Local brewery allows employees to smoke while brewing...

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I echo others thoughts I liken it to the chef smoking while cooking. Unprofessional on the one hand and frankly unsanitary and gross on the other.
 
signpost said:
This is the kind of thing that doesn't need to be a big deal in order to decide not to allow it. Is it likely to harm a lot of people? Nope. Is it the best, cleanest, and safest way to do things? Sure isn't.

And it blows me away how offended people get when they notice others trying to improve our society and protect people that are likely unaware of a potential problem. Is it such an imposition on the worker to expect them to smoke on a break when they are not working. That doesn't seem like such a big deal to me.
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This is what I've been trying to say, couldn't have said it better myself.

I work in the aviation industry as an air traffic controller, probably one of the most regulated career fields in the world so I might be a little biased as a "rule follower". There's few people in my job who have the mentality that small rules are okay to be broken because they don't agree with them or they're "unnecessary". These are the people that get others hurt because they don't understand the intricacy of why the rule might exist in the first place, to protect someone or something.
 
Braufessor said:
If a brewer had Hep A...... couldn't he just sneeze while brewing and get the same effect? Or the person serving you the beer having it ...... The idea that a smoking brewer dropping a Hep A tainted cigarette butt in a mash tun is somehow really increasing the odds of spreading Hep A is a tremendous stretch at best.

That said, it seems weird to me that a brewery would want to let the image get out of people seeing them smoke while brewing. It is fairly obvious to me that it is going to turn some people off - so you just don't do it. Especially in a way that is visible to people. Just an obviously bad business move for sure. It is an outright guarantee that it would result in fewer beers sold when people see it happening.

However, the idea that somehow this is a significant health risk to the beer being consumed is ludicrous. I would be more worried about the chemicals used to clean the mash tun, hoses, pipes and fittings not being thoroughly rinsed, or the bartender not washing their hands well enough before pouring you a pint. Or.... well - pretty much a million other things that could "potentially" be a problem. I just don't even see the mechanism by which this travels through the brewing process into a beer and into a consumer. It is just a psychological turn off to customers.... which is more than enough not to do it.
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Exactly
 
Yep, and I imagine some people never leave home on a cloudy day for fear of getting struck by lightning :mug:

Have a HB and relax folks, life's too short to worry about such trivial things.
 
My biggest two things with this: Don't do things that hurt the image of the company; and do that stuff off the clock- I don't pay you to to eat, smoke, sleep or shi$t !!!
 
mj1angier said:
My biggest two things with this: Don't do things that hurt the image of the company; and do that stuff off the clock- I don't pay you to to eat, smoke, sleep or shi$t !!!
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But if I take a 15 minute dump on your time every day, it amounts to 62.5 hours over a 50 week year. Hell, I finagled another week of vacation. ;)
 
oylerck said:
Just don't get ashes in the beer and I'm okay. I do know a couple people allergic to tobacco, but I do not know the extent that the smoke would reach them in packaging. Obviously they wouldn't go to the bar for this reason.
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Here's the thing-- that smoke in the air leaves a nasty coating of tar and nicotine everywhere. Just go to a smoker's house and clean a window you'll see it on the towel. (Many people smoke outside their own homes for this reason) And of course, there is a difference between what we might do as home brewers and what the food prep laws are for state to state. Someone said why blast it on social media? Good point. That ruined reputations and impacts lively hoods. Just report it to the health department, if they are not already in trouble they likely get to correct the problem and stay in operation.
 
As long as the ashes don't fall in the mash tun or boil tank, I don't really care if the brewer smokes. But I'm a child of the 60s and 70s, when it seemed everyone smoked.

But I do agree with another person here who said, in a commercial brewery, it's a matter of perception. It just doesn't look good and appears unprofessional. Many people are turned off towards smoking in general, so if it were my brewery, there'd be no smoking anywhere inside the building. Regardless of my feelings, there are probably laws supporting this attitude.

Now, if I were at a buddy's house and he and I were doing a brew in his garage and he pulled out a smoke, I wouldn't care.
 
What if he eats while brewing? Licks his fingers?

This isn't about smoking as much as it's about touching your mouth.
 
Eventually things cool down. His cooties get on things then. Does smoke while he bottles?

It's pretty basic food service sanitation. But keep saying it's no big deal.
 
Not reading the full 6 pages.........but........imo....no one said anything about this stuff before there was political regulations, and were all here, so it never hurt our ancestors, so why be so upset about it?

