I don't see kegging making you a better brewer than those of us that bottle. But a better person? Oh brother,you've got it bad. That response was def trolling for trouble.
kegging elitism
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beersk
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Pretty sure he was joking, I chuckled a bit.
For extra fun, ask one of these kegging elitists about cask ale. There's a good chance that they'll say that cask beer is fantastic. Then point out that it's basically a large bottle conditioning vessel and let them try to explain it.
I can say that I regularly notice differences between the same beer bottle conditioned vs. kegged. Pour me a glass of each and I'll glady pick apart the little differences between them. It may be due to freshness, how it was handled, carbonation level or just serving temperature.
Just don't ask me to tell you which is better and expect to get any meaningful information from that. It could change hour to hour depending on my mood.
It's like asking a parent which child is their favorite or asking which style of beer is the best. There is no answer because it's a question based on the false assumption that because two things are different one must be better than another.
I can say that I regularly notice differences between the same beer bottle conditioned vs. kegged. Pour me a glass of each and I'll glady pick apart the little differences between them. It may be due to freshness, how it was handled, carbonation level or just serving temperature.
Just don't ask me to tell you which is better and expect to get any meaningful information from that. It could change hour to hour depending on my mood.
It's like asking a parent which child is their favorite or asking which style of beer is the best. There is no answer because it's a question based on the false assumption that because two things are different one must be better than another.
I have to ask, though... who are these "bottle-conditioning SUCKS!" fanatics? I've been around homebrewers for a long while now, and I can't say that I've ever met someone with this attitude. Is this thread sixty responses to one single guy?
You know the type. The ones that come into a bottling question thread & say "Start kegging your beer!".
Yeah, except I can't recall any instances of someone finishing that statement with ".... because it will taste better!" It's always "... because it's easier" (which it is, objectively, I don't care what you say; one big bottle >>>>>>>>>>>> fifty little bottles.)
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JustLooking
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Im sensing a lot of insecurity in this thread. 
kaconga
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It was two people in the last six months, as I noted in the original post, and there were a couple people who replied to this thread that prefer the taste of kegged beer to bottle conditioned. One account of an uncertified judge as well.
Honestly I am surprised that so many can taste a difference and that they prefer bottle conditioned for flavor. This information alone will keep me happily bottling my Baltic porter even after I start kegging.
i don't like my beer bottle conditioned. i find they don't have a crisp, clean flavor to them. hard for me to describe since i haven't bottle conditioned in 8 months. i have yet to try someone else HB so i don't really know if it's my procedures or just in general. But i don't think that that one way is better then another.
While kegging gear costs more up front (i have around $700-800 for a 3 tap system with 4 kegs), i do find that i can get a batch on tap and very drinkable in a much shorter period, don't have to store cases of bottles, less time cleaning and sanitizing. i love homebrewing but i also feel my time is worth something. so kegging in the long run allows me to save money making beer vs buying and i don't have to spend extra time bottling. i have other hobbies, a house in the country that always requires some sort of work, a full time job, wife and kids etc etc.
I've just gotten comfortable with my bottling process,gadgets & set up that get the job done in a short time. So I'll be bottling for the forseeable future...works for me.
IMHO, it's not a matter of what my time is worth when it comes to homebrewing, it's a matter of what i like doing, and what i don't. It doesn't matter that i spend a few hours brewing a batch, i enjoy that. It does matter that i spend a bunch of time cleaning up after brewing because that's no fun. So, I look for ways to reduce cleaning time, and don't really care about reducing brewing time right now. Cleaning and sanitizing a couple cases of bottles seems like a chore I wouldn't enjoy. I was lead to believe before I started homebrewing that kegging takes less cleaning time, but honestly, i don't know, I've never bottled a batch, and I have no interest in doing a time study on it.
So, my decision to keg is based on perceived convenience, since my belief is that both kegging and bottling produce good results, if slightly different. It has cost me considerable money in kegs and draft beer hardware, and I think a lot of people who spend that money convince themselves that they're spending it to get better beer. Personally, I stopped trying to justify personal purchases to myself a few years ago. The only justification I need is that I like what I buy. I like my cars, I liked my house, and I like my draft beer setup. In general, I'm a happy guy.
If at some point I don't like the draft beer system, I'll sell it off, like I'm trying to do with the house. 
