Ice?

[jgaepi]

To chill the wort quickly after boiling, has anyone combined the efforts of a wort chiller plus a big ice cube frozen in tupperware, sealed in some heat resistant plastic bag? Seems logical to me to just drop a huge block of ice, water tight so no leakage, to cool that sucker down fast. Maybe the wort chiller for 5 minutes to bring the temp down and then a quart size block of ice to do the rest?

 

[hercher]

As long as it is properly sanitized, why not? Before I had a wort chiller, when I was an extract brewer, I used to immerse my brewpot in ice water. Once, after a major snowstorm, I took the pot outside and buried it in snow.

 

[beretta]

Sure a sealed block of ice in a sanitized container would work fine. Although, for even faster cooling, I'd buy a bunch of those little fake ice cubes... they come in a little platic pouch that is pretty easy to santize prior to freezing. Using a lot off little ice cubes would increase the surface area and cool the wort faster. They may be a pain to fish out of your boil kettle and clean, though...

 

[mattmcl]

I think the trick is finding something to put the ice in that can withstand going from freezing to boiling without breaking down, will remain completely watertight, and can be sanitized. I haven't figured anything out yet...

 

[coffeegod]

How about.....Ice. Why bother with tupperware. Boil a gallon of water, let it cool and ladle into new ziplock bags (they are sterile) Freeze. The next day you have a gallon of sanitized ice.

 

[jgaepi]

Are you sure new ziplock bags are sterile? And if the bag is sterile, then who cares if the water inside is sterile as long as the bag stays sealed? I get the wort chiller but it seems like a waste of water to run 15 minutes worth of water through it and still not cool the wort fast enough.

P.S. I don't want to start a new post for this but does anyone know of a compact fridge that can hold a 5 gallon carboy?

 

[Benjibbad]

The ice should work but you run the risk of it leaking into your wort hence the sterlizing. I am not sure if ziplocks are sterile out of the box I would assume not for cautionary sake. But freezeing them should kill some of the bacteria in it. I would save the ice though and make a pre chiller for your water or switch to something like a plate chiller or counterflow.

 

[hercher]

I agree with mattmcl, though. I would be hard to find something that can withstand temperature extremes. A Ziploc bag is likely to melt, and leak into your beer. This would obviously significantly change the OG. Perhaps if you have a stainless container that you could somehow affix a lid to prevent leakage, or suspend it in the beer so the open top is above the top of the beer.

Alternatively, use a tupperware or Ziploc, but run your wort chiller for a little while first to drop the temperature of the beer part way, then dip your ice in.

 

[Kauai_Kahuna]

If you boil, cool, ziplock (I would spray some starsan just cuz), freeze and dump in I don't see a real problem.
Now my cautionary tale:
I made the mistake of using commercial ice on my first brew over a decade ago that went well but after the 4th week it started to sour, and in week 8 it tasted like rotten apple cider. It was all drunk, but I had to be very drunk to do it.
After that I just don't want to ever try it again. I first did no chills and covered and let cool over night, then to ice baths, and then IC's, then IC's with ice and a pond pump.

 

[coffeegod]

Guys you take the ice out of the ziplock and add it directly to the wort. I have used this method for 57 batches without an infection. Scott

 

[mkory]

Yep. If you're confident your ice is clean or just don't worry too much about sanitation (like me) put the ice in the beer to bring your volume up to 5 gallons. I've been doing this for a while now and have yet to have a problem. It lets me pitch my yeast about 2 minutes after the end of the boil. It's nice to wrap things up that quickly, especially at that point in the day when you're ready to be done with it.

 

[Corkster]

TI am not sure if ziplocks are sterile out of the box I would assume not for cautionary sake.

As far as this goes, I may be able to add a bit of insight as I make flexible packaging (aka plastic) for a living.

The process involved in making most plastic bags would leave the inside of the bag pretty well sanitized as the plastic comes off the die in a large tube at around 350-500 degrees depending on the type of plastic being made. the inside of that tube theoretically is not exposed to any outside influence all the way through the equipment as it runs down the line and gets cut and sealed.

however with a small bag like a zip-lock the plastic tube is run and flattened out then a small portion is slit off from each end. the top and bottom of the "tube" then are separated forming two sheets of plastic which are rolled onto big rolls. Then they run through various conversion machines to cut/fold/seal/ and add the zipper. this process will leave both sides of the plastic (inside and out) exposed to open air for short periods of time making it more likely that they are not properly sanitized any more.

That's our process anyway, I can't say for certain that the makers of Zip-lock follow the exact same process though.

Are they sanitary enough for a sandwich or a buncha chips? You bet. Sanitary enough for something as important as beer? well that's one bet I would not take!

 

[Stoopidwon]

I have used store bought 1 litre bottles frozen... I sanatize the exterior, and a knife then just got the ice out of the bottle and lower it in slowly...has worked well so far. Only works if you need to add water to the wort.

 

[Chips]

In the past I've boiled some water, let it cool then poured it into those re-usable ziplock sandwich 'tupperwear' style containers (sanitized first of course). Then freeze and simply drop into your wort giant like giant ice cubes!

My idea which I will try in my next brew (I use a IC but dropping those last 20 deg seems to take forever without constant stirring) is to freeze some high quality water balloons. When it's time to chill, simply sanitize and throw them in! The spherical shape is ideal for heat transfer. As long as the balloons don't break there should be no issue with contamination.

 

[jgaepi]

Ok, because my question started as a new-person question and remains the same, won't adding ice directly to wort (when it melts) dillute the wort? Or is the melt water used to top up to 5 gallons?

 

[Pete79]

Yeah you can add ice directly to the wort if you do a partial boil. You would be adding top-up water anyway. Obviously you don't want do this with a full boil.

 

[northernlad]

Ok, because my question started as a new-person question and remains the same, won't adding ice directly to wort (when it melts) dillute the wort? Or is the melt water used to top up to 5 gallons?

Melt water for top up.
We sell the Rapi-Cool chiller from San Jamar that is specifically designed to be frozen, then put in a hot liquid for rapid cooling. The downside is the cost. 128oz is $40, 64 oz is $30. I am sure you could use a 2 liter for the same result (bring the wort temp down below 180 first), I would just make sure to rotate it out every few batches.

 

[springer]

get a dozen or so aluminum Bud "bottles' fill 3/4s up with water ,cap , sanitize and freeze I would put them in a bag so not to contaminate them in the freezer. Drop them in the hot wort .