Seriously though, there is 100,000 other serious things to be worried about, having a brewer smoke a cigarette while hes brewing isnt 1 of those for me.

But, i suppose we must all be worried about something...so to each his own....meanwhile, ill continue going out to Afghanistan as i have for the past 20 years to defend the freedom that others need to make decisions about this miniscule stuff.

If it bothers you, dont go there....easy decision.
 
Redtab78 said:
Not reading the full 6 pages.........but........imo....no one said anything about this stuff before there was political regulations, and were all here, so it never hurt our ancestors, so why be so upset about it?

Seriously though, there is 100,000 other serious things to be worried about, having a brewer smoke a cigarette while hes brewing isnt 1 of those for me.

But, i suppose we must all be worried about something...so to each his own....meanwhile, ill continue going out to Afghanistan as i have for the past 20 years to defend the freedom that others need to make decisions about this miniscule stuff.

If it bothers you, dont go there....easy decision.
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I admire your perspective... :mug:
 
This thread is the epitome of the internet. People upset about smoking and linking it to other "sanitary" fields like cooking. Let me just say this. DO NOT GOOGLE HOW FOOD IS MADE! Seriously. You think your chicken is clean and nice, your peanut butter, can of corn....even if you google the FDA guidelines on acceptable rates of of "non food" allowed in your food, you would be on a liquid diet in a minute.
 
Redtab78 said:
Not reading the full 6 pages.........but........imo....no one said anything about this stuff before there was political regulations, and were all here, so it never hurt our ancestors, so why be so upset about it?

Seriously though, there is 100,000 other serious things to be worried about, having a brewer smoke a cigarette while hes brewing isnt 1 of those for me.

But, i suppose we must all be worried about something...so to each his own....meanwhile, ill continue going out to Afghanistan as i have for the past 20 years to defend the freedom that others need to make decisions about this miniscule stuff.

If it bothers you, dont go there....easy decision.
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The ancestors that died young? The ones that died from infections because doctors didn't wash their hands? Pre-Louis Pasteur, you're right, there were no government regulations. It was awesome.
 
Calichusetts said:
This thread is the epitome of the internet. People upset about smoking and linking it to other "sanitary" fields like cooking. Let me just say this. DO NOT GOOGLE HOW FOOD IS MADE! Seriously. You think your chicken is clean and nice, your peanut butter, can of corn....even if you google the FDA guidelines on acceptable rates of of "non food" allowed in your food, you would be on a liquid diet in a minute.
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The federal code (Title 21, section 117) is pretty clear about washing hands, wearing gloves, and avoiding cross contamination. It specifically mentions the use of tobacco near food, food contact surfaces, and food packaging.

Or were you just repeating what you've hear about "how much rat feces is acceptable in your food?

The point is that every effort should be made to avoid contamination.
 
Redtab78 said:
Not reading the full 6 pages.........but........imo....no one said anything about this stuff before there was political regulations, and were all here, so it never hurt our ancestors, so why be so upset about it?
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It did hurt our ancestors, quite severely. We know that now. The average life expectancy at birth was once about 40 (in and after 1850 in the US), and people struggled with debilitating illnesses far more than today. Admittedly, infant and childbirth deaths lowered the life expectancy a lot, but this was before cancer was understood, before the germ theory of disease was understood sufficiently to allow protection, and before the impact of environmental hazards like tobacco smoke, coal smoke, etc. was understood.

It wasn't that long ago that people used to retire at 65 or earlier due to illness, and be dead on average a year or two later (the Social Security model was built on this, and needs updating in one way or another). Smoking wasn't all or even much of that - other disease, environmental exposures and workplace hazards killed people before smoking could. But then we got better at dealing with those other hazards, so smoking rose up the actuarial tables.
 
dyqik said:
it did hurt our ancestors, quite severely. We know that now. The average life expectancy at birth was once about 40 (in and after 1850 in the us), and people struggled with debilitating illnesses far more than today. Admittedly, infant and childbirth deaths lowered the life expectancy a lot, but this was before cancer was understood, before the germ theory of disease was understood sufficiently to allow protection, and before the impact of environmental hazards like tobacco smoke, coal smoke, etc. Was understood.

It wasn't that long ago that people used to retire at 65 or earlier due to illness, and be dead on average a year or two later (the social security model was built on this, and needs updating in one way or another). Smoking wasn't all or even much of that - other disease, environmental exposures and workplace hazards killed people before smoking could. But then we got better at dealing with those other hazards, so smoking rose up the actuarial tables.
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+10000000000
 
First of all....this isn't a restaurant....it's a place folks go to get drunk. If it's not illegal, I don't see what else there is to say other than don't go there then?
 
ericbw said:
What if he eats while brewing? Licks his fingers?

