Is all-grain really THAT much better than extract?

[Jayjay1976]

I have the pH meter, have the salts, use r/o water, did 2 so far. No better than with plain old tap water so far.

All of those things are like high-end golf clubs, fancy shoes, and a subscription to golf digest; now that you've got the knowledge and the tools, all that's missing is more practice.

Disclaimer:
I'm in the same position you are but with far less experience than you have. I own a pH meter but have never opened the box.

 

[bracconiere]

That looks like a good crush for BIAB, but would be too fine for my mash tun with braid filter.

looks about like my crush, mine actually might be a bit finer though. and i just have a cooler and bazooka tube.....

 

[GrogNerd]

Practice making beer

Nothing more awesome than that

All of those things are like high-end golf clubs, fancy shoes, and a subscription to golf digest; now that you've got the knowledge and the tools, all that's missing is more practice.

Disclaimer:
I'm in the same position you are but with far less experience than you have. I own a pH meter but have never opened the box.

 

[beerme70]

Short answer.....YES. With that said, BIAB or extract brewing is, IMO, better than your run-of-the-mill commercial beers anyway. With AG, you have a LOT more control and a LOT more options to twist, tweak, and refine your recipes. No matter HOW you brew, though, you're brewing. THAT'S what's important.

 

[bwible]

Extract is more expensive pound per pound than all grain. And you are paying extra for 2 things.

The first is convenience. You don’t have to crush grain, heat water, pre-heat your mash tun, mash in, wait an hour, sparge if you are so inclined and slowly draw off over some time to get your wort. And collect 6 gallons to boil down to 5. All you have to do is heat water and mix in the sugar that someone else has done the work to collect. All of this results in time and energy savings. Your labor and also savings on your gas or propane bill. Remember that your time is also worth something. None of us go to work for free.

The second thing you are paying for is consistency. Companies like Muntons, Briess, Coopers and others are very good at making this extract and its the same every time. You know it is 1.045 for the dry extract - which means 1lb of extract dissolved in 1 gallon of water will give you an OG of 1.045. 1.038 for the liquid. Which makes it very easy to hit your recipe target gravity to the point. No guessing, no efficiency problems.

I also keep extract on hand to make up lost gravity if I hit my target low or to supplement a mash to make stronger and higher alcohol beers like Doppelbock or Barleywine - particularly if my mash tun is 5 gallons and can’t hold enough grain to make 5 gallons of a high gravity beer.

Extract has its uses and I am not going to be quick to write it off or say all extract beers suck or there’s no reason I would ever brew extract. I learned that lesson long ago.

 

[Saunassa]

I guess one can use specialty grains to enhance extract. I have never used extract other than hopped extract which is not very good in my experience. I would really like to make the basic Brewing 15 minute pale ale from extract.

I have made their 15 minute pale ale kit twice now. I do the 3 gal version. The first batch which fermented to warm was good but the second which I fermented cooler was great. Nice and easy to make on a kitchen stove in the middle of winter.

 

[fendersrule]

Got my 1.104 OG Russian Stout fermenting right now.

The crush at .025" looks close to the same to .027". Just a hair finer. A little more powder.

I nailed 69% efficiency....again.....with such a big beer. 80 min mash time. I'm actually pretty happy with this number for it being such a huge beer.

I need to make my regular beer to see if I gained efficiency by the slightly finer crush. I'm assuming I likely did.

 

[GrowleyMonster]

My brew kettle holds 4 gallons at about an inch and a half from the top. So 4 gallons is about my limit, without resorting to my big aluminum crawfish pot. Is that too small for BIAB? I am really looking for around 6% ABV, 5 gallons. I could go as low as 5%, maybe, but certainly no lower. I am doing very lightly hopped amber ales.

 

[fendersrule]

The math isn't adding up....to make 5 gallons with a BIAB you should really be at 10 G to be comfortable.

 

[GrowleyMonster]

The math isn't adding up....to make 5 gallons with a BIAB you should really be at 10 G to be comfortable.

I was afraid of that. Any problem with the kettle being aluminum?

 

[fendersrule]

If you are using an electric stovetop then you may have trouble maintaining a boil with a conductive alum pot. Propane or gas would probably bring aluminum to a boil without much issue.

for a 5G batch, you will need 7-7.5 gallons water preboil to account for boil off and water that will still be in the grains after drainage. Plus the room needed for 16lbs of grain or so. So plan on a 10G pot at minimum for a 5G BIAB batch. Most of us recommend 15-20G kettles.

