how long should I let my Russian imperial stout bottle, and a couple of fermenting ?

[Dalymiddleboro]

Hey guys


So couple of things here.


I let my RIS ferment for 8 weeks. Mostly because initially it had a lot of krausen, and I just couldn't get time between work to have a bottling day. Is that too long to let it ferment? The gravities both OG and FG lined up nicely.

My other two questions:

a.) Does this affect carbonation during the bottling process?
b.) How long should I let it condition in the bottle before it carbonates?
c.) I hear it's nice to let RIS sit for a while to age, since I left it in the fermenter longer, will that make it higher quality?


Thanks guys!

 

[mrgrimm101]

Should be fine. Bigger beers, like RIS, are often bulk aged for months and months. I think this is typically done in a secondary vessel, but you should be fine with just 8 weeks in primary.

A.) The yeasties may have gone to sleep..can't say for certain. One thing that people often do with high gravity beers like RIS or barleywines, after it bulk ages, is to introduce new yeast at bottling time. Many people use Lavlin EC-1118 Champagne yeast, while others use Lallemand CBC-1 cask conditioned ale yeast. I've heard good results using either.

B.) With a beer like an RIS, you could benefit from much longer conditioning time, even after it fully carbonates. I would wait a few months then pop open a bottle and see if it's reached full carbonation. I would guess you're looking at several months before it conditions and really comes into its own.

C.) I wouldn't say "higher quality", but you gave it more time to clean up and condition in primary. It will undergo further changes after you bottle it. Like I said, I imagine you will have to let this one sit for a few months before it really shines.

 

[Dalymiddleboro]

Should be fine. Bigger beers, like RIS, are often bulk aged for months and months. I think this is typically done in a secondary vessel, but you should be fine with just 8 weeks in primary.

A.) The yeasties may have gone to sleep..can't say for certain. One thing that people often do with high gravity beers like RIS or barleywines, after it bulk ages, is to introduce new yeast at bottling time. Many people use Lavlin EC-1118 Champagne yeast, while others use Lallemand CBC-1 cask conditioned ale yeast. I've heard good results using either.

B.) With a beer like an RIS, you could benefit from much longer conditioning time, even after it fully carbonates. I would wait a month then pop open a bottle and see if it's reached full carbonation. I would guess you're looking at several months before it conditions and really comes into its own.

C.) I wouldn't say "higher quality", but you gave it more time to clean up and condition in primary. It will undergo further changes after you bottle it. Like I said, I imagine you will have to let this one sit for a few months before it really shines.

I appreciate this! It probably would have been better on my part to state that I have already bottled this a week ago. So far no bottle bombs! I did the priming sugar like required, I'm just REALLY hoping it carbonates and I didn't mess anything up by letting it sit 8 weeks...

 

[mrgrimm101]

I appreciate this! It probably would have been better on my part to state that I have already bottled this a week ago. So far no bottle bombs! I did the priming sugar like required, I'm just REALLY hoping it carbonates and I didn't mess anything up by letting it sit 8 weeks...

I wouldn't worry about it sitting in primary for 8 weeks. What yeast did you use initially?

If it doesn't carbonate after a couple months, you can give em a swirl, open them up, introduce a tiny amount of fresh yeast (or more priming sugar) and recap and try again. I don't know the specifics of these methods, as I've never had to do it. Someone out there, please correct me if I'm wrong about this!

Here is a link that may help if there's an issue..
http://www.weekendbrewer.com/flat_bottled_beer.htm

 

[MindenMan]

A year wouldn't be out of line age wise, but I would wait at 6 months before I cracked the first one. A while back I brewed a Strong Scotch Ale, (sort of same idea) and it was a year before the alcohol smoothed out making for a nice sipping after dinner beverage. Just my $0.02

 

[jimbo85]

My second brew was a RIS and I was dumb and drank the majority of them with my buddies as soon as they were carbonated. Last month I found one that was hiding in the pantry for almost a year.... I really wish I would have waited longer on the others.

 

[microbusbrewery]

Assuming the conditions weren't crazy (e.g. not 90F, sitting in the sun, etc), 8 weeks in primary isn't any concern. And you shouldn't have to re-yeast after only 8 weeks. There will still be plenty of yeast in suspension. High gravity beers do tend to take longer to carb, but they'll get there eventually. The only beers I've ever bothered to re-yeast are my sours that have bulk-aged for a year or more. I'd just give the bottles a swirl once every other day for the first few weeks; that'll keep the yeast in suspension which will ensure they carb up as quickly as possible.