Black Island Brewer
An Ode to Beer
IMHO, it's not a matter of what my time is worth when it comes to homebrewing, it's a matter of what i like doing, and what i don't. It doesn't matter that i spend a few hours brewing a batch, i enjoy that. It does matter that i spend a bunch of time cleaning up after brewing because that's no fun. So, I look for ways to reduce cleaning time, and don't really care about reducing brewing time right now. Cleaning and sanitizing a couple cases of bottles seems like a chore I wouldn't enjoy. I was lead to believe before I started homebrewing that kegging takes less cleaning time, but honestly, i don't know, I've never bottled a batch, and I have no interest in doing a time study on it.
So, my decision to keg is based on perceived convenience, since my belief is that both kegging and bottling produce good results, if slightly different. It has cost me considerable money in kegs and draft beer hardware, and I think a lot of people who spend that money convince themselves that they're spending it to get better beer. Personally, I stopped trying to justify personal purchases to myself a few years ago. The only justification I need is that I like what I buy. I like my cars, I liked my house, and I like my draft beer setup. In general, I'm a happy guy.
+1 on doing what makes sense for you!
My decision to bottle has to do with experience doing BOTH kegging and bottling. I bottled at first, switched to kegging, but sold it all off because I like the benefits of bottling over kegging, many of which have been covered here ad nauseum, but for me includes not having a space that makes sense for a kegerator to be convenient. A beer fridge in my detached garage works great for storing bottled beer, but is too far to go to keep filling up my glass from a tap.
JoeSpartaNJ
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Whattawort said:
I feel the same way.
NickTheGreat
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I like kegging because I get a quicker turnaround time. For some reason, I'm always up against a timeline for my beer.
But I've noticed when I talk to non-brewers, they seemed more impressed by kegging. "Wow, you KEG your beer? That's cool!"
I'll still bottle certain things. But keg most others
But I've noticed when I talk to non-brewers, they seemed more impressed by kegging. "Wow, you KEG your beer? That's cool!"
I'll still bottle certain things. But keg most others
I'm an odd duck. I naturally carbonate my kegs because I want that bottled conditioned taste in my kegged beers, Granted, I lose a pint or two to sediment that way, but I like it.
For me, there is nothing (and I mean NOTHING) cooler than serving my homebrew to friends out of the taps on my pub wall.
That, and my favorite beer mug is a 19oz imperial pint... can't fill it with a single 12oz, can't squeeze in a 22oz bomber.
I also like that after conditioning/cold crashing in the keg, 99% of any lingering sediment gets pushed out in the first pint or two, and nothing but clear runnings after that.
Oh, the humanity.
That, and my favorite beer mug is a 19oz imperial pint... can't fill it with a single 12oz, can't squeeze in a 22oz bomber.
I also like that after conditioning/cold crashing in the keg, 99% of any lingering sediment gets pushed out in the first pint or two, and nothing but clear runnings after that.
Oh, the humanity.
beersk
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And you can't pour off a quick little 2oz sample with bottling. But that's another "benefit" to kegging, but not really a big deal. I think my one and only gripe with bottling over kegging is the sediment on the bottom. It gets stirred up so easily, it's frustrating. And people always say that bottling makes it more convenient and easier to "take beers over to a buddy's house". Has anyone ever heard of a growler? It's all about preference though, I guess. Some beers need to be bottle conditioned. It's just crazy when people say that kegging will make your beer better.
Just filled 4 growlers straight from my taps... I'm not worried about oxidation or infection or carbonation escaping because all four will be GONE in the next 30 hours. Plus, I sanitized them.
Rhumbline
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Well, I'll have to concede that point. It would be pretty cool to have your own micro pub in the house.
Beer on tap, wood fired pizza oven, couple cafe tables.
With the umbrellas with "Martini Porche" on them,in honour of the movie "LeMans"!! Brumos porche RULES!
When the Austrian Langheck ruled the earth!
When the Austrian Langheck ruled the earth!
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I have 8 cornie kegs, a deep freezer, and a temp controller.
I bottle exclusively. I think the beer tastes better and ages MUCH better in the bottle.
