hop me, please?

[hopmomma]

Hello. I transplanted some hops from a friends yard (a littl late in the year I know). I've been watering and telling them to grow faster and I think its working. The bines of one plant have all but turned to dust but around the stalk of the bines on both plants, little green leaves have sprouted from the dirt. Considering there are no other plants anywhere in the hop garden I've designated, could these little greenies be hops? Thanks for any input.

 

[DrJerryrigger]

Those look like little seedlings like maybe grass or some other weed. Hop shoots are bigger, the stems are about 1/8" in diameter when they come up. Give them time, and don't over water them.

 

[hopmomma]

Those look like little seedlings like maybe grass or some other weed. Hop shoots are bigger, the stems are about 1/8" in diameter when they come up. Give them time, and don't over water them.

Thanks so much. I do have a shoot that is as you described coming from the whillamette (?) Location. Ill pluck the weeds out.

 

[frydogbrews]

mulch those babies too! if you planted them a little shallow, the bines would be much thinner also. i wouldn't bother weeding this season, as it is late. just mulch (2" would be fine) then let 'em marinate down there till next season. you realy don't want to accidentally pluck any bines at this stage in the game and a few undesirables that are that small aren't going to hurt a thing. as the weeds get bigger and you can be certain what they are, then pluck them....carefully.

 

[DrJerryrigger]

mulch those babies too! if you planted them a little shallow, the bines would be much thinner also. i wouldn't bother weeding this season, as it is late. just mulch (2" would be fine) then let 'em marinate down there till next season. you realy don't want to accidentally pluck any bines at this stage in the game and a few undesirables that are that small aren't going to hurt a thing. as the weeds get bigger and you can be certain what they are, then pluck them....carefully.

I agree, don't bother weeding until you see some hop sprouts. But mulching isn't necessary, I like mulch after I see one or two shoots.

 

[wyzazz]

As stated above, those are weeds but not really big enough to worry about. The ground looks really moist and unless you just watered them then it's too wet. Leave them be and when you see a thin asparagus looking thing, that is your hop bine!

 

[day_trippr]

I'd mulch - to keep the ground from baking hard. When I planted twelve rhizomes this year I immediately put down a couple of inches of mulch to hold moisture and keep the ground soft enough so the sprouts could push through...

Cheers!

 

[likwidbliss]

Hop shoots look like asparagus. You may want to paint the finger nail green. It might entice the plants to grow!

 

[frydogbrews]

there is zero reason not to mulch.


just not more than about two inches. at least grab a handful of dry leaves and toss em there. they keep moisture in and keep the rain from compacting the soil.

 

[hopmomma]

When's a good time to mulch? I'm in california so I figured probly around october?

 

[hopmomma]

Hop shoots look like asparagus. You may want to paint the finger nail green. It might entice the plants to grow!

Usually my nails are green. I find it helps the green thumb.

 

[phoenixs4r]

Usually my nails are green. I find it helps the green thumb.

They are currently red right now, therefore your problem.

 

[wyzazz]

When's a good time to mulch? I'm in california so I figured probly around october?

Once you see the bines start to creep up go ahead and mulch.

 

[frydogbrews]

i've found the best time to mulch is exactly one beer after i finish planting everything.

seriously though, do it now, the mulch, assuming it's not crazy thick, will not inhibit the bines from sprouting, only surface seeds.

 

[hopmomma]

i've found the best time to mulch is exactly one beer after i finish planting everything.

seriously though, do it now, the mulch, assuming it's not crazy thick, will not inhibit the bines from sprouting, only surface seeds.

Thanks much. One beer after planting seems sufficient! Will anything work? I have some leaves... or is it better to actually buy mulch?

 

[wyzazz]

I use shredded leaves (run them over with the lawnmower) or straw leftover from mulching the vegetable garden.

 

[frydogbrews]

yeah, anything will work as long as it is full of carbon, not nitrogen.
so dry stuff like grass that's turned brown, dry leaves, etc....not fresh compost, as in banana peels and egg shells. i actually had someone tell me they were mulching some of their plants with that and wondering why the plants were looking bad.

 

[hopmomma]

yeah, anything will work as long as it is full of carbon, not nitrogen.
so dry stuff like grass that's turned brown, dry leaves, etc....not fresh compost, as in banana peels and egg shells. i actually had someone tell me they were mulching some of their plants with that and wondering why the plants were looking bad.

I was under the impression hops liked nitrigen? Either way thanks for the advice

 

[frydogbrews]

yeah, they do. all plants like more nitrogen, except for beans (they make their own...kind of)

when something is "full of nitrogen", that means it hasn't broken down yet. very different than nitrogen in fertilizer. say you use only kitchen waste to mulch your plants...best case scenario, as its breaking down it uses all available nitrogen to fuel the conversion, leaving your plant with none. worst case scenario is two options. 1:an animal comes and neats it all, digging and destroying your plant during the process, and 2:as its breaking down it gets too hot and frys your plant. using green grass as mulch right up against a stem will heat up way too much.
i realize you weren't going to do this anyway, just thought you might be interested.
when making home compost, the ration is 80% carbon (brown,dry stuff) to 20%nitrogen (kitchen stuff, or stuff not dry)
there truly is an art to making good compost, but that's for another forum. the forum is called "$#it happens". ha

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

When mulching I apply 3"-4". Plants, especially hops, will find their way through almost anything and 4" of mulch ain't gonna stop anything. Mulch does almost nothing for weed suppression, it's more about moisture retention than anything, as others have already noted.

