fermented too hot, transferred to secondary when I didn't need to (which probably caused stuck ferment), and started the siphon with my mouth.

After letting my beer sit in bottles for only a week, my friend wanted to try it. I told him, "Its not ready. It won't be carbonated fully, if at all". "Oh just let me try it", he says. So I let him crack open a bottle. He takes a drink. "Hmm, not bad", he says. So I yank the bottle out of his hand and try it. It's carbonated... it tastes good... wow.

I now understand why everyone say: "don't worry, don't throw it out, no matter how bad you think you messed it up."

I learned four valuable lessons:
1. Clean everything properly.
2. You don't need a secondary fermenter.
3. Watch your temperature.
4. If you screw up... relax, don't worry, have a homebrew.

Thanks for your help everyone!

-Tyler

 

[RM-MN]

If you think your stout is good now, try it in 2 months (make sure to save a couple bottles). The flavors of a stout are complex and it takes a long time for them to mature.

So what is your next beer?

 

[coastwx]

Good news it taste decent already, but it will improve a lot. I did a 10 gal Milk Stout 5 weeks ago split between two 5 gal carboys. I wanted a sample for my New Years Party, so I kegged one after 16-18 days and was surprised how tasty it was at such and early age. It finished at 1.020 by the way, which is think is ok for a milk stout. Just bottled the second batch (30 days in primary) last night and some of the bitterness from the dark malts had smoothed out a lot. I'll look forward to comparing the kegged and bottled version in a month.

 

[troub]

At the beginning of December I brewed the Midwest Irish Stout kit...it just made it to bottles this past weekend mostly because of issues with high gravity. I checked the gravity over three days after 2.5 weeks in primary, and it was holding steady at about 1.022 (from an OG of 1.045, so that was pretty bad). I rocked the carboy a bit and moved it in front of my heating vent, and got another krausen. Checked gravity again a few weeks later and it was steady at 1.018. It's supposed to be 1.012-1.014, but I figured 1.018 was about as good as I was going to get. Like yours and others, it tastes great already even though it's flat, room temp, and uncarbed. I can't wait to open up a bottle in a couple of weeks to check it.

The stout was my first brew and it tasted good all the way through. I have a 2.5 week old Nut Brown Ale in the fermenter now, and the gravity is much better on this one (OG 1.044, now at 1.014), but it tastes really rough and not at all good. I'm going on faith, then, that the countless admonitions to give it time will work out.

 

[Maxkling]

as for the extract recipe, many have stated difficulty getting below 1.02 for an FG with extracts. there are also those who have not had such an issue, so take it as you will.

I'm not quite sure how there would be a difference in attenuation between AG and extracts if your sg's are the same. IMO that would be linked to the yeast. It may just be that people who are going the all grain route have more experience with pitching rates and using yeast correctly. My gravity's have always mostly been spot on, especially fg's.

 

[troub]

I'm not quite sure how there would be a difference in attenuation between AG and extracts if your sg's are the same. IMO that would be linked to the yeast. It may just be that people who are going the all grain route have more experience with pitching rates and using yeast correctly. My gravity's have always mostly been spot on, especially fg's.

And going the extra step(s) to better control fermentation temperature, etc. I think mine stalled mostly because it got too cool. That, or I didn't properly measure the OG somehow -- I can imagine that it may have been a few points higher than I measured, either due to top-off water affecting the reading (very possible), temperature correction (again, cold top-off water affecting the temperature reading in a way that wasn't consistent throughout the wort), etc. I think several of these things, especially the idea of topping off to reach the final volume, can cause gravity issues with extract that don't really occur with all-grain. Either incompletely mixed solution causing the gravity to appear lower than it really is if thoroughly mixed, missing the correct top-off volume to end up with a slightly more concentrated solution than expected, etc. (I forgot to measure and mark the carboy BEFORE adding my wort, so I pretty much guessed the final volume based on hydro readings and what I thought it should look like -- when I racked to my measured/marked bottling bucket, it came up to about 4.75 gallons, so I think I did a good job, but who knows?)

 

[Maxkling]

Well your correct about the top off water but that has nothing to do with not hitting your fg. That would just give you a inconsistent sg "readings". If your fermentation stalled and there are still fermentable sugars, then you add your priming sugar on top of that and bottle your in a bad spot for bottle bombs. Once the yeast becomes active it will consume and can possibly overcarb depending on how much you missed your final target gravity by.

Well with extract if you follow the instructions of the recipe and use the correct amount of everything your still in a better spot than AG. With AG there are way more complicated variables rather than water measurement that can effect your efficiency and SG.

 

[dcp27]

I'm not quite sure how there would be a difference in attenuation between AG and extracts if your sg's are the same. IMO that would be linked to the yeast. It may just be that people who are going the all grain route have more experience with pitching rates and using yeast correctly. My gravity's have always mostly been spot on, especially fg's.

theres easily a difference. with AG you have control over the amount of fermentables in your batch through mash temps, with extract its whatever the manufacturer did which usually happens to be higher temps. Briess extracts for instance are only 75% fermentable, which in most cases is good enough, but with AG you can get into the 80s.

 

[Docjowles]

theres easily a difference. with AG you have control over the amount of fermentables in your batch through mash temps, with extract its whatever the manufacturer did which usually happens to be higher temps. Briess extracts for instance are only 75% fermentable, which in most cases is good enough, but with AG you can get into the 80s.

Yup. There's an entire chapter about it in Ray Daniels' "Designing Great Beers". If the extract manufacturer mashed 10 degrees higher than your AG batch, or used different grains, it could easily be very different.

You can work around it (once you've made a batch and seen how much you're off by). If your extract is too fermentable, just use less. If it's not fermentable enough, sub out some percentage of it for the same weight in table sugar.

 

[kd7enm]

If your fermentation stalled and there are still fermentable sugars, then you add your priming sugar on top of that and bottle your in a bad spot for bottle bombs. Once the yeast becomes active it will consume and can possibly overcarb depending on how much you missed your final target gravity by.

This is one thing that has me a little worried, since my FG was 1.024. Hopefully I haven't made any bottle bombs.

My next brew is going to be a wheat beer: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/wheat-beer-recipe-help-216794/

 

[kd7enm]

Tasting note: I think next time I'll add some lactose, which I hear will give it a more creamy milk-like mouth feel. I'm a big fan of Sam Adam's Cream Stout.

-Tyler