Metallic taste in my brew

[mattsmitty]

Hey guys, so this is my 5th brew and i was expecting it to be good based on the results from my previous brews. everything went great on brew day and its been in the carboy for a week now. i took a sample last night to get a gravity reading and its down to 1.010. i drank the sample and it has a strong metallic taste. it pretty much overpowers the beer. What could have caused this? never had this taste in my other beers. i brewed a honey blonde ale. i used 7lbs 2row, .5 lb honey malt, 1 lb flaked wheat and .5 lb caravienna. i also used warrior hops. the only thing i can think of is i pitched what ended up being dead yeast and repitched with wyeast american ale II. could dead yeast give this taste? is there a way to try and fix this while its fermenting? anything i can add to the fermenter?

 

[Grippe]

What type of equipment did you use? Aluminum pot for the boil? If so - did you scrub it?

 

[bbohanon]

I had this happen a while back with some crappy grains that went through a crappy mill one of my brew buddies loaned me to use as my grain mill was on the fritz. Not sure if this is your case, but time healed it to a semi-drinkable state(took almost 2 months in the bottle) but it was still there. I would not even give it away. I forced myself to drink it. :-(

 

[mattsmitty]

i did use an aluminum pot for the boil, but i have always used the same pot without this issue before. And i always let it soak in an oxyclean/water solution over night then rinse heavily and spray down with star san before use. The honey malt, caravienna and malted wheat a friend gave me. im wondering if maybe the malts he gave me where old and maybe that caused this metallic taste. I guess ill let it sit a good long while and see if the taste dies down some.

 

[Shred]

I think metallic flavors are general the result of... well.. metal. Aluminum scrubbed to a shine can do this or any rusty equimpent that comes in contact with your wort and ingredients. If you're using shiny aluminum do a full rolling boil of water in it for a while. The dark gray oxidization that occurs will protect your beer from off flavors.

 

[mattsmitty]

i dont "scrub" the inside of my aluminum pot. it has already become a dark grey on the inside from using it and i have not scrubed the inside. i normally just let it soak with oxyclean and water over night then rinse a few times and then let soak with star san a while before the next use. maybe i just need to get a stainless steel kettle whenever i get the chance.

 

[Shred]

Hmm.. you got me then. I use an aluminum turkey fryer setup and don't have an issue that I've noticed. Come to think of it... one of my very first brews had a metallic taste to it. I blamed the tap water. After installing a filter I never tasted it again.

 

[nmenninga]

Could be poorly stored grain. Palmer mentions lipid hydrolysis, whatever that might be.

I'd give it time, choke it down, and go with fresh grain in the future.

I made an IPA once with some ancient citra hops a buddy found cleaning out his freezer. Never again. Thank goodness it was only 3 gallons. Can you say, 'Hawaiian Punch'?

 

[mattsmitty]

Yeah its a five gallon batch so im gonna make my self choke it down haha, ill give it another week in the fermenter then bottle and give it a good month and see if the metallic taste dies down some, then drink em. Ill for sure be using fresh grains for now on, not taking anymore "left overs" from friends unless i know for sure they are fresh.

 

[insanim8er]

From how to brew:

Metallic
Metallic flavors are usually caused by unprotected metals dissolving into the wort but can also be caused by the hydrolysis of lipids in poorly stored malts. Iron and aluminum can cause metallic flavors leaching into the wort during the boil. The small amount could be considered to be nutritional if it weren't for the bad taste. Nicks and cracks ceramic coated steel pots are a common cause as are high iron levels in well water. Stainless steel pots will not contribute any metallic flavors. Aluminum pots usually won't cause metallic flavors unless the brewing water is alkaline with a pH level greater than 9. Shiny new aluminum pots will sometimes turn black when boiling water due to chlorine and carbonates in the water.

The protective (grayish) oxides of aluminum can be enhanced by heating the clean pot in a dry oven at 250°F for about 6 hours.

I've also heard people getting metallic taste from extracts, but I don't see that you used any.

 

[PDX_T]

the only thing i can think of is i pitched what ended up being dead yeast and repitched with wyeast american ale II. could dead yeast give this taste? is there a way to try and fix this while its fermenting? anything i can add to the fermenter?

That's too bad about the dead yeast. Autolyzed yeast taste more like soy sauce and kinda smell like a rubber eraser.

 

[neild5]

What kind of water did you use? De-ionized water can be reactive in an aluminum pot, it wants to contain ions.

 

[mattsmitty]

ive been getting filtered water from a machine at walmart that refills ur big water jugs

 

[Flask]

Do you have any of that water left? If so taste it.

 

[phuff7129]

i dont "scrub" the inside of my aluminum pot. it has already become a dark grey on the inside from using it and i have not scrubed the inside. i normally just let it soak with oxyclean and water over night then rinse a few times and then let soak with star san a while before the next use. maybe i just need to get a stainless steel kettle whenever i get the chance.

I have read that you cannot let oxyclean stand in an aluminum kettle. I am not sure why but I know I read it on HBT. You may want to look into that.

 

[mattsmitty]

Ok so i think i have figured out that my aluminum boil kettle it why my beer taste metallic. Now how do i fix it!?? i think this may have happened do to letting it sit overnight full of water and oxiclean. can i do something to fix it so i will no longer get the metallic taste?? i tried boiling water in it on my stove top but that didn't work my stove couldn't quit get it to a boil, and well i dont really wanna waste propane to boil water just to dump out unless thats my only option.