 

[Dalymiddleboro]

My second brew was a RIS and I was dumb and drank the majority of them with my buddies as soon as they were carbonated. Last month I found one that was hiding in the pantry for almost a year.... I really wish I would have waited longer on the others.

This is great info. I'll let them age... But out of curiosity did they taste fine, when you opened them as soon as they fully carbonated? I mean, was not letting them age a choice in which they weren't good to drink?


To everyone else I appreciate all of the advice. I also noticed less trub than my first brew, does that mean that just using a primary is fine, and the extra time, made the beer clearer?

 

[jimbo85]

I was excited to drink them (RIS is one of my favorite styles), and they were good but REALLY boozy (11.5%). At first I just expected that's what a homebrew RIS to taste like. After I drank the one that aged, I was kinda angry that I didn't save any more. The boozy flavor subsided so much and the malt character was much more prevalent. Huge difference. I recommend drinking one as soon as they carb, and then try one periodically over about 6 to 8 months. you will notice a BIG difference

 

[Rhumbline]

I did an RIS and was too impatient to wait. It was a very good beer but I'm about to do another that I will age for a longer time.

Typically, these beers aren't super carbed so you shouldn't be upset if you don't see Lyle Lovett head on it. My experience has been that carbonation increases over time once the brew is bottled.

 

[Dalymiddleboro]

I was excited to drink them (RIS is one of my favorite styles), and they were good but REALLY boozy (11.5%). At first I just expected that's what a homebrew RIS to taste like. After I drank the one that aged, I was kinda angry that I didn't save any more. The boozy flavor subsided so much and the malt character was much more prevalent. Huge difference. I recommend drinking one as soon as they carb, and then try one periodically over about 6 to 8 months. you will notice a BIG difference

I'll do that.

Wouldn't the ABV be a product of your OG prior to fermentation, and your FG post fermentations though?

 

[mrgrimm101]

I'll do that.

Wouldn't the ABV be a product of your OG prior to fermentation, and your FG post fermentations though?

Yes, but a lot of times you can taste the heat from the alcohol, especially as high as RIS tend to be. Over time, this burn smooths out as the malt flavors become more prominent.

To answer your previous question..Yes, just using a primary is fine. I never use secondaries..many people do. It's a personal preference. The extra time in primary gave your beer more time to potentially clear up by allowing suspended particles to fall out of suspension and settle on the bottom of your fermenter. Typically, I give my brews an extra 5-7 days in primary after FG has been achieved before I bottle. This gives a little extra time to clean/clear up. I also cold crash when I have the fridge space available.

 

[Dalymiddleboro]

Yes, but a lot of times you can taste the heat from the alcohol, especially as high as RIS tend to be. Over time, this burn smooths out as the malt flavors become more prominent.

To answer your previous question..Yes, just using a primary is fine. I never use secondaries..many people do. It's a personal preference. The extra time in primary gave your beer more time to potentially clear up by allowing suspended particles to fall out of suspension and settle on the bottom of your fermenter. Typically, I give my brews an extra 5-7 days in primary after FG has been achieved before I bottle. This gives a little extra time to clean/clear up. I also cold crash when I have the fridge space available.

You're awesome. Helping out so much.

Another question while we're on the subject... I noticed using the syphon hose, while transferring to bottling bucket that there was still a decent amount of sediment on the bottom(obviously it won't disappear...) I didn't want to syphon a lot of that into the bottling bucket, so I left a little bit of wort on the bottom. Therefore I lost maybe a couple beers at most. I mean, any good way to handle this in the future? Should I just let it syphon trub in?

 

[mrgrimm101]

You're awesome. Helping out so much.

Another question while we're on the subject... I noticed using the syphon hose, while transferring to bottling bucket that there was still a decent amount of sediment on the bottom(obviously it won't disappear...) I didn't want to syphon a lot of that into the bottling bucket, so I left a little bit of wort on the bottom. Therefore I lost maybe a couple beers at most. I mean, any good way to handle this in the future? Should I just let it syphon trub in?

I roll up a towel and put it under the back of my fermenter to give it a slight tilt, but gently so as not to disturb the yeast/trub cake. This way that last bit of beer is a bit more easily accessible and I limit the amount of sediment that gets transferred to my bottling bucket.

 

[Dalymiddleboro]

I roll up a towel and put it under the back of my fermenter to give it a slight tilt, but gently so as not to disturb the yeast/trub cake. This way that last bit of beer is a bit more easily accessible and I limit the amount of sediment that gets transferred to my bottling bucket.

Ok cool. Didn't know if what I experienced was pretty normal, I just hate wasting beer...

 

[mrgrimm101]

Yea it's normal.