Last word on mulch from me is to look for a composted mulch and apply a small amount of nitrogen fertilizer either in the mulch or on the soil before applying the mulch. This is because when organic matter, such as mulch, breaks down or composts, it uses nitrogen and this usually ends up coming from the soil it's sitting on. This is referred to as nitrogen depression. Composted pine mulch has already gone through much of this process so it doesnt use as much nitrogen as non-composted mulch and the N fertilizer you throw down when applying the mulch will ensure your mulch doesn't deplete nitrogen from the soil that your hops need.

 

[frydogbrews]

as long as the mulch is not mixed into the soil, it will not deplete any nitrogen.
anything over 3" deep runs the risk of matting. when matting occurs in the mulch, it actually wicks water off instead of holding it in. if you have ever seen mulch. around a tree or something, that breaks apart in chunks, that's matting.
mulch can suppress weeds, only for about a year though, and it stops more weed seeds from germinating as they get stuck in the mulch and never get to the soil. some species can germinate in the mulch, but not most.

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

as long as the mulch is not mixed into the soil, it will not deplete any nitrogen.
anything over 3" deep runs the risk of matting. when matting occurs in the mulch, it actually wicks water off instead of holding it in. if you have ever seen mulch. around a tree or something, that breaks apart in chunks, that's matting.
mulch can suppress weeds, only for about a year though, and it stops more weed seeds from germinating as they get stuck in the mulch and never get to the soil. some species can germinate in the mulch, but not most.

Right, sorry, I meant weeds that are already in the soil before applying mulch. Mulch ain't gonna stop them from coming up. In my experience, almost anything will still germinate in mulch but weeds growing in mulch are much easier to remove than weeds in soil, so long as you get them before their roots establish in the soil beneath.

As for matting...I've never seen that happen. Not saying it doesn't, but I work in landscaping and we tend to apply 3-4" of composted pine mulch in all garden beds we install and we've never encountered problems...could the type of mulch be dependant on this? Like that crappy shredded skid much that gets dyed red...I can see happening with that.

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

As for nitrogen depression, opinions vary. I've never seen it happen, but that's what I was taught in school, so I just like to play it safe and ensure my hops and any other plants get all the nitrogen they need.

 

[frydogbrews]

it certainly happens in that dyed mulch, but it also happens with all bark mulch. i've never used pine mulch, so maybe it's not as much of an issue. little extra nitrogen's usually a great thing, as long as it is not super hot outside when you put it down....that'll burn your plants. i'm not just making this stuff up though, i was a landscape forman for 10 years, i'm still an ISA certified arborist, and i have a degree in botany.
interesting to see that landscape techniques are pretty much the same in canada as they are in missouri.
i raise my glass to you!

 

[CanadianQuaffer]

Yeah, too much nitrogen can be bad, usually a concern with turf grass.
I will have to defer to your knowledge from now on, lol. I just have 2 years under my belt as a foreman, completed a 2 year apprenticeship course in Horiculture and have my Landscape Ontario certification in Hardscape Installation. So you could say I know more about bricks than I do plants, but I like plants more, lol!

Cheers!

 

[hopmomma]

yeah, they do. all plants like more nitrogen, except for beans (they make their own...kind of)

when something is "full of nitrogen", that means it hasn't broken down yet. very different than nitrogen in fertilizer. say you use only kitchen waste to mulch your plants...best case scenario, as its breaking down it uses all available nitrogen to fuel the conversion, leaving your plant with none. worst case scenario is two options. 1:an animal comes and neats it all, digging and destroying your plant during the process, and 2:as its breaking down it gets too hot and frys your plant. using green grass as mulch right up against a stem will heat up way too much.
i realize you weren't going to do this anyway, just thought you might be interested.
when making home compost, the ration is 80% carbon (brown,dry stuff) to 20%nitrogen (kitchen stuff, or stuff not dry)
there truly is an art to making good compost, but that's for another forum. the forum is called "$#it happens". ha

I will definately take that ratio to mind when I mulch. Thanks much

 

[hopmomma]

Yeah, too much nitrogen can be bad, usually a concern with turf grass.
I will have to defer to your knowledge from now on, lol. I just have 2 years under my belt as a foreman, completed a 2 year apprenticeship course in Horiculture and have my Landscape Ontario certification in Hardscape Installation. So you could say I know more about bricks than I do plants, but I like plants more, lol!

Cheers!

I like plants more too. I was quite happy to see baby bines coming off my transplantd willamette that I thought shocked to death! Thanks

 

[frydogbrews]

the 80/20 ratio was strictly for compost, not for mulch. mulch should be 100%mulch, like bark chips, straw, dried leaves, pine needles, stuff like that.

 

[hopmomma]

the 80/20 ratio was strictly for compost, not for mulch. mulch should be 100%mulch, like bark chips, straw, dried leaves, pine needles, stuff like that.

Thanks. I was planning on mucling today and almost added spent grains from our first all grain. You caught me before I did it. Thanks again for your input.