Malting my own

[Munichdark]

So I've been looking around here for threads about malting my own barley but haven't found to many results.. I have malted a little with mixed results.. What can I expect with home malted barley? I live on a farm in sask Canada so getting barley isnt at all a problem, also we sell some portion of our barley to maltsters every year.. What kind of efficiencies can I expect? And what if I wanted to get a darker type of chocolate malt?

 

[hout17]

This is a good one for @bracconiere !

 

[bracconiere]

i usually get what Beersmith2 tells me is ~80% effec with homemalt, 90% with store bought..

Malting really isn't that hard if you don't want it to be. don't really need any fancy stuff.

i'm drying malt right now, will be in the kiln tomorrow morning, which is just a low oven...~170f....

i just use a box fan to dry for a day or two, with the barley spread out on sweater drying racks....

then after it's dry, i kiln at 170f for 12 hours, then break off the rootlets, and 'PAINSTAKINGLY' pass them back and forth between storage totes in front of the box fan, to blow the malt clean....i'm thinking of investing in a $250 compact clothes dryer to make that easier....if we put our heads to getther, maybe we'll figure something easier for deculming!


as far as dark malts, i just put the wet sprouts in a pot with a lid, and get them to 150f, let it sit for an hour, before doing the same thing to them, only hotter kiln temp to roast them....

 

[day_trippr]

You should tell him about the bathtub soaking phase

 

[bracconiere]

You should tell him about the bathtub soaking phase

i suppose that's square one!

so i toss 23lbs of barley in the tub with a drain plug, then let it soak for 2 or so hours, let it drain slowly. then give it a quick 10-15 soak everyday after with some stirring. takes about 3days to be ready for drying, sometimes 4...this gets me 20lbs of finished malt....

 

[Munichdark]

Thanks so how do you determine the malt is dry enough after the kilning stage? I assume you have an oven big enough for 20 pounds of malt? How big an area do you need for the fan drying stage? I see you attached pic but it doesn't want to work for me.. What happens if you don't remove the rootlets? A cloudy beer I assume, but are there any other serious drawbacks?

 

[Nate R]

I've heard of bathtub gin before...

You should tell him about the bathtub soaking phase

so i toss 23lbs of barley in the tub with a drain plug, then let it soak for 2 or so hours, let it drain slowly

But braccy- i think you have a GREAT marketing angle here:
Bracconiere's Bathtub Ale

If you ONLY made a small batch of it and sold it for $20/22oz bottle, you would sell out in minutes! Here's some free ad copy for you:

"Announcing an ultra-limited special run of Bracconiere's Famous Bathtub Ale. Made with ONLY 100% home sprouted AND home kilned barley, this ale is sure to delight your palate with subtle notes of grandma's ole' brown bread, butter, and nuetral earth tones. Perfectly balanced with just the right amount of hops, this beer's creamy mouthfeel is finished with the unique use of wine yeast instead of the traditional beer yeast. This beer is truly one of a kind! Your friends will be impressed! Limit 3 bottles max per household- supply is limited and WILL sell out! Order now!"

All kiding aside... braccy and another homebrewer here did an exchange- he used braccy's barley and had successful results. I will search for that and edit this post with a link. It a great read!!

Edit: here's the thread!
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/bracconiere-home-made-malt.690801/

 

[Munichdark]

I read that thread Nate. Your right it is a good thread

 

[Munichdark]

Hi @bracconiere ... so what let's you know that the malt is ready to take out of oven? Or is 12 hours at 170f a rule of thumb?

 

[bracconiere]

Hi @bracconiere ... so what let's you know that the malt is ready to take out of oven? Or is 12 hours at 170f a rule of thumb?

largley, 12 hours at 170f..sometimes 160f...but when the rootlets are dust to the fingers...and blow off easy...and you can tell by the smell, much better after some time, otherwise green grass...

honestly i've had to do two sessions of kilning for a total of 24 hours...just to get the rootlets dry, and the malt still had the enzymatic power to convert.....relax and have some fun, problem i've seen with most stuff about malting is with fancy contraptions...it's really not that hard....

