Blonde Ale Miller Lite (Really Triple Hopped)

[Schlenkerla]

I am thinking of making this recipe but I've never used amylase enzyme in a secondary fermenter. Can anyone explain why it's used in the secondary rather than the primary fermenter? Seems to me it would be most beneficial to add it shortly after clearing on top of the healthy yeast cake. Thanks.

People have done it both ways and have gotten good results. I may have stated this before in the thread. I was following the recipe by Charlie Papazian. I think the primary reason is for absolute clarity, getting the beer off the spent yeast then give the remaining yeast some scrub work to remove complex starches from the corn. One could also mash with this....

That said, at the end you want dry beer. So mash with AE, mash lower like 147F, use AE in the fermenters. You probably could skip the secondary if you let it stay in the primary for 3 weeks. Another point here to note is the use of 6-Row malt. This malt has more enzymes for use with adjuncts, so bumping the ratio of 6-row to 2-row is another option. Making a dry beer without lagering on ale yeast, AE happens to be cheap easy alternative (aside from altering the grain bill). Think of the act of lagering, slow gradual chugging of yeast to consume any resemblance of food to survive in a cold environment. In this case with the 2ndary you are doing it at room temp with an artificial boost to convert starches into sugars and letting residual yeast consume new found food.

I personally like my kegged beer without any form of yeast (based on the style of course). I don't like having a spent keg spurting yeast sediment into my faucets. I also tend to siphon to the bottom of the fermenter, inevitably I pick up some yeast, so this one I just do the 2ndary without much thought on the matter, but only on this beer style.

If the AE is not working in the 2ndary I would make sure that on future batches that the yeast is rehydrated in warm water prior to pitching. Rehydrate at 90-95F. If that is not doing it then enzyme might be bad.

My $0.02

 

[msa8967]

Has anyone made this with nottingham dry yeast? That is all I have on hand to use right now and I want to try to brew a biab stove top version of this. Would notty yeast be ok to use?

 

[Schlenkerla]

I would think it's ok. I believe other's have used notty.

 

[Fredderick]

Any idea what the optimal water profile looks like for this Miller lite clone... And piss water is not the answer I am looking for

Thanks!

 

[Fredderick]

Any idea what the optimal water profile looks like for this Miller lite clone... And piss water is not the answer I am looking for

Thanks!

Any suggestions

 

[kpr121]

Serving this up at a "snow-ball" softball tournament benefit for breast cancer tomorrow. Tons of softball teams so there are plenty of BMC drinkers. I'll report back with how quick the keg kicks!

 

[Fredderick]

Serving this up at a "snow-ball" softball tournament benefit for breast cancer tomorrow. Tons of softball teams so there are plenty of BMC drinkers. I'll report back with how quick the keg kicks!

What did your water profile look like... Soft, hard?

 

[kpr121]

Honestly I don’t know, I have a wards lab sampling kit on its way to my house though!

I seem to think its on the hard side but not too bad. We get some minor scaling on our faucets and such but its not as bad as some places we have lived/been.

 

[Schlenkerla]

Any idea what the optimal water profile looks like for this Miller lite clone... And piss water is not the answer I am looking for

Thanks!

Any suggestions

What did your water profile look like... Soft, hard?

My water has always been soft carbon filtered water.

Look at this link.

http://www.howtobrew.com/section3/chapter15-2.html

I think my water was like London .

 

[kpr121]

Hmm… I will know for sure in a couple week, but just based off those descriptions and the styles of beer that tend to turn out best (dark, malty stouts and porters) I would seem to think my beer more closely represents London or Edinbaugh too!

I cant wait for my water report. I feel like I will then have ultimate control of my beers! BWAHAHWHA!

 

[Schlenkerla]

Ok - I am home now..... Mine is like Burton On Trent....

Burton-on-Trent - Compared to London, the calcium and sulfate are remarkably high, but the hardness and alkalinity are balanced to nearly the degree of Pilsen. The high level of sulfate and low level of sodium produce an assertive, clean hop bitterness. Compared to the ales of London, Burton ales are paler, but much more bitter, although the bitterness is balanced by the higher alcohol and body of these ales.

No matter what the water, my ML Clone tasted damn good and better than Miller Lite any day.

 

[Fredderick]

Ok - I am home now..... Mine is like Burton On Trent....

No matter what the water, my ML Clone tasted damn good and better than Miller Lite any day.

Thank you!

 

[-MG-]

Schlenkerla -

Not being familiar with AE or ever used it before. What is the benefit to adding it to the mash as well? How much do you add for your batch size? What can you expect?

Also, have you tried not dry hopping it? If you are thinking about using this beer for your bum friends who just want to play beer pong, would skipping a dry hop make sense?

 

[msa8967]

Seems that my carboy has developed a big crack in the bottom and needs to be replaced. Is there a recommended way to add the AE to the primary fermentor at 2 weeks?

 

[Schlenkerla]

Schlenkerla -

Not being familiar with AE or ever used it before. What is the benefit to adding it to the mash as well? How much do you add for your batch size? What can you expect?

