Homebrewing in NJ ILLEGAL w/o permit!!!

[BrewProject]

I just wrote my law review article on arbitration (obviously not the same as homebrewing) but preemption of state law by federal law was a big deal in the note. Virtually all state arbitration laws have been held by the U.S. Supreme Court to be preempted by the Federal Arbitration Act. I'd apply similar logic to this situation and say that the state laws governing homebrewing have been preempted by the federal law governing the field.

obviously Federal Law preempts State Laws in some other cases as well.

Two of them being Medical Marijuana and Alcohol Prohibition back in the 20's. (although I am not sure that there were State Laws that went against Federal Prohibtion Laws, I am sure there are States today with Medical MJ Laws that the Federal Govt thumbs it's nose at).

 

[EdWort]

I lived in Utah for 5 years and it's illegal there too. No brewing without an ABC permit, and in Mormon country, that's a tough permit to get, especially in Provo.

Screw em, I brewed anyway and always had 8 carboys in my basement bubbling away with something. My kegerator was in the garage with a great sticker on it.

On the 8th Day, God created BEER

 

[homebrewer_99]

I lived in Utah for 5 years and it's illegal there too. No brewing without an ABC permit, and in Mormon country, that's a tough permit to get, especially in Provo.

Screw em, I brewed anyway and always had 8 carboys in my basement bubbling away with something. My kegerator was in the garage with a great sticker on it.

On the 8th Day, God created BEER

Well, he should have destroyed NJ! Dang Quakers!!

 

[matt c]

How's the $2 pint nights at the Fox and Hound? Still crowded?

mmmm good ole pint night at the fox. yes its always crowded.



p.s. **** NJ

 

[EdWort]

I loved being an Outlaw during my brewing days in Utah. It's still illegal there.

As for paying the state of New Jersey for the privilege of making my own beer, I'd simply ignore the statute just like loads of folks in Utah do.

I don't know how the folks in NJ put up with all that crap and the taxes.

 

[feedthebear]

Maybe I'm lucky all homebrewing is illegal in Utah. The state doesn't want or expect anything from me doing it and it is too small of a crime for any cop to investigate.

 

[iamjonsharp]

Ah New Jersey, the armpit of America.

 

[Mustangfreak]

I was thinking about cross training into a KC-10 boom operator. Only problem was they are only at 2 bases. One in California, San Francisco to be exact. I hate Cali. OVer populated, over rated, over priced.

The other base is in NJ. I'd be more then happy to go to Cali over NJ.

But thankfully I'm back in good ol' Texas!

 

[Bobby_M]

Ok, ok, enough with the jersey bashing. I'm 31 years old and lived here my whole life. There are plenty of things to complain about but here's a list of things I've never had to deal with:

1. Hurricane
2. Tornado
3. Flood
4. Earthquake
5. Massive school shooting
6. Terrorist attack
7. Wildfires
8. Bad draught

All this crap seems to happen elsewhere. I don't know, the taxes don't seem all that bad.

 

[Soulive]

Ok, ok, enough with the jersey bashing. I'm 31 years old and lived here my whole life. There are plenty of things to complain about but here's a list of things I've never had to deal with:

1. Hurricane
2. Tornado
3. Flood
4. Earthquake
5. Massive school shooting
6. Terrorist attack
7. Wildfires
8. Bad draught

All this crap seems to happen elsewhere. I don't know, the taxes don't seem all that bad.

+ 1...and if Jersey sucks so much, why do so many people live here/want to live here? Why do so many people come to our beaches to vacation?

 

[Bobby_M]

+ 1...and if Jersey sucks so much, why do so many people live here/want to live here? Why do so many people come to our beaches to vacation?

..and eat our pinnapple and make our sisters clean your hotel rooms. Oh, wait, that's Hawaii...but then there's the volcanos to deal with.. (wasn't that a classic scene in 50 first dates? Rob Scheider is awesome).

 

[Evan!]

