MD/DC grain

[mtbiker278]

Random thought - Are there any local breweries that we could work with for bulk grain purchase? Obviously it would have to be worth their time and effort, but I can see it working. Brewers Alley and Monocacy Brewing I would rule out cause they have an agreement with Flying barrel already I'm pretty sure. Maybe someplace further south or in DC would be willing to accommodate us. It would have to be a small operation too. I don't think place like Flying Dog would want to be bothered with it.

 

[PeteNMA]

I'm afraid that with the increase pricing I'm not going to be able to swing this right now. Baby on the way and a new house are proving a real money sink and extras sadly don't fit in right now.

WRT bulk grain, the Red Brick Station brewpub will sell grain at cost price to AHA members. I've not called them and enquired just yet but it might be a good option for those close enough.

 

[rwagner23]

Random thought - Are there any local breweries that we could work with for bulk grain purchase? Obviously it would have to be worth their time and effort, but I can see it working. Brewers Alley and Monocacy Brewing I would rule out cause they have an agreement with Flying barrel already I'm pretty sure. Maybe someplace further south or in DC would be willing to accommodate us. It would have to be a small operation too. I don't think place like Flying Dog would want to be bothered with it.

In Frederick there is a farm house brewery just opening up called Freys Brewing Company. There is also another nano called Mad Science Brewery.

Finally there is a nano in the Rockville area called Baying Hound Aleworks.

Maybe talk with them about it.

 

[lockwom]

Funny that they have a full-page advertisement in the latest Zymurgy. Perhaps they plan on having a retail front for homebrewers again, and aren't interested in competing with themselves...

Glad I got to participate in the last group buy, thanks again for the hard work Stefin. I'll surf on those grains for the year and see how the grist settles.

Definitely interested in co-op, but I don't see a point to supporting CMG should we have a formal tax system.

 

[winterc]

I just bought a tractor with forks, I can unload pallets and I have storage. I live in one of the most depressed counties in Virginia, they're happy to have any industry or business. My question is, if I had big deliveries here would anyone be willing to make the trek from DC to Cumberland Virginia and back with grain? It's a 3 hour round trip. I've already spoken to the county about opening a farm brewery, and they're on board with calling it a home based business. I wonder if TTB will be okay with it. I'm going to have to talk to some local(ish) breweries to see if I can order bulk grain through them. The HBS shops in Richmond and Charlottesville charge as much as CMG now. The last option is to find a different supplier, I'll be doing some research.

 

[HBCBrewmaster]

Hey just a thought here. Someone mentioned that NCM was bought recently. I wonder if the BIG boys have any interests here. All of us home brewers, many aspiring to open a micro brewery some day. Could be just the thing they need to hang on to their 94% market share.

 

[dcHokie]

Hey just a thought here. Someone mentioned that NCM was bought recently. I wonder if the BIG boys have any interests here. All of us home brewers, many aspiring to open a micro brewery some day. Could be just the thing they need to hang on to their 94% market share.

Country Malt Group bought BrewCraft in 2010, essentially acquiring an existing distribution channel for homebrewers.

 

[atjsparty]

I reached out to Apex Brew Wares (a homebrew shop outside of Kansas City in Missouri). I bought a few things from them on-line and follow them on Facebook. Jeremy has posted many times about doing a group by for his local market, so I followed up with him to see what he does in terms of mark-up, etc.
He responded saying he essentially does a small mark-up to cover freight and his time, while keeping the prices lower than anyone else can provide. He sees it as a win, win. He offers his customers a great deal, so they shop more often at their store and his customers obviously get grain at a cheap price.
He also noted that most shops seem to want to suck every single cent possible out of their customers.

Man...I wish we had a brewshop in our area that provided such a customer friendly service. I'd actually shop at myLHBS if they provided that service (and were helpful...and nice).

 

[Sheldon]

yo atjsparty, Derek at Jay's in Manassas is a gem. He is not out to suck every cent out of us, he is really nice and fair. Couple weeks ago I left a couple lbs of grains on the counter and he mailed them at his expense. In fact, one of the bags I had not even paid for and he did not charge me. He also has a great (10%) frequent shopper program. It may be a bit further than Falls Church, but then again you could stop off and have a brew with me or any of the other NOVA homebrewers in the Woodbridge area.

Sheldon

 

[Jayhem]

Man...I wish we had a brewshop in our area that provided such a customer friendly service. I'd actually shop at myLHBS if they provided that service (and were helpful...and nice).

Agreed. My not so local HBS charges over $2/lb for even base grain. I can order grain from many online stores and have it delivered for significantly cheaper and save a 1.5 hour round trip drive!

 

[Sheldon]

There is a micro brewery going in very close to Jay's:
http://www.badwolfbrewingcompany.com/

Might be worth at least one visit once it opens.

 

[stonebrewer]

So I just got done talking to my contact at the shipping company. If we were able to put together an 8 pallet order, shipping would end up being about what we pay now (~$6.50 a sack). We could potentially get it lower than that if we didn't need a truck with a lift gate. From what I have seen with our group, getting 2-3 pallets together is a breeze. I know I would order more if we did the buys less often, but with it being done ~ once a month, I have limited myself to 1-2 bags. If we did this quarterly, then I could see buying 2-3 bags. I think the numbers all add up. Now all we have to do is a get a tax id and have them sell to us again. I can ask the guy in Rockville if he wants to help us out or not as he is right down the street from me. Anyone in Frederick want to ask the local breweries there? DC nanos? There has got to be a way we can get back to better prices for base grains...