Also, have you tried not dry hopping it? If you are thinking about using this beer for your bum friends who just want to play beer pong, would skipping a dry hop make sense?

You can get better mash efficiency or a higher starting gravity before boiling. I would just add 1 teaspoon per 5 gallons of mash liquor.

If you want it cheaper you can leave the dry hopping out, especially if they may not like it that much or the taste of hops period. If you plan to drink a bunch of you might do so. You'll like it either way. It just might be easier to leave it off and use your hops for something else. Especially if you have pellets to use. Leaf hops are better for dry hopping due the less particles in the 2ndary as pellets tend to break up into a powdery sediment. Leaf hops either float or sink, and they are virtually no problem during racking.

Seems that my carboy has developed a big crack in the bottom and needs to be replaced. Is there a recommended way to add the AE to the primary fermentor at 2 weeks?

Pop off the cap and add it with a funnel and spoon. If you have some distilled water you could re-hydrate it with something like a 1/4 cup of ambient distilled water and pour it into your fermenter. I think either way would work, the reconstituted method might be dissolve in quicker. The later is the way I would do it so you would not have to think of mixing it at all.

 

[-MG-]

Brewed this last night. Did a little better than my numbers with adding the AE to mash. I accomplished 89% efficiency (normal around 85% for me). I mean't to add some crystal 10L to darken it but forgot!

I repitched some washed yeast from a blonde ale I made before (us-05) and checked this morning and while not a lot of activity yet, the blow off tube did give me a bubble. I expected those guys to get moving quicker since it was plenty of yeast slurry.

The only thing I am worried about is my last batch had pentainedione, which is a honey like and buttery taste (but very mild). I've had this issue with some of my batches so this time I did aerate the wort with 100% oxygen to hopefully help the yeasties and I'm wondering if the AE would clean that up too? We'll see, I'm excited for this!

 

[qrb912]

It sure is...LOL They use the same hopps 3 times. LOL

 

[Schlenkerla]

Brewed this last night. Did a little better than my numbers with adding the AE to mash. I accomplished 89% efficiency (normal around 85% for me). I mean't to add some crystal 10L to darken it but forgot!

I repitched some washed yeast from a blonde ale I made before (us-05) and checked this morning and while not a lot of activity yet, the blow off tube did give me a bubble. I expected those guys to get moving quicker since it was plenty of yeast slurry.

The only thing I am worried about is my last batch had pentainedione, which is a honey like and buttery taste (but very mild). I've had this issue with some of my batches so this time I did aerate the wort with 100% oxygen to hopefully help the yeasties and I'm wondering if the AE would clean that up too? We'll see, I'm excited for this!

The AE if used in the secondary will clean up complex sugars that are in adjuncts corn, rice, oats, and wheat.

As for other types of off flavors I can't say it will do anything. But, ferment then secondary, prime and age. That said, cold or warm aging can work miracles.

So be sanitary, methodical and have patience. You will make defect free beer most of the time.

I'm sure you know this since you are an AG'r. Doesn't hurt to remind yourself of this.

This beer will have weird carbonic and patched taste after kegging. If you bottle and drink right away you might taste residual AE. This is the parched taste that disappears in days.

Hope you like it.

 

[Fredderick]

Miller Lite Clone - Triple Hopped - AG

A ProMash Recipe Report

Recipe Specifics
----------------

Batch Size (Gal): 5.00 Wort Size (Gal): 5.00
Total Grain (Lbs): 5.50
Anticipated OG: 1.030 Plato: 7.68
Anticipated SRM: 2.0
Anticipated IBU: 17.0
Brewhouse Efficiency: 75 %
Wort Boil Time: 90 Minutes

Pre-Boil Amounts
----------------

Evaporation Rate: 18.00 Percent Per Hour
Pre-Boil Wort Size: 6.85 Gal
Pre-Boil Gravity: 1.022 SG 5.64 Plato

Grain/Extract/Sugar

% Amount Name Origin Potential SRM
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
36.4 2.00 lbs. Pale Malt(2-row) America 1.036 2
31.8 1.75 lbs. Pale Malt(6-row) America 1.035 2
31.8 1.75 lbs. Flaked Corn (Maize) America 1.040 1

Potential represented as SG per pound per gallon.

Hops

Amount Name Form Alpha IBU Boil Time
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
0.60 oz. Cascade Pellet 5.75 17.0 60 min.
1.00 oz. Cascade - Iowa Whole 5.75 0.0 0 min.
1.00 oz. Cascade - Iowa Whole 5.75 0.0 Dry Hop

Extras

Amount Name Type Time
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
1.00 Tsp Amylase Enzyme 14 Days( 2ndary fermenter)

Yeast
-----

Fermentis US-05 Safale (For Summer brewing)
Chuck's version calls for Wyeast 2007


Mash Schedule
-------------

Mash Type: Single Step

Grain Lbs: 5.50
Water Qts: 7.43 - Before Additional Infusions
Water Gal: 1.86 - Before Additional Infusions

Qts Water Per Lbs Grain: 1.35 - Before Additional Infusions

Saccharification Rest Temp : 147 Time: 90
Mash-out Rest Temp : 175 Time: 10
Sparge Temp : 175 Time: 10

Total Mash Volume Gal: 2.30 - Dough-In Infusion Only

All temperature measurements are degrees Fahrenheit.

