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Blonde Ale Miller Lite (Really Triple Hopped)

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verboten

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I'll be using gluco on this pretty soon. It's what I have, and will get it to ferment dry, maybe even a little more dry, which I love anyway.
 

cmac62

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@Schlenkerla , you spec "amylase enzyme" and @Brooothru used glucoamylase
I can buy either enzyme and I'm wondering if it matters.
They appear to be the alpha vs beta amylase (amylase vs glucoamylase) but I'm not entirely certain.
The gluco will make it even drier because it will break down all of the complex sugars instead of just the 4 chain. This is what I have read anyway. The brut IPA thread suggests using the gluco specifically because of this. :mug:
 

MyQuL

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Another great thing about this recipe is that, because the grain bill is so small it makes for a perfect maxi-biab for stove top brewers like me. My version had an OG of 1.027, so I just used the grain bill amount for 23L but made it like I normally make my 12L batches(so it fitted easily into my 15L pot), then just diluted it down to the correct gravity in the FV
 

Lax coach

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I normally don't secondary--is that a requirement for this recipe, or can I just add the AE at the end of primary fermentation? I use SS Brewbuckets, and generally cold crash for 3-7 days after completing primary, then keg for carbonation.

I do have spare kegs if secondary-ing is necessary. If so, is there a risk with leaving it in secondary with the AE longer than 14 days? Thinking about brewing this about a week before going on a 2.5 week vacation, and transfer/carb when I get back.
 

balrog

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I am very much wondering the same thing--whether I can just dump the AE into the primary at the appropriate time.
 

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I normally don't secondary--is that a requirement for this recipe, or can I just add the AE at the end of primary fermentation? I use SS Brewbuckets, and generally cold crash for 3-7 days after completing primary, then keg for carbonation.

I do have spare kegs if secondary-ing is necessary. If so, is there a risk with leaving it in secondary with the AE longer than 14 days? Thinking about brewing this about a week before going on a 2.5 week vacation, and transfer/carb when I get back.
I brewed this on Sunday and I am just pitching the ae directly into primary tonight. Secondary definitely not worth the risk for me. I've always had luck with ae and the gluco ae in primary and let it finish there
 

verboten

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No pictures yet, as it was barely cold in the cooler, but it sure is tasty. I’ll be doing it again. I think this will come out nice after a couple weeks in the fridge.


I did use glucoamylase in mine, the dry hopped a couple days later to avoid any possible bio haze from active fermentation.
 

cmac62

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I brewed this a month or so ago and it is definitely a great drinking beer. Super light and tasty. I just put the AE in at yeast pitch and it came in at 1.002. Dry enough for me. LOL :mug:
 

bwible

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https://byo.com/article/understanding-enzymes-homebrew-science/

“Alpha amylase is the enzyme responsible for breaking large, complex, insoluble starch molecules into smaller,soluble molecules. It is stable in hot, watery mashes and will convert starch to soluble sugars in a temperature range from 145° to 158° F. It requires calcium as a co-factor.

Beta amylase is the other mash enzyme capable of degrading starch. Through its action, it is the enzyme largely responsible for creating large amounts of fermentable sugar. It breaks starch down systematically to produce maltose.

Beta amylase is active between 131° and 149° F. But like all enzymes, its activity reaches a peak, declines, and then drops precipitously as temperature increases. The rate is also dependent on the amount of enzyme present. It takes time for all of the enzyme to be destroyed, but what is still intact works very quickly. So as the mash temperature approaches 149° F, beta amylase is operating at its fastest rate but it is also being denatured.”

So what does anybody believe they are accomplishing by adding enzymes to a secondary fermenter at room temperature? Enzymes are naturally present in the malted barley (which is why we mash around 150-155, to get a compromise temperature where these 2 enzymes function) and if you add extra enzymes, they are supposed to be used in the mash as they work at higher temperatures. I don’t know that adding enzymes to a secondary fermenter at room temperature or below accomplishes anything
 

balrog

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Amylase enzyme is purportedly active between 0°C and 100°C, albeit very little at 0° and very little before denaturing at 100°C; it's *MOST* active in a certain temp range, but it's not completely inactive at other temps.
 

verboten

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Enzyme absolutely works in the fermenter.
My Brut went to 0.998 with enzyme only in the fermenter.
 
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JM-brew

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I used the LD Carlson glucoamylase (had some leftover from a brut ipa). I used 1/8 tsp. in a 1.5 gallon batch toward the end of primary fermentation and finished at .998. It's been lagering for a few weeks now so I'm excited to taste it, but it already was tasting pretty good going into the keg.
 
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Schlenkerla

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https://byo.com/article/understanding-enzymes-homebrew-science/

“Alpha amylase is the enzyme responsible for breaking large, complex, insoluble starch molecules into smaller,soluble molecules. It is stable in hot, watery mashes and will convert starch to soluble sugars in a temperature range from 145° to 158° F. It requires calcium as a co-factor.

