Is temp control necessary thru entire fermentation process?

[heckofagator]

Hi all, I have yet to brew my first batch, but I'm hoping to this weekend. I had planned on ordering a Cool Brewing Fermentation bag.

Looking forward to my 2nd batch, I tasted some Bourbon Porter at a intro class and would like to try Northern Brewer's version.

http://www.northernbrewer.com/shop/bourbon-barrel-porter-extract-kit.html

The directions call for an additional 2-3 secondary fermentation. our house goes from maybe 74 at night to 78 during the day when nobody is home. Can I get by with just cooling for the couple weeks of primary fermentation? I'm worried that if I need to cool for a few more weeks in the bag, that's going to stop me from starting a next batch.

thanks in advance!

 

[GCPHomebrew]

Above 70 is too hot for secondary. Just use a swamp cooler to keep it at temp. A rubber made container and frozen water bottles will work. Just put a thermometer in the water to know your temp.


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[soccerdad]

There is a free version of John Palmer's "How To Brew" on line. This comes from that:

Chapter 8.1.3 - Temperature Factors
8.1.3 Temperature Factors

The third factor for a good fermentation is temperature. Yeast are greatly affected by temperature; too cold and they go dormant, too hot (more than 10°F above the nominal range) and they indulge in an orgy of fermentation that often cannot be cleaned up by conditioning. High temperatures encourage the production of fusel alcohols - heavier alcohols that can have harsh solvent-like flavors. Many of these fusels esterify during secondary fermentation, but in large amounts these esters can dominate the beer's flavor. Excessively banana-tasting beers are one example of high esters due to high temperature fermentation.

High temperatures can also lead to excessive levels of diacetyl. A common mistake that homebrewers make is pitching the yeast when the wort has not been chilled enough, and is still relatively warm. If the wort is, e.g. 90¡F, when the yeast is pitched and slowly cools to room temperature during primary fermentation, more diacetyl will be produced in the early stages than the yeast can reabsorb during the secondary stage. Furthermore, primary fermentation is an exothermic process. The internal temperature of the fermentor can be as much as 10F above ambient conditions, just due to yeast activity. This is one good reason to keep the fermentor in the proper temperature range; so that with a normal vigorous fermentation, the beer turns out as intended, even if it was warmer than the surroundings.

Brewing in the summertime is a definite problem if you don't have a way to keep the fermentor cool. My friend Scott showed me a neat trick though, he would immerse (not completely) his fermentors in a spare bathtup during the summer. The water in the tub was slow to warm during the day even though temperatures would be in the 90's, and at night the water would be slow to cool, even when the temperature dropped to 45 F. In this way he was able to moderate his fermentation temperature between 60-70 F, and the beer turned out great. I have used this method myself with wash tubs and had great success.

 

[Swiller]

But the main question is about temp controlling primary fermentation.

Yes, control the primary ferment... A week or two is fine. Once it's done, a little extra heat won't hurt it. It may help it attenuate better, but it won't cause any off flavors.

There is no reason to secondary a porter either, so just leave it in the primary fermenter for a month or so and then rack it to a bottling bucket.

 

[JonM]

Can I get by with just cooling for the couple weeks of primary fermentation? I'm worried that if I need to cool for a few more weeks in the bag, that's going to stop me from starting a next batch.



thanks in advance!

You can get away with cooling it for the first couple DAYS of fermentation.
That's exactly what I do on every single batch. No need for the secondary and no need to go nuts with temp control after active fermentation is over. Heck, I usually turn the ferm chamber off after a week or less.

 

[soccerdad]

ps - you can probably hover around 60 to 62F for 5 to 7 days by changing out an ice block a day .. and then letting temp rise to 65 to 68 for the next 7 to 10 days by changing the block every other day

edit - or as JonM says above, control when active which could be as few as 3 to 5 days or as long as 5 to 7 and then just let rise to room temp (although I would look for a cool corner if the house got up to 78)

 

[Foosier]

Above 70 is too hot for secondary.

I am not sure this is necessarily accurate. The key to fermentation temp control is to get the temps in range during the most active portion of primary fermentation. This means that the first 72 hours is the most important. Certainly if you are doing an ale, this is the time to pay the closest attention to keeping the temp down in range.

Once you go to secondary, and there are many who question whether secondary is even necessary, you are well past the point where the yeast will be throwing off lots of volatile esters. That is primarily a function of the growth/active fermentation protion of the yeasts life cycle. Past this point, there is actually benefit to raising the temps to encourage the yeast to clean up after themselves. In lagers this the diacytyl rest. Now, this is still not generally done as hot as 78 degrees, but usually closer to 70.

What this means for you is that your ambient room temps are probably not going to cause you a problem during secondary. They will cause problems if you rely on those ambient temps during primary. Expect some weird flavors and a soapy mouthfeel. If you do go with the cool brewing bag, you can use 2-3 frozen 2 liter bottles to keep the temps where you want them for the first 3-4 days. After that, it is okay to let the temps rise by only using 1 frozen 2 liter bottle. I'd probably try and keep the temps down while you are in primary which I assume would be a week with most kit instructions. After you move to secondary, I'd put the fermenter in the coolest part of your house but I would not worry about temp beyond that.