Ok, ok, enough with the jersey bashing. I'm 31 years old and lived here my whole life. There are plenty of things to complain about but here's a list of things I've never had to deal with:

1. Hurricane
2. Tornado
3. Flood
4. Earthquake
5. Massive school shooting
6. Terrorist attack
7. Wildfires
8. Bad draught

All this crap seems to happen elsewhere. I don't know, the taxes don't seem all that bad.

Duh, of course non of those things happen there, because they all know better than to spend any time in Joizey . BTW, I'm quite sure that there floods and fires and droughts there at various points in time. I mean, I've personally never had my house burned from a wildfire, but I know that they do happen in VA.

And just wait...Jersey and NYC are due for a nice fat earthquake soon. Mega Disasters said it, so it must be true.

 

[Evan!]

Virginia code Title 4.1, Chapter 1, § 4.1-200 provides that any person may manufacture at his residence or at a gourmet brewing shop for domestic consumption at his residence, but not to be sold, dispensed or given away, except as hereinafter provided, wine or beer or both in an amount not to exceed federal law.

[...]

Any person who manufactures beer in accordance with this subdivision may remove from his residence an amount not to exceed fifteen gallons of such beer on any one occasion for (i) personal or family use, provided such use does not violate the provisions of this title or Board regulations; (ii) giving to any person to whom beer may be lawfully sold an amount not to exceed seventy-two ounces per person per year, provided such gift is for noncommercial purposes; or (iii) giving to any person to whom beer may lawfully be sold a sample of such beer, not to exceed two ounces by volume for on-premises consumption at events organized for judging or exhibiting such beer, including events held on the premises of a retail licensee. Nothing in this paragraph shall be construed to authorize the sale of such beer.

So it's illegal for me to serve any friend or acquaintance of mine more than a sixer per year?

Man, I really REALLY love the ridiculous inanity of Bureaucracy. I wonder what the discussion was like that led to them concluding that a sixer was okay, but anything more was bad for society.

 

[the_bird]

Wait, you've never dealt with a hurricane in Jersey?

As to the flooding issue.... where's that thread on global warming?

No bad "draught" in Jersey, either?

 

[Evan!]

Wait, you've never dealt with a hurricane in Jersey?

As to the flooding issue.... where's that thread on global warming?

No bad "draught" in Jersey, either?

Yeah, and it never rains on the weekend...and the whole state smells like flowers...and nobody litters...and there's no pollution...

 

[Soulive]

Wait, you've never dealt with a hurricane in Jersey?

As to the flooding issue.... where's that thread on global warming?

No bad "draught" in Jersey, either?

No bad "draught" only loads of bad "draft" in NJ

 

[Bobby_M]

I'm not saying everything is perfect here but it's a state that gets bashed quite a bit while there are plenty of other places that have their share of problems.

Cali has the catastrophic earthquakes every few decades and every year 1000 acres are burned, sometimes taking whole neighborhoods out. Louissiana was underwater for about a year. The entire gulf coast has to deal with a bad hurricane almost every fall.

Ok, maybe a hurricane made it into the state once or twice but here it's more like a windy thunderstorm. Maybe a few cars hit with tree limbs and a couple downed wires. Even the winter weather isn't bad. We don't get much hail and the deepest snowfall in my lifetime happened in 96 with like 20" in an overnight.

 

[jezter6]

http://www.fema.gov/news/newsrelease.fema?id=13225

Who said it doesn't flood in Jersey?

 

[Bobby_M]

Compare those numbers to almost any other shore state.

State Number of disaster declared
1 Texas 81
2 California 73
3 Florida 59
4 New York 56
5 Oklahoma 53
6 Louisiana 53
7 Alabama 46
8 Kentucky 45
9 Ohio 43
10 Illinois 43
11 Pennsylvania 42
12 Mississippi 42
13 Arkansas 41
14 West Virginia 40
15 Washington 40
16 Missouri 40
17 Minnesota 40
18 Virginia 39
19 Tennessee 38
20 Iowa 37
21 North Dakota 36
22 Kansas 36
23 North Carolina 35
24 Nebraska 35
25 Indiana 32
26 Wisconsin 31
27 Maine 31
28 Georgia 31
29 Alaska 31
30 South Dakota 27
31 Vermont 24
32 Oregon 24
33 New Jersey 24

I don't really want to go into a big debate. Let me sum it up by saying that all things considered, NJ doesn't really deserve the level of bashing it receives. It's not the ideal place to live, but it's far from the worst.

