Maple sap as strike water?

[mattrettig]

Did a search, but couldn't find a reference. I'm almost done tapping my maples (got a gallon and half of syrup!) but there's still some sap running. I'm wondering if I can use this (the sap, not the syrup) as strike water for the mash, as is. Obviously I'd use regular water to sparge, as I'm trying to rinse all those nice maple sugars out of the mash. I'd check the pH of the sap first and adjust as needed. I'm thinking the maple sugar doesn't actually need to convert, as it's already a simple sugar. I figured the other alternative was to mash with regular water like normal and then just add the sap to the boil., but that would just mean a lot more boiling since the sap is like 98% water.

Any thoughts, experiences or ideas about this? Thanks all!

Matt

 

[beernut70]

Just watched this video he did an extract brew but used sap for all his water.

[ame="http://youtu.be/YXeTAbb10rE"]http://youtu.be/YXeTAbb10rE[/ame]

 

[Riot]

I like the way you think. Any possibility of doing two identical batches, one with mash water, and one with sap? I don't think you're gonna find a lot of info on this, but I can see a way to find out.

 

[mattrettig]

Thanks Beernut for the video. Since he was making an extract, that's kind of the same thing as pouring the sap straight into the boil.

And thanks Riot...I don't really have the setup to do two test batches to compare the results. I think if no one can foresee any complications (other than pH), I'm just gonna go for a full batch and see what happens. Will report back!

Unless, again, anyone sees any problems?

Matt

 

[Riot]

I can't see a bit of sugar effecting your mash, there's sugar in it by the time your temperature is stable. PH control is definitely relevant, but that's already a plan. Even doing the same recipe with the same yeast next batch would be pretty telling as far as what sap contributes to a beer.

 

[IslandLizard]

At 2% (1.020) how much of the maple flavor do you expect to shine through in the final beer?

 

[LesIsMore]

They used maple sap in an episode of basic brewing radio. I forget how it turned out.
02-19-09 Maple Sap Brewday

 

[brewkinger]

I made a batch last spring that was what I referred to as AG / maple extract.

I forget the recipe, as it was spur of the moment and I did not write it down in my exploratory ignorance.

Essentially I mashed about 4# of MO with a handful of Biscuit and CR40 and collected 3.5 gallons of runnings. (I think they were around 1.040 when I was done)
Added 4 gallons of maple sap (basically "un"extracted sugar/water)

Boiled for an hour with 1oz addition of low AA Cascade ( I think 4%)
and 0.5oz Fuggle at flameout.
My OG was somewhere around 1.055 when I checked, but alas I cracked the hydrometer when I set it down on the counter and then I became distracted.
Pitched Nottingham and fermented out to around 1.011.

I personally could taste a maple-"esque" finish to the beer, but the mind is powerful and I often wondered if it was because I wanted it to taste like that.

Several people tried the beer and could not place a maple taste, but could definitely say that there was a "sweetness" that reminded them of Aunt Jemima
(As a Vermonter, fake maple syrup is a forbidden topic and NOT allowed in my home, so it was bittersweet for me to hear this)

I thought that it was one of my best beers yet, and it took no time at all to finish off 47 bottles of it...

I always figured that using sap as my mash and sparge water would work, but also figured that some of the sugars in the sap might somehow cling to the grains and remain in the mash? Rinsing sugars with a liquid that contains sugar.... am I correct in my thinking?

 

[mattrettig]

That's why I figured I'd sparge with regular water, so as not to leave those sugars in the mash. I don't expect much of a "maple-y" flavor, I'm thinking the sugars will ferment out and boost the ABV a little.

Thanks again to everyone for the thoughts!

Matt

 

[IslandLizard]

The sparging with regular water makes sense. The concentration of sugars in the fresh wort is depending on the volume of the solvent and the amount of sugars available. It's in balance.

Would you get or retain more flavor by boiling down the maple sap and add the concentrate (maple syrup) after the primary is over? Worth an experiment.

 

[brewkinger]

The sparging with regular water makes sense. The concentration of sugars in the fresh wort is depending on the volume of the solvent and the amount of sugars available. It's in balance.

Would you get or retain more flavor by boiling down the maple sap and add the concentrate (maple syrup) after the primary is over? Worth an experiment.

