Man, I love Apfelwein

[Thunder_Chicken]

I have two 5 gallon batches going right now. I plan on bottling one of them after 2 months and I want to let the other bulk age for another 3 months or so. I'm thinking about racking it into another carboy after 2 months to get it off the yeast and allow it to clear even more. Should I be adding K-Meta and Sorbate to it when I rack it? If I want to back sweeten a bit, can I do it and let it age that way or is it best to back sweeten just a few days before bottling?

You should definitely add k-meta when you rack it for bulk aging to prevent oxidation. You should sorbate at the same time if you plan to backsweeten. You probably want to wait a day or two after sorbating to add the sugar to taste, and then wait a few more days after that to see if fermentation has been truly halted before bottling. I'm not sure how long you can age with sugar in solution - I would think that you would be setting up a banquet for infection bugs, but maybe the sorbate and alcohol limit that. Bottling soon after sweetening would limit the potential for infection exposure.

Having said that, some people (like me) can taste sorbate even at normal doses. It can make the wine taste like chemical candy. You might want to taste the apfelwein without sorbate - even though technically dry it tastes pretty sweet to me. It is not a puckering dryness, especially if aged. When aged the apple flavor comes out again and it really conveys a perception of sweetness. Conversely, a hint of sugar in young apfelwein (which really tastes bland and lifeless, buried under the alcohol) really makes the apple flavor pop out, but might make aged sweetened apfelwein seem too sweet.

I guess my advice is to experiment, and see what works for your taste buds. The taste definitely evolves with age.

 

[jstampler]

You should definitely add k-meta when you rack it for bulk aging to prevent oxidation. You should sorbate at the same time if you plan to backsweeten. You probably want to wait a day or two after sorbating to add the sugar to taste, and then wait a few more days after that to see if fermentation has been truly halted before bottling. I'm not sure how long you can age with sugar in solution - I would think that you would be setting up a banquet for infection bugs, but maybe the sorbate and alcohol limit that. Bottling soon after sweetening would limit the potential for infection exposure. Having said that, some people (like me) can taste sorbate even at normal doses. It can make the wine taste like chemical candy. You might want to taste the apfelwein without sorbate - even though technically dry it tastes pretty sweet to me. It is not a puckering dryness, especially if aged. When aged the apple flavor comes out again and it really conveys a perception of sweetness. Conversely, a hint of sugar in young apfelwein (which really tastes bland and lifeless, buried under the alcohol) really makes the apple flavor pop out, but might make aged sweetened apfelwein seem too sweet. I guess my advice is to experiment, and see what works for your taste buds. The taste definitely evolves with age.

Thanks. This isn't my first time making this but it would be my first time back sweetening anything. I generally don't like sweet wines but the wife thinks it could use a little sweetness added and if it will make her drink more of it, I'll do it! That's why I have 2 batches going right now, one to sweeten for her, another for me to drink dry, the way I prefer it.

Anyway, I'll add the K-Meta and Sorbate when I rack it. Any idea how much I would use of each for a 5 or 6 gallon batch?

 

[emmanuec]

Hello. I am planning to follow the original recipe with the montrachet yeast. I live in Puerto Rico. Current temps are at around 90 degrees outside ( probably 85 indoor). Should I use a water bath to lower fermentarion temps like I do for ales?

If so, what fermentation temp should I be looking for?

Thanks all for your help.

 

[Thunder_Chicken]

Thanks. This isn't my first time making this but it would be my first time back sweetening anything. I generally don't like sweet wines but the wife thinks it could use a little sweetness added and if it will make her drink more of it, I'll do it! That's why I have 2 batches going right now, one to sweeten for her, another for me to drink dry, the way I prefer it.

Anyway, I'll add the K-Meta and Sorbate when I rack it. Any idea how much I would use of each for a 5 or 6 gallon batch?

If you use Campden tablets (k-meta), one tablet per gallon. Sorbate is usually about 1/4 tsp per gallon.

You could also sweeten with Splenda, avoids fermentation issues altogether.

 

[TexasWine]

Hello. I am planning to follow the original recipe with the montrachet yeast. I live in Puerto Rico. Current temps are at around 90 degrees outside ( probably 85 indoor). Should I use a water bath to lower fermentarion temps like I do for ales?

If so, what fermentation temp should I be looking for?

Thanks all for your help.

I'd say yes, 85F is a tad warm. Sounds like you've done a water bath before with ales, so I'm curious how cool can you keep your fermentation? Given your location, I assume you use bottles of ice and don't rely on the evaporative cooling effect.

You don't necessarily need to get to ale temps for the Montrachet. Something around 70-75F would be fine. But it would also be fine to ferment in the 60s.

Lots of wiggle room with this recipe! Pretty hard to mess it up.