This isn't about smoking as much as it's about touching your mouth.
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Eric, me thinks if you ever watched how Oscar Meyer made hotdogs, you'd never eat another hotdog. Just sayin.....
 
I guess it is up to the individual. I think cigarette smoking in and of itself is disgusting. I really don't care that others do smoke other than the fact it makes my health insurance more expensive.

I would imagine that it is a violation of health rules to smoke in the brewery. See if they are closed down the next time a health inspector comes around.

I would not be worried about the safety of drinking the brewery's beer, but would probably patronize other breweries instead.

I am surprised the brewery allows it just because of the image.
 
ZmannR2 said:
First of all....this isn't a restaurant....it's a place folks go to get drunk. If it's not illegal, I don't see what else there is to say other than don't go there then?
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That's pretty much the point. It probably is illegal (I say probably because I'm not going to waste my time searching laws of other states) but food manufacturing is regulated, that is why there is an FDA allowance for bug parts and rodent crap in prepared foods. But, that doesn't mean allowing contamination, is a defensible practice.
 
Without getting into the argument for or against a brewer smoking while brewing, this is what TN state law says about it since the non-smoker act passed in 2007

Question: Where is smoking prohibited under the new law?
Answer: Under this new law, smoking is prohibited in all enclosed public places within the State of Tennessee with a few exceptions

Of the exceptions, the only one I think this could fall under would be:

Venues that restrict access to persons who are 21 years of age or older at all times

I don't think it was ever mentioned which Memphis brewery this was but I can't think of any that I've visited that check ID before ordering anything.
 
mullet6577 said:
Without getting into the argument for or against a brewer smoking while brewing, this is what TN state law says about it since the non-smoker act passed in 2007

Question: Where is smoking prohibited under the new law?
Answer: Under this new law, smoking is prohibited in all enclosed public places within the State of Tennessee with a few exceptions

Of the exceptions, the only one I think this could fall under would be:

Venues that restrict access to persons who are 21 years of age or older at all times

I don't think it was ever mentioned which Memphis brewery this was but I can't think of any that I've visited that check ID before ordering anything.
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I think the working side of the brewery, even if it is only separated by glass from the public area, is not a public place. Not sure if there is a smoke-free workplace law in TN, though.
 
I've been smoke free for almost 5 years now and now cigs bother the hell out of me. I used to think they just smelled like tobacco but now they smell like chemicals to me.

With that said if I really liked their beer I wouldn't let it bother be because I already would have drunk a lot of it. If their beer was just average or so-so I probably wouldn't go there again. There's too many other choices out there.

No doubt they shouldn't be smoking inside where they make things that people consume.
 
arnobg said:
... My point being, where do you draw a line then when it comes to public health and regulations to protect consumers?
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We don't have to draw the line, the brewery did that for us, now it's up to the consumer to decide what fits their needs. I find it irrational to tell someone how to run their business.
 
foam_top said:
We don't have to draw the line, the brewery did that for us, now it's up to the consumer to decide what fits their needs. I find it irrational to tell someone how to run their business.
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True. There should be no rules for any business.
 
Brownalemikie said:
Eric, me thinks if you ever watched how Oscar Meyer made hotdogs, you'd never eat another hotdog. Just sayin.....
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Pretty sure you can't smoke while making hot dogs either.

This about if it's gross.
 
ericbw said:
The federal code (Title 21, section 117) is pretty clear about washing hands, wearing gloves, and avoiding cross contamination. It specifically mentions the use of tobacco near food, food contact surfaces, and food packaging.

Or were you just repeating what you've hear about "how much rat feces is acceptable in your food?

The point is that every effort should be made to avoid contamination.
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I'm going to quote my own post, simply because I think it's related to the topic of "if it's not illegal..." If the rules are not using tobacco where you make or package food, then it would be... um... illegal.

This isn't "smoking is bad" or "hot dogs are gross." It's about food production. Smoking in the bar would be more acceptable, but even bartenders should probably be washing their hands between touching their mouth and touching your glass.
 
Fact oids...
Smoking on the brewery.... Bad.
Letting you see.... worst...
Bad for your health.... probably...
Worst than beer... probably not...


Take your chances....
Make your chioices...

I don't think Hep A virus would survive finished beer...
 
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