 

[insanim8er]

Ok so i think i have figured out that my aluminum boil kettle it why my beer taste metallic. Now how do i fix it!?? i think this may have happened do to letting it sit overnight full of water and oxiclean. can i do something to fix it so i will no longer get the metallic taste?? i tried boiling water in it on my stove top but that didn't work my stove couldn't quit get it to a boil, and well i dont really wanna waste propane to boil water just to dump out unless thats my only option.

I posted below about it already:

The protective (grayish) oxides of aluminum can be enhanced by heating the clean pot in a dry oven at 250°F for about 6 hours.

 

[mattsmitty]

6 hours? can i put it in the oven at 350 for less time??

 

[insanim8er]

6 hours? can i put it in the oven at 350 for less time??

Idk... That's just from palmer's book. I guessing the low heat and long time give the metal time to react.

 

[mjohnson]

You shouldn't use oxygen based cleaners on aluminum. You can continue to use aluminum, just don't do that. You can also build up the oxides by filling it with water and bringing up to heat. It will turn dark grey/black. Thats what you want. Throw that water out. You might need to do it twice.

 

[Flask]

I wouldn't use Star San on it either.

 

[malaeum]

I wouldn't use Star San on it either.

The dilute phosphoric acid in properly mixed StarSan shouldn't be an issue for Al₂O₃ (The oxide layer you see on your pot). I wouldn't think that oxyclean and other H₂O₂ evolving compounds could damage it either as oxidized aluminum (alumina, as its called) is a pretty damn stable compound. I should know, I've had to remove it many times in my role as a research scientist and it takes nasty **** to effectively strip it. The biggest advice I can offer is to not scrub it very hard, if at all. I would think that letting it sit with oxyclean over night is better than scrubbing any visible detritus off... I don't have much experience so I could be wrong here, just giving you my limited chemistry based knowledge.

I guess in summary, I would recommend extra time with oxyclean over any sort of physical scrubbing (yes, I realize that others, who might very well have more experience than I do, say otherwise, and I could be wrong). I would forego the starsan treatment as there really is no benefit there, boiling for any extended duration of time is doing all of the sanitizing you could possibly hope for and even weak acids could potentially effect the oxide (though at this dilution I would think it would take many days).

 

[insanim8er]

The dilute phosphoric acid in properly mixed StarSan shouldn't be an issue for Al₂O₃ (The oxide layer you see on your pot). I wouldn't think that oxyclean and other H₂O₂ evolving compounds could damage it either as oxidized aluminum (alumina, as its called) is a pretty damn stable compound. I should know, I've had to remove it many times in my role as a research scientist and it takes nasty **** to effectively strip it.

Im not a scientist, but my personal experience would differ from that.

A long time ago when I started out with brewing, I used my aluminum brew pot to sanitize equipment in it. It was oxidized from use. I left some starsan mixed with water (maybe it was a higher concentrate, but I basically did 2.5 gallons water and measured the appropriate amount of starsan from the bottle's measure cup) in the pot over night (I'd say less than 10hrs). Where the starsan was, the pot looked as brand new as the day I bought it. I feel it did a very effective job removing the oxidization from the pot with no scrubbing at all. As a matter of fact I remember thinking that I'd do it again if I ever sold that pot sine it looked bran new.

I thoroughly cleaned it and used it again with no ill affect to the brew.

 

[malaeum]

Im not a scientist, but my personal experience would differ from that.

A long time ago when I started out with brewing, I used my aluminum brew pot to sanitize equipment in it. It was oxidized from use. I left some starsan mixed with water (maybe it was a higher concentrate, but I basically did 2.5 gallons water and measured the appropriate amount of starsan from the bottle's measure cup) in the pot over night (I'd say less than 10hrs). Where the starsan was, the pot looked as brand new as the day I bought it. I feel it did a very effective job removing the oxidization from the pot with no scrubbing at all. As a matter of fact I remember thinking that I'd do it again if I ever sold that pot sine it looked bran new.

I thoroughly cleaned it and used it again with no ill affect to the brew.

Well there ya go! StarSan does etch your oxide layer so you should NOT use StarSan. The ill effect is somewhat sensitive to which beer you're brewing and the pH of the wort you dump into your brew kettle. Some beers are more prone to carrying such a taste though I'm not sure why.

 

[Guidry]

Could be poorly stored grain. Palmer mentions lipid hydrolysis, whatever that might be.

I'm wondering what would be considered poor storing practices. I keep my grain in buckets with gamma seal tops (pretty much air tight), but I've kept them in my garage and it can get fairly warm there.

 

[oxonbrew]

I had a similar problem in a brew a while ago and I put it down to bad water treatment. I think I'd miscalculated my additions (or taken poor readings) and the finished beer has a metallic taste and smell.

 

[Lothian]

I have used, extensively, an aluminum turkey fryer pot for brewing. No problems with metallic flavors.

I do not wash my pot. I rinse it with hot water, not soap, and scrub gently with a green scrubby pad, only if there's crap caked on the sides. (no steel wool/heavy abrasive).

For what it's worth.

 

[mattsmitty]

ok so i filled my boil kettle up with water and boiled it for an hour. now how do i know if its good to brew with now??? i dont wanna ruin another batch of beer

 

[nvious23]

ok so i filled my boil kettle up with water and boiled it for an hour. now how do i know if its good to brew with now??? i dont wanna ruin another batch of beer

If your pot is dark like the layer just above the wort line in this pot

 

[SpeedYellow]

Wait, the OP is using Starsan on his BOIL KETTLE?! Why on earth would you ever try to sanitize a boil kettle? The only thing you ever need to do with a boil kettle is a soapy sponge.