 

[Hello]

So dumb newbie question here, I noticed using the swamp cooler my temps were 58-60º and I read through more of this thread and realized I didn't need a swamp cooler so much as I would with beer. That said, I had some yeast in the neck of my carboy and swished the juice around, like a 5 second aeration. Is that terrible? I made this less than 12 hours ago and haven't noticed any fermentation.

I pitched the yeast dry, Lalvin 1118 wine yeast. 5 gallons of juice and 2 lb 8 oz corn sugar.

 

[snooby]

To those who are thinking about using US-05. There is some krausen, I would use a 6 gallon BB instead of a 5. There will probably be blow off with a 5 if you use US-05.

 

[emmanuec]

I'd say yes, 85F is a tad warm. Sounds like you've done a water bath before with ales, so I'm curious how cool can you keep your fermentation? Given your location, I assume you use bottles of ice and don't rely on the evaporative cooling effect. You don't necessarily need to get to ale temps for the Montrachet. Something around 70-75F would be fine. But it would also be fine to ferment in the 60s. Lots of wiggle room with this recipe! Pretty hard to mess it up.

I can usually keep them in the low 70's/high 60's if I switch ice bottles during the morning and evenings.

I will probably need to get a second water bath to ferment this one then. Do I need to place it in a dark place as I do with ales, or can I place it in an open area (like a living room)

Thanks again for your feedback.

 

[TexasWine]

I can usually keep them in the low 70's/high 60's if I switch ice bottles during the morning and evenings.

I will probably need to get a second water bath to ferment this one then. Do I need to place it in a dark place as I do with ales, or can I place it in an open area (like a living room)

Thanks again for your feedback.

Low 70s high 60s is just fine. As far a dark place goes, I'm not 100% on this but I think it will only impact the color. Beer that has hops has to be kept in a dark place because it gets skunky. Since this doesn't have hops I think you'll be fine.

 

[finsfan]

just "brewed" a batch and fit all 5 gallons of motts in, cant wait to have this in 4 months

 

[emmanuec]

just "brewed" a batch and fit all 5 gallons of motts in, cant wait to have this in 4 months

Nice i am waiting for my carboy to arrive in the mail and make my first batch.

 

[Hayseed]

Was going to read through until I noticed 1172 pages !!!!
I have 2 gal of home steamed apple juice I took out of freezer .
Will this work same as the store bought variety of apple juice ? Its not pasturized like the store type . Apples from neighbors tree , washed , chunked , tossed in steamer juicer and rendered juice out of them then put in freezer after cooling in jugs . Like to know if these will work ok and be able to bottle .
Thanks

 

[BamaProud]

It should work fine.

 

[Pomylka22]

Just cracked open a bottle thats a little over a year old and it is super!! I need to get my next batch going soon

 

[emmanuec]

Just cracked open a bottle thats a little over a year old and it is super!! I need to get my next batch going soon

Did you carb it?

 

[Pomylka22]

No. I was looking for a reason to get some more brewing toys so I didn't carb it. I think I will try a split batch with my next one though.

 

[finsfan]

Heres a picture this morning of the yeasties doing their business, not even 12 hours into pitch

 

[BamaProud]

Started a Holiday Apfelwein last night. 6 gallon batch consisting on 2 cinnamon sticks, a little nutmeg, 30 raisins, and half dark brown sugar(probably 2.5 pounds total sugar to reach 1.060 OG).

I wish I would have started it a couple of months ago...but if it needs more time come thanksgiving/Christmas, I'll just let it age until next year.

 

[Leadgolem]

Started a Holiday Apfelwein last night. 6 gallon batch consisting on 2 cinnamon sticks, a little nutmeg, 30 raisins, and half dark brown sugar(probably 2.5 pounds total sugar to reach 1.060 OG).

I wish I would have started it a couple of months ago...but if it needs more time come thanksgiving/Christmas, I'll just let it age until next year.

Good luck leaving it alone that long once you have tasted it.

That reminds me though, it should be just about time for some good apple cider to show up in stores. I'll have to start keeping an eye out for some.

 

[Wiggleplum]

Hey everyone,

Just got done bottling my first batch of anything, 5 gallons of Ed Worts Apfelwein. I siphoned it with a cane into a 5 gallon bucket, and took a reading while I was at it; 1.000 (7%). I went ahead and bottled, when I was done I drank what was in my graduated cylinder and a bit more out of a bottle, and almost instantly had an intense headache that I still have 40 minutes later (not as bad). I followed the recipe. What could be the cause? I live in the mountains, so the temp absolutely did not get over 75 at any point. Most likely stayed between 65-70 give or take. I bottled a bit short of the 4 week mark (cleared over a week ago). Is it just too young? Will it get better the longer I let it age in the bottles?