I'm not a sugarer here in Vermont (yet) but the process is very time consuming with not much return.
Depending on the sap quality it can take as much as 8-10 gallons of sap to get a gallon of syrup concentrate.

How much time and propane to boil 9 gallons of syrup down to 1 gallon?
Answer: more than I am willing....



Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[IslandLizard]

I'm not a sugarer here in Vermont (yet) but the process is very time consuming with not much return.
Depending on the sap quality it can take as much as 8-10 gallons of sap to get a gallon of syrup concentrate.

How much time and propane to boil 9 gallons of syrup down to 1 gallon?
Answer: more than I am willing....

You got a valid point there.

 

[brewkinger]

You got a valid point there.

BUT.... it sells for $40-$60 per gallon for a decent grade.

So it may be a break even venture. Tank of propane (probably closer to 2) and the time invested and you could have a gallon of homemade syrup.

Sounds like an oddly familiar hobby....

 

[mattrettig]

Ok so I did it. Mashed with three gallons of sap along with some regular well water. The sap pH was like 4.5, but my well water is a little alkaline at like 7, so I figure the mash pH was about optimal. Was a normal mash & brew, so I guess I'll see in a couple weeks what effect, if any, using the sap had. I made a RyePA with about half homegrown hops (which is all I had left from last fall's harvest!)

 

[Owly055]

I'm not a sugarer here in Vermont (yet) but the process is very time consuming with not much return.
Depending on the sap quality it can take as much as 8-10 gallons of sap to get a gallon of syrup concentrate.

How much time and propane to boil 9 gallons of syrup down to 1 gallon?
Answer: more than I am willing....



Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

Try 40 gallons........... 8-10 is incredibly optimstic.......... I wouldn't call it a waste of sap.... The amount of syrup that sap would produce after the expense of boiling wouldn't amount to much....... and the energy cost of boiling it down is pretty significant. But will the subtle maple flavor come through the hops and malt? I don't think so..... It's about like squeezing flowers to make mead.........

H.W.

 

[bluemoose]

Just to chime in, I have made a few brews with sap. In the past I have boiled the sap volume down by half and used that to mash and sparge. You can then get a little beer by rinsing the grains of the sugar.
This year a friend ran the sap through a RO machine. I ended up with 20 gallons of sap with a sugar content of 15% ( specific gravity of 1.060.). I put together a couple batches thus far. One with an OG do 1.085 and the other 1.110. Lots of sugar there.

The brews in the past didn't have a maple flavor so much as a woody note. If you didn't know there was maple you not have been able to guess. Higher alcohol content, real smooth and aged really well. The changes over time were much more pronounced that other beers I had aged.


Sent from the kingdom of beer.

 

[krackin]

Try 40 gallons........... 8-10 is incredibly optimstic.......... I wouldn't call it a waste of sap.... The amount of syrup that sap would produce after the expense of boiling wouldn't amount to much....... and the energy cost of boiling it down is pretty significant. But will the subtle maple flavor come through the hops and malt? I don't think so..... It's about like squeezing flowers to make mead.........

H.W.

LOL. Nothing like having been there before.

 

[wilserbrewer]

Wanted to add, I see no problem using maple sap for the sparge as well, the sugar content iof the grain is still much higher than the sap, so it will remove the sugar from the grain and result in a higher gravity for the beer.

 

[ross_daly]

My local brewery just did this. Here is their post.
http://blog.aeronautbrewing.com/2014/04/02/a-collaborative-somerville-maple-beer/

The consensus around maple syrup seems to be that adding it to primary adds almost zero maple flavor. I'd guess that boiling with it will give you regular-flavored beer and a maple scented house, but nothing more.

Let us know how it turns out, though! I just had maple cream for the first time last month. I'm always looking for more ways to eat maple!

 

[bluemoose]

Made 4 beers this year with maple sap run through the RO machine. The gravity of the water alone was 1.06. Here is the breakdown:

Maple pale ale (9.7%)
Maple nut brown ale (10.2%)
Maple pale ale (12.1%)
Maple Belgian quad (stupid%)

The Belgian hasn't finished. The yeast took a powder after 12%. Evidently those Belgians can't hold their alcohol. I am running some WLP 099 into it to finish the job. It has the potential to finish in the 16% range.

I think next year I will get sap with a lower sugar content to start.