Beta amylase is the other mash enzyme capable of degrading starch. Through its action, it is the enzyme largely responsible for creating large amounts of fermentable sugar. It breaks starch down systematically to produce maltose.

Beta amylase is active between 131° and 149° F. But like all enzymes, its activity reaches a peak, declines, and then drops precipitously as temperature increases. The rate is also dependent on the amount of enzyme present. It takes time for all of the enzyme to be destroyed, but what is still intact works very quickly. So as the mash temperature approaches 149° F, beta amylase is operating at its fastest rate but it is also being denatured.”

So what does anybody believe they are accomplishing by adding enzymes to a secondary fermenter at room temperature? Enzymes are naturally present in the malted barley (which is why we mash around 150-155, to get a compromise temperature where these 2 enzymes function) and if you add extra enzymes, they are supposed to be used in the mash as they work at higher temperatures. I don’t know that adding enzymes to a secondary fermenter at room temperature or below accomplishes anything
FTR - I'm the OP.

Not sure your intent is to informative or you're just being inquisitive. Welcome either way.

The grain bill is partially corn. I'm not sure of the enzymes in flaked corn or rice. The enzymes help with residual adjunct sugars. Yes it can be done in the mash or the fermenter. Hence the recommendation of using 6 row. 6-Row is higher in enzymes than other barley types. It's good grain to use with high adjunct amounts in the grain bill.

This beer typically has a corn taste at racking time. The enzyme helps crank down the last few gravity points.

This recipe is rather old. Dating back to the 1980s or 1990s. Not sure how many homebrewers did detailed step mashes for maximum extraction. Also the quality of the grain may not have been as fully modified as they are now at the homebrew level. Then the available yeast strains with high attenuation.

Anyhow it I know it works. The beer is dry as can be without the need for lagering. Especially if you don't have the capability and like to use common ale yeasts.

One last addition. The fermentation activity looks slightly different in a glass carboy. In a dark location, when you add a flashlight to the carboy one can see thousands of tiny bubbles rising ever so slowly.
 
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Sauls

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Great to hear from the OP! Celebrity of sorts. Week 3 of mine and def tasted corn at week 2 but followed the original recipe and can’t wait for next weekend.
 
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Schlenkerla

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Enzyme absolutely works in the fermenter.
My Brut went to 0.998 with enzyme only in the fermenter.
I've made Saisons very dry with sugar to crank down to zero. Who wants to add a bunch of sugar to session beer? It cheapens the beer unnecessarily.

Hm. "Alpha Amylase Formula", what I found and got after quick search, 1lb, is 96% dextrose.
Is this the right stuff or should I have gotten the little bottle?
Didn't know that... Guess I never really researched it though. Thanks. Using one teaspoon adds to the original gravity so slightly, takes away from the final gravity and adds 1.1% ABV @ 1.030 OG.
 
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verboten

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This only lasted 6 days at my house. This is the next 10 gallon batch I'll be doing.

I don't one how you guys get weeks of it. [emoji482]
 

MyQuL

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As others have noted the amylase makes this beer very clear almost like it's been filtered. Another thing I've noticed is if you normally get chill haze like I do (as I'm a no chiller), you dont with this beer as the amylase seems to drag the chill haze forming proteins out of the beer.

I also noticed my beer needed about two months to smooth out. It had a bit of an odd taste (not sure what from, I used rice not maize so not maize) but that went away after a couple of months
 

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I'm thinking about brewing this weekend and using this recipe as a base for a Berlinervise style using a little acidulated malt. Anyone ever try this. I was also thinking this may be a good foil for juniper or other gruit like addition. Comments would be appreciated.
 

balrog

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I'm thinking about brewing this weekend and using this recipe as a base for a Berlinervise style using a little acidulated malt. Anyone ever try this. I was also thinking this may be a good foil for juniper or other gruit like addition. Comments would be appreciated.
Well I finally made it, used "Alpha Amylase Formula" the 1 teaspoon, but tossed in fermenter rather than rack to secondary onto it, day #11 after pitch, used Notty, ambient 65, Falconers Flight at 10 and 0, only 10m boil, dry hop falconers flight day #19, keg day #21. Lot going on there, several nonstandard things. I am letting it sit now, can't get to it for another two weeks anyway, sitting in 40-60 hatchway (no keezer space but it's cooling here in the northeast).

All that having been said, I think it would be good for juniper as that would pop nicely. I am waiting like @MyQuL as the kegging-time flavor was hard to describe but I want to wait until cold and carbed to assess.
 

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I like the way you did this and think I'll copy your methodology. Good call on letting the amylo go for a few weeks just to make sure it gets everything converted and fermented.