 

[GrowleyMonster]

If you are using an electric stovetop then you may have trouble maintaining a boil with a conductive alum pot. Propane or gas would probably bring aluminum to a boil without much issue.

for a 5G batch, you will need 7-7.5 gallons water preboil to account for boil off and water that will still be in the grains after drainage. Plus the room needed for 16lbs of grain or so. So plan on a 10G pot at minimum for a 5G BIAB batch. Most of us recommend 15-20G kettles.

Okay. My crawfish boiling setup should work, then. Now that I think of it, it is a 100 quart pot so 25 gallons. The burner is a double jet, don't remember how many BTU but I can boil two sacks of crawfish at a time if I need to, though I usually only do one. (about 30 to 35 lbs) So it is a pretty powerful burner. I sure as hell won't be able to chill in the sink though haha. I will probably make ice bags for chilling. My stove is gas but I am not sure I can get the pot inside so the outdoor propane burner will have to gitter done. And so, my next batch will definitely be all grain.

 

[fendersrule]

Not sure about your location, but my local HBS has 50’ immersion chillers on sale constantly for dirt cheap. I think you’d find that a IC would cool muccccch faster that ice bags would!

 

[wilserbrewer]

My brew kettle holds 4 gallons at about an inch and a half from the top. So 4 gallons is about my limit, without resorting to my big aluminum crawfish pot. Is that too small for BIAB? I am really looking for around 6% ABV, 5 gallons. I could go as low as 5%, maybe, but certainly no lower. I am doing very lightly hopped amber ales.

While less than ideal, with a sparge and carefully boiling near the kettle rim, and topping the fermenter with a bit of water, you might be able to squeak a 5 gallon batch.

I would try a 4 gallon batch first to get your feet wet.....uh well hopefully not literally

Your 100qt crawfish pot seems excessive imo for 5 gallon batches, but would be prefect for 10-15 gallon BIAB with a decent pulley set up.

 

[z-bob]

My brew kettle holds 4 gallons at about an inch and a half from the top. So 4 gallons is about my limit, without resorting to my big aluminum crawfish pot. Is that too small for BIAB? I am really looking for around 6% ABV, 5 gallons. I could go as low as 5%, maybe, but certainly no lower. I am doing very lightly hopped amber ales.

I've done 4 gallon BIAB brews with a 22 quart pot. I have an 8 gallon kettle now, and I could probably squeeze 5 gallons out of it, but it does 4 gallons pretty well. The only thing magic about 5 gallons is that's what most recipes are written for (probably because that was the most common size of glass carboy when we were all using glass carboys) There is no shame in brewing 2.5, 3, or 4 (etc) gallon batches. Some people do all-grain 1 gallon.

If your kettle is a little too small, you'll have to sparge in a separate container (like a white plastic bucket) That's easy to do; squeeze the bag as best you can, move it to the bucket, add another gallon or 2 of water, let it soak for 10 minutes (stirring occasionally), and drain and squeeze again. Add the squeezins to back the kettle, which now has a lot more room in it because you took out all the grain. Maybe hold a little back until after it comes to a full boil, then add the rest a little at a time after the initial hot break foam dies down (less likely to boil over that way)

 

[z-bob]

double post

 

[z-bob]

I will probably make ice bags for chilling.

I have a pretty sucky immersion chiller. It will quickly cool down to about 95 degrees, but has trouble going much lower than that even if the tap water is running really cold. I use frozen 1L soda bottles to chill the wort the rest of the way; just sanitize a couple and drop them in the bucket. They are sealed so they don't dilute the wort. Don't fill them quite all the way when you freeze them or they might burst in the freezer. I fill 'em almost full and then squeeze the air out before I cap them.

Or use kveik yeast because it actually likes to be pitched at 95 degrees.

 

[fendersrule]

do you stir the IC in the kettle? That’s how they are more effective. Assume you do.

95 sucks. My IC that doesn’t really fit and only has about 20’ of exposed coils in the wort will at least get me into the low-mid 80s in the dead heat of summer. Fall, winter, and spring...wort is 65F right after transfer.

 

[davidabcd]

Still, no.

 

[z-bob]

do you stir the IC in the kettle? That’s how they are more effective. Assume you do.

95 sucks. My IC that doesn’t really fit and only has about 20’ of exposed coils in the wort will at least get me into the low-mid 80s in the dead heat of summer. Fall, winter, and spring...wort is 65F right after transfer.

If you're talking to me, yes I do stir it. I can get the wort down to about 75 or 80 degrees eventually, but it takes a *long* time to get it there. Ice bottles are a lot faster once I get it below 100. I'm not sure what size my IC is, but I think it's about 20 feet of 3/8" OD copper. It's just too small, plus my kettle has a lot of thermal mass (so I wipe the sides down with a cold wet cloth and that helps a little)