Muddled flavours

[-Liam-]

I cracked open a bottle from my third brewed IPA and after the initial pleasing aroma, I was left disappointed by the muddled flavours. None of my IPAs seem to have a clean, clear and crisp taste to them and all seem to taste 'samey'. What are the main factors that cause this to happen to the flavour? It was my first batch with proper temp control and I thought that would have made a big difference, but it doesn't seem so. I'm going to try campden tablets in my next batch and if that doesn't work I'll try mineral water (although the tap water here in Toronto is actually pretty good). Apart from those two things, I don't really know what to do. I'm bottling a Weissbier tonight and I have a milk stout in the fermenter which I'm hoping will taste better. But I'm feeling a little disheartened to brew another IPA.

 

[Yooper]

There are a couple of causes. One would be having a lot of extract in a small boil- that increases maillard reactions and would mute the hops flavor and bitterness. I assume this is an extract batch?

A small boil can be an issue with beers like IPAs as well, so try to boil as much as you possibly can so you'll have less topping up to do.

Water could be an issue. I have no idea what the water make up is in Toronto, so I couldn't even guess.

If you are going to buy water, don't buy mineral water. Buy reverse osmosis water or distilled, along with some gypsum and calcium chloride.

 

[-Liam-]

Sorry, I should have mentioned that it's all grain. I assumed that mineral water would be far better to use, but that's not the case?

 

[Yooper]

Sorry, I should have mentioned that it's all grain. I assumed that mineral water would be far better to use, but that's not the case?

No, definitely not. You ideally could get some reverse osmosis water, and build it up from there with gypsum and calcium chloride. It would be very easy to do, and we have tons of water information (and help!) in the Brew Science area of the forum.

If it's all grain, and the flavors are muddled, then it's probably due to mash pH and/or the water since there is no extract to give excess maillard reactions.

 

[-Liam-]

I did forget to put the stabiliser in my water last time but I've read on here that lot's of people seem to think that it doesn't work.
Is spring water better?

 

[Yooper]

I did forget to put the stabiliser in my water last time but I've read on here that lot's of people seem to think that it doesn't work.
Is spring water better?

No. You don't know what's in spring water. It could have a high level of bicarbonate, or none at all. When you get distilled or RO water, what's in it is pretty much "nothing", so you have a blank slate to start with.

 

[gcdowd]

I've had similar issues with IPAs, that muddled hop flavors. My IPAs did not have that crisp hop bite that I love. I suspected my mash pH was too high. I got a water report and realized that my water was fairly basic (8.1). I used a water calculator and found that my mash pH was too high. The latest IPA I brewed, I added 4 ml of lactic acid to the mash to bring my pH in line. Also added some gypsum to the boil to enhance the hop bitterness. Here's to hoping for much improvment.

 

[Nightstrife]

Another factor to consider is your serving temp a lot of different styles can change flavors at different temps... But a previously stated water profile is one of the largest contributors of flavor (by way of mash pH and alkalinity and different "stuff")
+1 to the brew science area

 

[jmark]

+1 to what these guys are saying. I'm in the Atlanta suburbs and our water is really soft and while my stouts and not-so-hop forward beers turn out fine, my IPAs basically sucked. By paying attention to the water (adding gypsum mainly) and my pH levels (mine were slightly too high in the mash) they have improved drastically. I'd definitely get a water report and see where you're at. Also, using something like BrunWater will help immensely... With it I'm hitting my desired profiles and pH values on the nose.


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