The only time I brewed with amylo I pitched a diastaticus yeast (OYL-501) in a Brut PA and it took nearly a month for it to finish.....AT 0.997! Crisp and dry, and placed 1st in Category 34 Experimental recently.

I think I'll 'borrow' your process with this recipe, up the hops with Idaho 7 only, and pitch some Notty. Should make a good Dry IPA.

Brooo Brother
 

Brooothru

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I like the way you did this and think I'll copy your methodology. Good call on letting the amylo go for a few weeks just to make sure it gets everything converted and fermented.

The only time I brewed with amylo I pitched a diastaticus yeast (OYL-501) in a Brut PA and it took nearly a month for it to finish.....AT 0.997! Crisp and dry, and placed 1st in Category 34 Experimental recently.

I think I'll 'borrow' your process with this recipe, up the hops with Idaho 7 only, and pitch some Notty. Should make a good Dry IPA.

Brooo Brother
Oops. I conflated alpha amylase with amyloglucodaise. Didn't mean to hijack the thread (just the recipe).
 

verboten

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Shared this for my neighborhood Halloween crawl. Killed a half keg of it. I'm glad I made the 10 gallon batch this time.
 

cmac62

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I have the ingredients for next weekend. I think I'll add a few ounces of juniper berries crushed at about 15-10 mins left in the boil. Either that or a vodka tincture, that does provide more control.
 

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I've read every post on this thread and am extremely impressed with all of you guys and gals. Thank you Schlenkerla for posting this recipe!

I just have a couple quick questions about brewing the extract recipe. Schlenkerla, you wrote that using the rice will make it more like Bud Light. I'm not really a fan of Bud Light but do like Miller Lite when I'm not drinking IPAs. You also mentioned to someone that maybe use your other recipe called, "Millerbrau."

If I want a beer to taste similar to Miller Lite and definitely not Bud Light, and with a bit of citrus hops (I usually like cascade), what do you think I should use for extract?


If you suggest the original extract recipe, it looks like I can get the Rice Syrup Solids and the Munton & Fison (UK) Extra Light DME in powder form. Is that what your extract is calling for?
 
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Schlenkerla

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I've read every post on this thread and am extremely impressed with all of you guys and gals. Thank you Schlenkerla for posting this recipe!

I just have a couple quick questions about brewing the extract recipe. Schlenkerla, you wrote that using the rice will make it more like Bud Light. I'm not really a fan of Bud Light but do like Miller Lite when I'm not drinking IPAs. You also mentioned to someone that maybe use your other recipe called, "Millerbrau."

If I want a beer to taste similar to Miller Lite and definitely not Bud Light, and with a bit of citrus hops (I usually like cascade), what do you think I should use for extract?


If you suggest the original extract recipe, it looks like I can get the Rice Syrup Solids and the Munton & Fison (UK) Extra Light DME in powder form. Is that what your extract is calling for?


I'm drawing a blank on the Millerbrau idea. It's been awhile though. Can you direct me to that post. Maybe it will jog my memory.

I would use extra light extract with rice syrup if you can get it easily.

I've done one 3.3lbs of Extra Light LME and 1lb of Extra Light DME. Then did German Hop additions at 60, 5 and 0 minutes. Hop to an 18 IBU Target. Pitch S05. That will get you a decent and easy extract. I typically pitch the enzyme at the 2ndary. Let it sit for a week or two then bottle or keg.
 

fendersrule

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Have you guys tried to up the grain a little bit on this? Seems like the ABV is a bit low, even for a miller light. A Miller light is 4.2%, not 3.9%.

Has anyone tried to up the ABV in this to about 4.5-5%?
 

verboten

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My last run was a double batch on a new system. You name it, I screwed it up. It's more like 6% and people love it.
 

fendersrule

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Another question: I plan to do all of this in a primary. All good?

I suppose I would let it ferment for 10 days.....then add 1 tsp of ezyme, then let it go for another 10 days, then bottle?
 

verboten

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Another question: I plan to do all of this in a primary. All good?

I suppose I would let it ferment for 10 days.....then add 1 tsp of ezyme, then let it go for another 10 days, then bottle?
It turns out just fine that way. I just add enzyme when I pitch.
It was the same as when I followed the posted procedure.
 
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fendersrule

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I like that idea more. Cuts down on the time. Does Enzyme need to be "mixed in" or is it good to go. Suppose it wouldn't hurt to "shake" it, then pitch since you need to shake anyways.

What's a good water profile to use for this on Bru'nWater?
 

balrog

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I used water with 50 Ca 50 Cl 85 SO4, target 5.4 pH
I added enzyme day 11 by opening bucket and sprinkling on surface, no mix
Day 19 I added 1 oz falcflight dry hop
Day 21 I kegged (and learnt the hazards of not crashing -- dry hop clogging everything)
Went 1.038 to 1.005
It was a very decent summer beer
 
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