 

[bracconiere]

Thanks so how do you determine the malt is dry enough after the kilning stage? I assume you have an oven big enough for 20 pounds of malt? How big an area do you need for the fan drying stage? I see you attached pic but it doesn't want to work for me.. What happens if you don't remove the rootlets? A cloudy beer I assume, but are there any other serious drawbacks?

i should add, you have to dry the barley BEFORE kilning. it locks up the enzymes that are needed for brewing. if you kiln wet malt the enzymes will be flying around molecularly, and denature.

and for drying, box fan, and something like this:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/2547664232...CIhQpKJEJjf81g%3D%3D|ampid:PL_CLK|clp:2334524

just takes about a day with room temp air flowing over the barley, and you can tell when they're ready, just wait till they're hard. and stiff to the squeeze of your fingers, then it's into the oven.


i have a normal oven, and i got some SS screen material, and stapeled up a couple of baskets with it to hold the barley....

here's a pic...i'll attach this one two ways...

 

[bracconiere]

soak for 2-3 hours, drain. make sure it can breath.

then after a day you'll have chits like this

then just give it quick wetting everyday for ~3 days and the acrospires should be mostly popping out of the husks from the opposite side of the rootlets, make sure 60% or so of the kernels have the acrospire popping out, then it's time for drying, like this...

after about a day, maybe two. time to kiln, like this, at the warm setting in an oven...

(or the screen baskets work better, that's an old pic)

And that's how you blow the rootlets off of it, i know you are going to LOVE that! (i'm working on an easier way, but that's how i did it for years)

 

[Munichdark]

Thanks.! Good stuff.. Found a roll of ss mesh last night.. Going to make some drying racks with that... And see where it takes me.. Should work..

 

[bracconiere]

Thanks.! Good stuff.. Found a roll of ss mesh last night.. Going to make some drying racks with that... And see where it takes me.. Should work..

think simplify...really all you need is to sprout the barley, dry, then give it some low "dry" heat to cook off the green taste.....i don't know why low dry heat tastes different then high wet heat, but it does.....

(if you get into it, we can do a malt swap!)

 

[Dr_Jeff]

sounds like a convection oven would be ideal

 

[bracconiere]

sounds like a convection oven would be ideal

not a bad idea! but like a high temp blower, heating coil...be good for making crystal malts....

 

[Nate R]

not a bad idea! but like a high temp blower, heating coil...be good for making crystal malts....

Or an old hair dryer in a box?!?!

 

[bracconiere]

Or an old hair dryer in a box?!?!

no...an oven works fine slow, and low. but like rigging up a dryer heating element and a blower, would be interesting...speaking of which i should have a new compact dryer on my door weighing 64lbs, for deculming! on monday, so after talking about conversion effec with homemalt and frosted flakes tomorrow evening, look forward to my next brew day with homemalt! lol (deculming in the dryer is GREAT! but kinda creapy(SP?, lol) thinking about how my underwear was just in it...going to be nice to see how the 2.6 cuft one does )

 

[Nate R]

thinking about how my underwear was just in it.

Hmmmm.... yeah, gross.
I can't even think of a joke. It's just gross.

 

[bracconiere]

Hmmmm.... yeah, gross.
I can't even think of a joke. It's just gross.

yeah, why i'm getting a dedicated dryer....for the time being, last couple batches, turning a blind eye is easier then what i had to do before....cost me $200 but if it works as good as the main one, will be well worth it!

 

[BrewersVocation]

So I've been thinking about trying to use a kettle with a false bottom to malt. After the soaking schedule pump humidified air through the silicon hose to germinate. Then switch to a variable temp heat gun to dry and kiln.

 

[Jayjay1976]

With a typical 1/2" kettle valve, I doubt you'd get enough airflow through the grain bed to dry it out before mold sets in. The weight of the wet grain will compact it into a pretty solid mass. Assuming you're talking about blowing air up from below, maybe a ~2-3" valve could handle it if your kettle already has that, how will you pump the air? Will require some pressure if you're envisioning a "fluidized bed", even then I would think dead spots are unavoidable and mold would set in.

 

[Nate R]

Or, just 'buy once- cry once' and get the real deal.
Don't let the $9,995.00 price tag scare you- it comes with FREE shipping!!

https://www.northernbrewer.com/products/sprowt-labs-acro
Wonder what the break-even is on this. I would assume the unit of measurement would be more than pounds... maybe tons? I.e. 2.35 tons of barley to break even? Too much math for me.
But someone buy this and tell us about it!!