 

[heckofagator]

thanks all.

I'm still going back and forth between the bag and the Son of Fermenter. With the SoF, I guess you can build a double wide, which gives you some more flexibility, but having the small space factor of the bag is a pretty big plus. If I only really have to watch temps for the first section of rapid fermentation, that's what I was kind of hoping to hear but wasn't totally sure on.

 

[heckofagator]

also, I realize this is not necessarily the right section, but I've also seen that for the ideal bottle conditioning temps, its usually cooler than our house is. Again, its probably ok to condition the bottles at room temp?

 

[JonM]

Yep. You'll be fine.

 

[Kblandfo]

Just the info I was after! Thanks all

 

[Man-O-Leisure]

Above 70 is too hot for secondary. Just use a swamp cooler to keep it at temp. A rubber made container and frozen water bottles will work. Just put a thermometer in the water to know your temp.


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When reading recipes, is the temperature that it says to ferment at, the ambient temperature or the temperature of the wort?

How would having a thermometer in the water help? Shouldnt there be a thermometer somehow into the wort to see the temp?

 

[heckofagator]

Still totally new to this, so take this with a grain of salt.

But I'm planning to put a stick on thermometer on the fermenter. I think that will be pretty close to the temp of the wort. I've seen some drill a hole in the bucket for a temp prob, but I'm hoping the stick on deal will get me within a couple degrees of the reading I'm after.

 

[heckofagator]

Still totally new to this, so take this with a grain of salt.

But I'm planning to put a stick on thermometer on the fermenter. I think that will be pretty close to the temp of the wort. I've seen some drill a hole in the bucket for a temp prob, but I'm hoping the stick on deal will get me within a couple degrees of the reading I'm after.

like this

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004B4TS1S/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20

 

[BrewinBromanite]

But the main question is about temp controlling primary fermentation.

Yes, control the primary ferment... A week or two is fine. Once it's done, a little extra heat won't hurt it. It may help it attenuate better, but it won't cause any off flavors.

^^ Agreed!! Keep a careful eye that beer temps (not ambient temps) stay in the mid to low range of the yeasts recommended temps for the first week or so. Thereafter, as long as your ambient room temp is not too hot (mid 70s are fine), you should be good. As mentioned, and from my personal experience, those first 2-3 days are the most critical to not let the temp jump above range. Even brief excursions to high 70's during the very active part of fermentation can produce flavors that don't go away. I personally get best results with most ale yeasts in the mid-low range of the recommended yeast temps.

As far as thermometers go, pick up a couple sticker-thermometer strips, or tape a trusted thermometer to the side of the fermenter and insulate with some foam or bubble wrap.


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[BrewinBromanite]

Those sticker thermometer strips have been surprisingly accurate for me, and they are cheap. I don't rely on them anymore, but I haven't bothered taking several off of buckets and better bottles after a dozen uses, and they still are right in line with my nice digital thermometer readings. Just a try to keep them as dry as possible.


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[Doctor_M]

Above 70 is too hot for secondary. Just use a swamp cooler to keep it at temp. A rubber made container and frozen water bottles will work. Just put a thermometer in the water to know your temp.


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No

You can get away with cooling it for the first couple DAYS of fermentation.
That's exactly what I do on every single batch. No need for the secondary and no need to go nuts with temp control after active fermentation is over. Heck, I usually turn the ferm chamber off after a week or less.

Yes

 

[Bamsdealer]

I only control ferment temp until airlock activity slows to a few seconds. Usually 2-4 days... depending on the yeast and gravity. Once that happens I let it free rise to about 70 in the basement. Cooler in the winter. 75 wont hurt... and as others have said, skip the secondary.

 

[heckofagator]

hey guys....I don't want to beat a dead horse here. And I know airlock activity is not a good indicator of fermentation. But since this is my first batch, I just want to make sure I'm not doing anything silly.

I made a Belgian Wit last Sunday and its been in the Cool Brewing Bag for a week now at about 66 degrees. I'm still getting a bubble thru the 3 piece airlock about once every 8 seconds - I didn't get any activity for the first 2-3 days.

I'd really like to make a new batch today and move the new stuff into the bag to cool and move this week old beer out for another week or two at room temp. Is the every 8 seconf bubble anything to worry about? I'm guessing I'm past the bulk of the fermentation but just want to make sure

 

[Shred]

hey guys....I don't want to beat a dead horse here. And I know airlock activity is not a good indicator of fermentation. But since this is my first batch, I just want to make sure I'm not doing anything silly.

I made a Belgian Wit last Sunday and its been in the Cool Brewing Bag for a week now at about 66 degrees. I'm still getting a bubble thru the 3 piece airlock about once every 8 seconds - I didn't get any activity for the first 2-3 days.

I'd really like to make a new batch today and move the new stuff into the bag to cool and move this week old beer out for another week or two at room temp. Is the every 8 seconf bubble anything to worry about? I'm guessing I'm past the bulk of the fermentation but just want to make sure

You are probably fine, but the only way to tell is by taking gravity readings. If the gravity doesn't move for 2 or 3 days, you're good to go.

The airlock activity could just be excess CO2 gassing off. Movement or temp changes can cause this.