Notes
-----

The enzyme goes in the 2ndary - DON'T FORGET THIS!!!!

The enzyme makes it dry, so its clean and crisp, plus it boosts the alcohol.

I needed a blow-off on my secondary. It bubbled like crazy for a week.

Awards
------

Served two types at the Des Moines Jimmy Carter Happy Hour both types lasted about 75 minutes.

1st Batch All Cascade

2nd Batch Combination of German Noble Hops

Extract Version:

The book has an extract recipe if you want to try this. To me its not really the same thing since it uses rice. I have not made the extract version. It prolly very close to being more like Bud Light. If you use the AE in the 2ndary it will be very clean and crisp. Beginners should use the S-05 ale yeast ferment as normal with a 2ndary, and then cold condition the bottles for several weeks 3-6 weeks.

I am brewing this tomorrow... I am using Wyeast 2007...my first lager

I was wondering what temp I need to get my wort in order to pitch the lager yeast... I will ferment at 52...

Also, any idea how a starter made from Pilsen light dme will affect the overall flavor of the beer... It's only a 1.2 liter starter

Thanks

 

[Schlenkerla]

A starter that size is not a problem. Let your beer ferment at the yeast mfg'r recommended median fermentation temps until it's going full bore for a few days then let it run out at the low end of the recommended temp. Roughly for three weeks.

You should read the on line website http://www.howtobrew.com

Look at making your first lager.

 

[Fredderick]

A starter that size is not a problem. Let your beer ferment at the yeast mfg'r recommended median fermentation temps until it's going full bore for a few days then let it run out at the low end of three recommended temp. Roughly three weeks.

You should read the on line website http://www.howtobrew.com

Look at making your first lager.

Thank you for the help

 

[Fredderick]

Brewed this today... I have never done a 90 minute boil and miscalculated the evaporation rate... Started with 7.34(ish) gallons, hoping for 5.5 after 90 Minutes... Ended up with 4.75 gallons. Subsequently I missed my target OG of 1.031 and it's at 1.035.

Oh well, next time I will plan for more evaporation.

Quick question on the fermentation of this using Wyeast 2007, lager yeast. I know you are supposed to do a diacetyl rest at 75% fermentation. Is there a general rule for the amount of time it will take to get to 75% fermented?

I was wondering if anyone knows this so I don't have to open this every day and check the gravity.

If it helps, it's fermenting at 52 degrees.

Thanks

 

[Schlenkerla]

If you want to be precise on the 75% rule of thumb you would need to check the gravity.

I personally do not like opening a fermenter unless really necessary. For the diacetyl rest, I would let it come back to room temp before its been laggering too long. Let the yeast finish up at your original fermentation temperature.

So ferment for three or four days, lager about two to three weeks then use the last week to finish at pre lager temps.

If you do this, I think you will be ok.

 

[Fredderick]

If you want to be precise on the 75% rule of thumb you would need to check the gravity.

I personally do not like opening a fermenter unless really necessary. For the diacetyl rest, I would let it come back to room temp before its been laggering too long. Let the yeast finish up at your original fermentation temperature.

So ferment for three or four days, lager about two to three weeks then use the last week to finish at pre lager temps.

If you do this, I think you will be ok.

Thank you... Just so I can clear you would do the diacetyl rest roughly 3 weeks into the ferment (assuming I keep it at 52 degrees for three weeks?)

Sorry... Again, a bit of a noobie when it comes to lager yeast

 

[shadows69]

I always do a d-rest about 10 days from putting in the primary. Works for me . Some larger yeast will take longer. D-rest for at least 48 hours. That's my general rule of thumb.

 

[Fredderick]

I always do a d-rest about 10 days from putting in the primary. Works for me . Some larger yeast will take longer. D-rest for at least 48 hours. That's my general rule of thumb.

Perfect... I will try that

 

[DoctorDuvel]

I brewed a version of this a week from yesterday. I used 3.5# domestic two-row and 3# German Pilsner. Triple hopped with Liberty, 1/2 ounce each at FWH (90 min), 30 and 0. OG was around 1.032, IBU about 20. Used WY2007. Just took a sample, it's currently around 1.010 and tastes great - like if someone handed me a pint of what I just tasted, I'd be happy - it's like a light German pilsner, in aroma and flavor. At this point, I don't care if it gets down to 1.000, and I'm not sure if I'll want to add the AE.

Thanks for the inspiration, Schlenkerla!

 

[Schlenkerla]

I am glad you are inspired! The gratification will continue as you share this with friends.

I would stay the course with the AE so it dries out and maximizes your ABV.

It will only get better with more time.

Cheers.

 

[DoctorDuvel]

Alright, you twisted my arm, I'll do the AE!

 

[msa8967]

I forgot to add the AE and now the beer has been in the primary for 3 weeks. Should I just add the AE now or skip it.