The coop idea is a good one, but I am pretty sure it will mean we will need a lawyer and have to pay some money up front. Anyone interested in reading up about this, I found this site: http://www.cgin.coop/how_to_start that may help. I skimmed it a bit yesterday but have not had time to dig deep yet.

 

[sweetcell]

stonebrewer - you rock. thanks for looking into shipping.

question: if we get the TIN/coop/etc set up and CMG agrees to sell to us again, will CMG be willing to ship just like the old days? do we need a new shipper? because i think their old shipping costs were reasonable. sorry if i missed this part...

i'd bet we could scrape together an 8 pallet order if we move to quarterly buys. i'll certainly be getting at least 5 bags on the next order. wall o' homer buckets...

 

[Barnesie]

Joining late, but this is a real bummer. It seems to me that the only way to really do something like this moving forward is to see if you can work with an existing brewery. Forming a co-op sounds like a really proactive way to keep the group-buy going, but I can't see that really panning out.

I wonder if a place like Lost Rhino would host a group buy if we paid in advance?

 

[claphamsa]

I missed something.... whats the concern with shipping?

 

[aaronbritton]

First off a big thanks to Stefin for organizing and providing this service to the homebrewing community. I appreciate everything you've done to make this happen for us!

Secondly, if CMG is willing to sell to us as a co-op, i'd be willing to donate money towards the legal fees of setting it up.

Stefin- what do you have as far as specialty grains go? Any star san?

 

[IslandLizard]

I missed something.... whats the concern with shipping?

FEDEX?

It wasn't clear we could still get the old shipping method per truck at $7 a sack or were forced to use Fedex instead.

 

[stonebrewer]

I was just thinking (probably poorly) that if they were not willing to ship other than UPS or Fedex anymore if there would be another way. I ship a lot of hardware at the job so I asked my contact what it would cost to ship, thinking that we could have it picked up and delivered ourselves if there was a problem. Just looking at this from all angles since we don't know what they are willing to do. You probably have a better handle on this than anyone...Anyhow, my shipper will deliver to your house for about $6.50 a sack so if we need that in our back pocket, we have it.

 

[IslandLizard]

One problem I can see by using a brewery as "our agent" for bulk buys is logistics.

The order would get dropped off at the brewery and now they have to deal with 12 or more dudes picking up their grain. Alternatively, we'll have to move the whole load to somewhere else to redistribute. Or get a drop ship in place.

 

[CidahMastah]

Hey guys - Regarding the change in pricing from NCM:

I wanted to post this up here in effort to have each group buy participant thinking about how they are spending their money. I would like to send a message to NCM for the arbitrary price change. However I can't do it alone, nor do I have the time to coordinate an effort like this. I also can't ask you all to boycott, because I know that many can't meet the price locally.

I have created this thread to post comments if you want to attempt to hash out your thoughts on NCM's business decision.

 

[claphamsa]

FEDEX?

It wasn't clear we could still get the old shipping method per truck at $7 a sack or were forced to use Fedex instead.

no change in shipping... still 295 per pallate.

 

[claphamsa]

First off a big thanks to Stefin for organizing and providing this service to the homebrewing community. I appreciate everything you've done to make this happen for us!

Secondly, if CMG is willing to sell to us as a co-op, i'd be willing to donate money towards the legal fees of setting it up.

Stefin- what do you have as far as specialty grains go? Any star san?

i have pbw, starsan, candi sugar, and carapils.

 

[aaronbritton]

I'm interested in StarSan and carapils. I'll be down that way this weekend. What day is better for you? Sat or sun?

 

[claphamsa]

sunday AM would be ideal.

 

[aaronbritton]

Noonish work?

 

[Likwid]

If there is no change in shipping then this is still better then any LHBS (IN MD/DC) or online retailer I can find.

 

[atjsparty]

I reached out to Apex Brew Wares (a homebrew shop outside of Kansas City in Missouri). I bought a few things from them on-line and follow them on Facebook. Jeremy has posted many times about doing a group by for his local market, so I followed up with him to see what he does in terms of mark-up, etc.
He responded saying he essentially does a small mark-up to cover freight and his time, while keeping the prices lower than anyone else can provide. He sees it as a win, win. He offers his customers a great deal, so they shop more often at their store and his customers obviously get grain at a cheap price.
He also noted that most shops seem to want to suck every single cent possible out of their customers.

Man...I wish we had a brewshop in our area that provided such a customer friendly service. I'd actually shop at myLHBS if they provided that service (and were helpful...and nice).

F' it, I'm moving to Kansas City. Now Apex Brew Wares is setting up a bulk White Labs yeast buy!!

 

[Likwid]

another thing I notice on the price sheet is no star san? only grain now..

 

[IslandLizard]

no change in shipping... still 295 per pallate.

Thanks, that will put some minds at ease.

Would be nice if you could get that in writing somehow, but if that's what they said, the deal may still be lucrative.

 

[jbay76]

What about Brewers Supply Group? Can we use them instead of CMG? Has anyone gone to the brewery in Rockville yet to see if they can help? If not, I can go see them this Sat in between the rugby matches and pitch the idea.