Edit- this project comes in part by a fellow HBT member! (although he is silent here sonce 2018)
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/step-inside-our-laboratory.598322/#post-7828283

 

[Jayjay1976]

Or, just 'buy once- cry once' and get the real deal.
Don't let the $9,995.00 price tag scare you- it comes with FREE shipping!!

https://www.northernbrewer.com/products/sprowt-labs-acro
Wonder what the break-even is on this. I would assume the unit of measurement would be more than pounds... maybe tons? I.e. 2.35 tons of barley to break even? Too much math for me.
But someone buy this and tell us about it!!


Edit- this project comes in part by a fellow HBT member! (although he is silent here sonce 2018)
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/step-inside-our-laboratory.598322/#post-7828283

If my lotto numbers ever come in I'm going to gift a couple of these to my buddy @bracconiere

 

[bracconiere]

So I've been thinking about trying to use a kettle with a false bottom to malt. After the soaking schedule pump humidified air through the silicon hose to germinate. Then switch to a variable temp heat gun to dry and kiln.

no bad mold grows on malt, just sprout in a open storage tote or something, then spread the sprouts on sweater drying racks with a box fan blowing room temp air over them...takes about 24 hours, throw them in a oven set to 170f, or it's lowest setting for 12 hours,,, blow the rootlets off...presto malt....


one of the reasons i didn't get into malting earlier was people trying to make it look complicated and hard! just think more along the lines of....

https://www.swansonvitamins.com/hig...UbaINh9NB1vkxXZHAuUaAiVGEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
https://www.amazon.com/Kingwin-CF-0...ocphy=9030250&hvtargid=pla-499632127837&psc=1
https://www.target.com/p/dash-mini-...6kfsnFlFBrZ2mGUi0IIaAskYEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds
just work it up to your batch size!

 

[bracconiere]

If my lotto numbers ever come in I'm going to gift a couple of these to my buddy @bracconiere

i didn't look at the link, but will it at least do 25lbs of malt? i'm movin' on up, got me a automatic deculmer now! used dryer!


save your money....honestly looking at it, that thing scares me! (if you're interested in blowing $10,000 though, and there's a used car lot near you with a decent car with good paint? i'll drive my jalopy over there when the sun comes back out, and drive back in it? you can get the $400 i'm told mine's worth back out of it? )

 

[Jayjay1976]

i didn't look at the link, but will it at least do 25lbs of malt? i'm movin' on up, got me a automatic deculmer now! used dryer!


save your money....honestly looking at it, that thing scares me! (if you're interested in blowing $10,000 though, and there's a used car lot near you with a decent car with good paint? i'll drive my jalopy over there when the sun comes back out, and drive back in it? you can get the $400 i'm told mine's worth back out of it? )

Wasn't trying to help your malting because it's awesome, just thought you deserve some spoiling for working so hard at it.

On the daily driver thing, I'm in the same boat. Baaad time to be in the market for basic transportation, I just took out a 5 year loan on a vw with 85k on the odometer. Gotta get around I guess.

 

[bracconiere]

Wasn't trying to help your malting because it's awesome, just thought you deserve some spoiling for working so hard at it.

On the daily driver thing, I'm in the same boat. Baaad time to be in the market for basic transportation, I just took out a 5 year loan on a vw with 85k on the odometer. Gotta get around I guess.

LOL 85k? i got damn near 300k on my accord from 98'! what i need for malt is like a automatic sprtizer and stir bar that works in the tub.....you just gave me a good idea! paint mixer drill but like weld or screw on bigger paddles to it.....not sure if it will lead to anything, but a fun idea to toss around!

 

[Munichdark]

Kay I've done some malting singe last I've been here. Although my efficiencies aren't there quite yet.. Probably around 50% (ouch).. I did 8.5 gallons (got a newer 11 gallon kettle) using cooler Mash tun and kettle. Used 17 lbs homemade malt to 8.5 preboil gallons and netted a whopping 1039 og.. Bringing me to wonder how I could up my efficiency.. Could you @bracconiere somewhat outline the basics of your mashing process please? One thing that could be out to lunch is after 1 hour Mash, grain bed was at 143 degrees.. That low enough to make a significant impact? Second mashout was a 12 quart partial decoction (8quarts wort 4 quart water) raised to 182 then poured back into mash tun, raising mash to 165 degrees. Third and final mashout was at 172..

 

[Munichdark]

Also @bracconiere, lightly sucking up malted barley with roots still attached, using a vacuum with ridged hose makes a pretty good job of breaking them off.