Thanks

 

[dave8274]

Not sure what else to do at this point. I have 3 batches that are all approaching 2 months the carboy. I've tried adding pectic enzyme, degassing one of them, and adding champagne yeast to 2 of them a couple weeks ago. They just aren't clearing at all. Meanwhile, I started a batch 2 weeks ago with Lalvin-1118 and that one seems to be clearing well. Any other ideas?

 

[twofocused]

Got my first 10 gallons going today. 1.10 Gravity WOAHHHH

-EC 1118 yeast to reach higher abv levels
-5 pounds cane sugar
-2 pounds light brown sugar
-yeast nutrient
-Oh yeah and 5 gallons apple juice

Can hardly wait. The plan is to age them until January or so then bottle. Let them sit in bottles a few months and then pass them out. This is going to be a hangover machine.

Thanks to everyone for answering my questions.

 

[jstampler]

Not sure what else to do at this point. I have 3 batches that are all approaching 2 months the carboy. I've tried adding pectic enzyme, degassing one of them, and adding champagne yeast to 2 of them a couple weeks ago. They just aren't clearing at all. Meanwhile, I started a batch 2 weeks ago with Lalvin-1118 and that one seems to be clearing well. Any other ideas?

I had the same thing a couple months ago. I added super-kleer and 2 weeks later it was completely clear.

 

[dave8274]

I had the same thing a couple months ago. I added super-kleer and 2 weeks later it was completely clear.

Nice, thanks, looks like my LHBS has that in stock. How did it taste?

Also, and idea why yours didn't clear? The only thing I can think of with mine is the fermenting temperature might have been a bit low (mid/high 60s) but other than that, I followed the recipe exactly, even used the same Tree-Top Apple juice.

 

[jstampler]

Nice, thanks, looks like my LHBS has that in stock. How did it taste? Also, and idea why yours didn't clear? The only thing I can think of with mine is the fermenting temperature might have been a bit low (mid/high 60s) but other than that, I followed the recipe exactly, even used the same Tree-Top Apple juice.

It turned out great once I got it cleared. It was my first batch of this stuff and I saw a couple posts where people said that they would give the carboy a little swirl once a day to keep fermentation going. I thought it was weird but it's also a very different kind of recipe so I just did it. Bad idea I guess. My second and third batches I didn't touch after pitching and they cleared perfectly on their own. Did you swirl or move yours at all?

 

[dave8274]

It turned out great once I got it cleared. It was my first batch of this stuff and I saw a couple posts where people said that they would give the carboy a little swirl once a day to keep fermentation going. I thought it was weird but it's also a very different kind of recipe so I just did it. Bad idea I guess. My second and third batches I didn't touch after pitching and they cleared perfectly on their own. Did you swirl or move yours at all?

Not for the 1st 5 or 6 weeks. When it wasn't clearing, at that point I swirled one and moved it upstairs where it is a little warmer. Then when that didn't work, I did some degassing, pithed some champagne yeast (my SG was 1.006) added some pectic enzyme, etc. but nothing helped.

In the future, I am going to try a different brand of juice, I think that's the only real constant in the batches that won't clear.

 

[emmanuec]

Not for the 1st 5 or 6 weeks. When it wasn't clearing, at that point I swirled one and moved it upstairs where it is a little warmer. Then when that didn't work, I did some degassing, pithed some champagne yeast (my SG was 1.006) added some pectic enzyme, etc. but nothing helped. In the future, I am going to try a different brand of juice, I think that's the only real constant in the batches that won't clear.

Which juice brand are you using?

 

[dave8274]

Which juice brand are you using?

Tree Top, though I'll be switching to Member's Mark from Sam's in the future. It's less expensive anyway.

 

[Hello]

My EC-1118 yeast didn't seem to pick up speed until day 2. This morning I came down to this and it makes me feel a lot better about this batch. I dry pitched for the first time and originally had the carboy in a swamp cooler for the first night. The temps in NC dropped so I took it out and now it has warmed up to about 85º. It's sitting at room temp now.

I think this will work out after all. I want to make another batch but maybe try the turbo cider recipe.

 

[dave8274]

Tree Top, though I'll be switching to Member's Mark from Sam's in the future. It's less expensive anyway.

Ont thing I noticed is that on the nutrition info, the Tree Top says 29 g Carbohydrate, 26 g Sugar, while the Member's Mark has both at 28 g. I wonder if the 3 g of non-sugar carbohydrate might be what is causing the problem? At the same time, plenty of people have used Tree Top without issue.

I have a carboy going right now that I started on 9/18 with Member's Mark and the Lalvin 1118 yeast, and it is already clearer than my other much older batches.

I'd like to try a batch with just Member's Mark and Montrachet, as I am not sure how close to the original recipe the Lalvin turns out.