Not saying that I'll never keg again. While I prefer bottle conditioned beer, I absolutely HATE bottling beer. I guess that's the price you pay though. Like work, and this is work, you get paid only for those tasks that you hate doing. Everything else you do for free. Fun isn't work.... It's called work, not "happy fun time" after all. Bottling is work... I don't care how patient you are, bottling is time consuming and is the only task that I absolutely hate about home brewing. If that's all of the actual labor that I have to perform for this great hobbie of mine, I suppose I can suffer through it. Especially a few weeks after bottling day when I pour my first brand new baby into a pint glass and take a big drink of it..... ahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!! Somehow that always lessens the pain of bottling day.
I bottle exclusively. I think the beer tastes better and ages MUCH better in the bottle.
Not saying that I'll never keg again. While I prefer bottle conditioned beer, I absolutely HATE bottling beer. I guess that's the price you pay though. Like work, and this is work, you get paid only for those tasks that you hate doing. Everything else you do for free. Fun isn't work.... It's called work, not "happy fun time" after all. Bottling is work... I don't care how patient you are, bottling is time consuming and is the only task that I absolutely hate about home brewing. If that's all of the actual labor that I have to perform for this great hobbie of mine, I suppose I can suffer through it. Especially a few weeks after bottling day when I pour my first brand new baby into a pint glass and take a big drink of it..... ahhhhhhhhh!!!!!!! Somehow that always lessens the pain of bottling day.
Rhumbline
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Brings to mind my Navy brethren's saying about "Ships of wood and men of iron".
As an aside, when I was just a sprout, a guy in my hometown bought a Gulf liveried GT-40. This was back in the late 60's. I had the chance to ride in that magnificent beast a few times. Even though i was only 8 or 9 year's old I still remember that thing.
:fro:
Beer critics and judges say so many dumb things.
[ame]http://vimeo.com/64558227[/ame]
Beer is a vastly complicated product, with countless nuances that influence the final product. It could be one of scores of things that they tasted. My best guess is a +1 on the yeast being shaken into the beer on the drive.
Some major brewers go to unbelievable lengths to bottle condition their beers, this can't be an accident. But most beer at brewpubs is kegged, and I've had unbelievable beers off draft.
They're just looking for something to show their massive knowledge off, whether they had that wisdom or not.
[ame]http://vimeo.com/64558227[/ame]
Beer is a vastly complicated product, with countless nuances that influence the final product. It could be one of scores of things that they tasted. My best guess is a +1 on the yeast being shaken into the beer on the drive.
Some major brewers go to unbelievable lengths to bottle condition their beers, this can't be an accident. But most beer at brewpubs is kegged, and I've had unbelievable beers off draft.
They're just looking for something to show their massive knowledge off, whether they had that wisdom or not.
I agree with the previous posters. It has to do with sugar.
As far as bottle conditioning, if you wait for the beer to clear, you won't have very much trub. I usually wait a month in the secondary. I get a light dusting at the bottom of the bottle.
Some times a little trub can taste good. More in darker beers; less in lighter. Besides yeast, trub contains left over of malt and hop particles. If the left over particles have a stronger taste than the dead yeast, the last drink can taste like a strong drink of the beer. It can make a great beer fantastic as well as bad beers worse.
I made a mocha stout once. The trub tasted like chocolate covered expresso beans. It was a great last drink.
As far as bottle conditioning, if you wait for the beer to clear, you won't have very much trub. I usually wait a month in the secondary. I get a light dusting at the bottom of the bottle.
Some times a little trub can taste good. More in darker beers; less in lighter. Besides yeast, trub contains left over of malt and hop particles. If the left over particles have a stronger taste than the dead yeast, the last drink can taste like a strong drink of the beer. It can make a great beer fantastic as well as bad beers worse.
I made a mocha stout once. The trub tasted like chocolate covered expresso beans. It was a great last drink.
Perhaps the yeast may be noticable but really they were idiots. And the table sugar = cidery was disproven eons ago. I've made belgians and imperials with 15 to 20% table sugar with no cidery effect.
That's a cool chair I'd love to have in my mancave!Velocity stack shaped glasses?
One of these chairs?
That had to be the greates,riding in a GT-40 Gulf Mirage! Lucky you! Now that's a memory!
Epic. If you have the means, you could return the favor in this:
Shades of old mirages...:rockin:
Those guys that were being keg snobbish need to meet so CAMRA members where if it isnt naturally carbonated and hand drawn from a cloudy wood cask then it aint real ale.
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