 

[bracconiere]

Could you @bracconiere somewhat outline the basics of your mashing process please?

well, 50% is good for homemalt considering it's $2 a lb for store bought now....but since the feed store changed brands of whole barley i've only been pulling 68% down from 82%....

i find with homemalt you need to do a second decotion from ~150f, to 162f, for a alpha rest..it gives about a 10% bump up in effec....(works even better with store bought)


i just scoop up some of the mash and bring it to a boil...add it back stir it in, check temp do it again until it reads 162....

and i would say how long do you let your acrospirses get? i find i get better effec if i let most of them jump out of the husks..like looks over sprouted, but i don't know...get better effec. despite what they say is ideal....

 

[bracconiere]

Also @bracconiere, lightly sucking up malted barley with roots still attached, using a vacuum with ridged hose makes a pretty good job of breaking them off.

LOL, you must have missed my epic dryer thread. i now have a dedicated dryer, that i just throw them in... and run it for 10 or so minutes...malt comes out prestine!

 

[bracconiere]

grain bed was at 143 degrees.. That low enough to make a significant impact?

yes....

 

[Munichdark]

and i would say how long do you let your acrospirses get

I usually don't let them get out of husks before drying.. Some obviously pop out though.. Next time I'll try it your way.. By that I mean waiting for most of them to shoot out..

 

[Munichdark]

i find with homemalt you need to do a second decotion from ~150f, to 162f, f

What's the first decoction then? Is it the original 1 hour Mash? Or two decoction steps to bring from 150 to 162 after 1 hour mash?

 

[Munichdark]

Plus you said earlier a while ago that using A ten gallon cooler your doing a ten gallon batch.. Does that mean you sparge twice in order to collect ten gallons wort or is that ten gallon cooler large enough to collect ten gallons wort with only single sparge? I know that doing 8and a half gallons with 1.5 quarts per pound my cooler gets pretty full after adding 18 quarts sparge water to grains..

 

[bracconiere]

I usually don't let them get out of husks before drying.. Some obviously pop out though.. Next time I'll try it your way.. By that I mean waiting for most of them to shoot out..

i find letting most of the kernels pop out, i get better effec....probably, because i'm simple and not smart enough to build some sort of misting device, and drum on a timed roller...so better over malted then under, since it ain't going to be even...

What's the first decoction then? Is it the original 1 hour Mash? Or two decoction steps to bring from 150 to 162 after 1 hour mash?

i add gluco to everything, so i just shoot for anything at first in the brewers window 145-158f for like 30 min, because beta amylase is fast acting.. then ramp it up to 162 to stretch the alpha, a hardier enyme that likes it hot , to it's max potential....have NO idea what that would do to a FG without gluco though. but i get a big bump in OG..

Plus you said earlier a while ago that using A ten gallon cooler your doing a ten gallon batch.. Does that mean you sparge twice in order to collect ten gallons wort or is that ten gallon cooler large enough to collect ten gallons wort with only single sparge? I know that doing 8and a half gallons with 1.5 quarts per pound my cooler gets pretty full after adding 18 quarts sparge water to grains..

i fly sparge....so ~20lbs of grain and 7 gallons water fits my 10 gallon cooler nicely, and a sparge with about 10 gallons water, slowly to get about 12 gallons into the BK....

 

[PCABrewing]

largley, 12 hours at 170f..sometimes 160f...but when the rootlets are dust to the fingers...and blow off easy...and you can tell by the smell, much better after some time, otherwise green grass...

Ok, what would you recommend for temperature and time to take an existing malt darker by say 10 SRM?
Is it feasible?

I was thinking of toasting some of the Simpsons Golden Naked Oats, just as an experiment. If they taste good I'll brew with them.
Convection oven, baking sheets with parchment paper or do I need screen? It's already dry.
Temp, time?

 

[bracconiere]

Ok, what would you recommend for temperature and time to take an existing malt darker by say 10 SRM?
Is it feasible?

I was thinking of toasting some of the Simpsons Golden Naked Oats, just as an experiment. If they taste good I'll brew with them.
Convection oven, baking sheets with parchment paper or do I need screen? It's already dry.
Temp, time?

you're going to get roasted starch and not carmelized sugar flavors? so think 'dark rue' not toffee....and for something like that, i'd actually guess, toasting in a hot pan oven medium heat, until it smells like the flavor you're shooting for.....

 

[PCABrewing]

you're going to get roasted starch and not carmelized sugar flavors? so think 'dark rue' not toffee....

Ah yes, that makes sense, hadn't considered the state of conversion.
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