 

[TxBigHops]

Ok cool. Didn't know if what I experienced was pretty normal, I just hate wasting beer...

I'm with you 100% on this! Last time I bottled I ran my syphon hose into a paint strainer bag when racking from primary to bottling bucket. AND I tilt the carboy as suggested by mrgrimm. I got virtually all of the liquid and yet only a bit of sediment was at the bottom ofthe bottling bucket after bottling. Seemed to work well.

And I also really appreciate this thread. I'm working on a big RIS right now myself, and have many of the same concerns. This Saturday will be 4 weeks since I brewed. I plan to rack to secondary, only because I am going to bulk age on a bourbon soaked oak spiral. The instructions with the spiral stated that all oak flavor would be imparted after 8 weeks. Should I bottle imediately after that, or would it hurt to remove the spiral and age a few more weeks before bottling? And after that length of time, would it be recommended to add some yeast when bottling?

Sorry if this is a hijack, but the questions seemed so related.

 

[mrgrimm101]

I plan to rack to secondary, only because I am going to bulk age on a bourbon soaked oak spiral. The instructions with the spiral stated that all oak flavor would be imparted after 8 weeks. Should I bottle imediately after that, or would it hurt to remove the spiral and age a few more weeks before bottling? And after that length of time, would it be recommended to add some yeast when bottling?

I've never used oak chips, but from what I read it's very easy to over-do it. 8 weeks seems like a long time for the beer to be in contact with the oak. I'm reading that people have over-oaked beers even after 2 weeks, but that could be they had too much oak to start with.

Stick with about 2 oz of oak. I would soak in bourbon for 2 weeks minimum. Some say that 24-48 hours is all that you need for sanitation, but I feel that you want much longer than that for the flavors you want.

I wouldn't wait to bottle. Any extended aging can potentially be done in the bottle.

 

[Dalymiddleboro]

I'm with you 100% on this! Last time I bottled I ran my syphon hose into a paint strainer bag when racking from primary to bottling bucket. AND I tilt the carboy as suggested by mrgrimm. I got virtually all of the liquid and yet only a bit of sediment was at the bottom ofthe bottling bucket after bottling. Seemed to work well.

And I also really appreciate this thread. I'm working on a big RIS right now myself, and have many of the same concerns. This Saturday will be 4 weeks since I brewed. I plan to rack to secondary, only because I am going to bulk age on a bourbon soaked oak spiral. The instructions with the spiral stated that all oak flavor would be imparted after 8 weeks. Should I bottle imediately after that, or would it hurt to remove the spiral and age a few more weeks before bottling? And after that length of time, would it be recommended to add some yeast when bottling?

Sorry if this is a hijack, but the questions seemed so related.

No worries at all. I love reading new techniques. I'm a HUGE fan of high gravity Imperial brews. Love any beer 7% and over.

If you can, keep us updated with your beers status. maybe we can do a trade with 6 packs!

 

[TxBigHops]

I've never used oak chips, but from what I read it's very easy to over-do it. 8 weeks seems like a long time for the beer to be in contact with the oak. I'm reading that people have over-oaked beers even after 2 weeks, but that could be they had too much oak to start with.

Stick with about 2 oz of oak. I would soak in bourbon for 2 weeks minimum. Some say that 24-48 hours is all that you need for sanitation, but I feel that you want much longer than that for the flavors you want.

I wouldn't wait to bottle. Any extended aging can potentially be done in the bottle.

Thanks for the input. I'm using spirals, not chips. Here is a link to what I bought. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0064OBFW8/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
Two came in the package, but I'm just using one. It's been soaking in some bourbon for almost two weeks now. The reference to 8 weeks was on the packaging, but it did seem to be referring to wine, not beer. That might be the difference. I'll check with a couple other threads where I first read about aging on oak.

So you see no advantage to additional bulk aging after I'm done with the bourbon/oak? Get it in the bottle and let it age there?

 

[mrgrimm101]

Thanks for the input. I'm using spirals, not chips. Here is a link to what I bought. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0064OBFW8/?tag=skimlinks_replacement-20
Two came in the package, but I'm just using one. It's been soaking in some bourbon for almost two weeks now. The reference to 8 weeks was on the packaging, but it did seem to be referring to wine, not beer. That might be the difference. I'll check with a couple other threads where I first read about aging on oak.

So you see no advantage to additional bulk aging after I'm done with the bourbon/oak? Get it in the bottle and let it age there?

I don't think you can soak for too long really. Don't quote me on that though.

I'm not sure that there would be any advantages to bulk aging vs aging in bottles. I'm sure you could do it and it would be fine, but would it make it better? Maybe someone else knows better..