Another tidbit, Central NJ has one of the lowest occurances of dangerous wildlife in the whole country. We have no poisonous snakes, very few spiders, no scorpions, etc. We do get the occassional shark attack. It's actually funny that my wife is terrified of snakes and she has no idea how much of a non issue it is when I run a northern brown over with the lawnmower.

 

[Mustangfreak]

Ok, ok, enough with the jersey bashing. I'm 31 years old and lived here my whole life. There are plenty of things to complain about but here's a list of things I've never had to deal with:

1. Hurricane
2. Tornado
3. Flood
4. Earthquake
5. Massive school shooting
6. Terrorist attack
7. Wildfires
8. Bad draught

All this crap seems to happen elsewhere. I don't know, the taxes don't seem all that bad.

I'll deal with the tordado's and draughts to live in my home state. Texas is worth it. :rockin:

 

[camiller]

Practice a little civil disobedience - don't obey it and hope they catch you doing so. Then challenge the law (preempted by Fed. homebrewing law).

Disclaimer: IANAL

IIRC the federal law does not have a premption clause. For Copyright Law Title 17 Section 301 says (paraphrasing) Only the Federal Government can enact copyright law. No such premption exists in the federal homebrewing law.

 

[Ryan_PA]

State Number of disaster declared
11 Pennsylvania 42

Really?!?! Hmm, I imagine most of these are older.

FYI, the no hurricane thing had me laugh a little, I was in Jersey for Hurrican Gloria in '85. Twas a little more than a drizzle, which resulted in some larger puddles the news may have labeled as flooding...but you know the media.

I can respect taking up for your home state. I have alot of family on the beaches in NJ, but there is a lot of nonsense to deal with in that state. The government is really corrupt (I know Philly is just as bad). The auto insurance has to be the highest in the country, and your "jug-handels" are grounds for all of the abuse you are taking. WHY CAN'T I TURN LEFT FROM THE LEFT LANE!!!!!!

 

[Bobby_M]

WHY CAN'T I TURN LEFT FROM THE LEFT LANE!!!!!!

Cuz some bluehair would probably T-bone your ass with her Buick.

One of the biggest reasons I continue to live here is for the money. A few folks I know moved down to Alabama and Tennessee to get away from it all. "houses are like $100k there!!!" Ok great, what do the jobs pay? $19k a year. It's all relative. I'll have my house paid off in about 10 years at which point I could probably retire out of state. Either that or I'll convince my boss to let me work remotely full time and move somewhere cheaper.

 

[Ryan_PA]

Cuz some bluehair would probably T-bone your ass with her Buick.

Thats true. I love your produce stands in south jersey though. and good turky/pheasent hunting if you know the right spots.

Edit - What will stop them from t-boning you when you cross the intersection?

 

[Evan!]

Compare those numbers to almost any other shore state.

State Number of disaster declared
1 Texas 81
2 California 73
3 Florida 59
4 New York 56
5 Oklahoma 53
6 Louisiana 53
7 Alabama 46
8 Kentucky 45
9 Ohio 43
10 Illinois 43
11 Pennsylvania 42
12 Mississippi 42
13 Arkansas 41
14 West Virginia 40
15 Washington 40
16 Missouri 40
17 Minnesota 40
18 Virginia 39
19 Tennessee 38
20 Iowa 37
21 North Dakota 36
22 Kansas 36
23 North Carolina 35
24 Nebraska 35
25 Indiana 32
26 Wisconsin 31
27 Maine 31
28 Georgia 31
29 Alaska 31
30 South Dakota 27
31 Vermont 24
32 Oregon 24
33 New Jersey 24

I don't really want to go into a big debate. Let me sum it up by saying that all things considered, NJ doesn't really deserve the level of bashing it receives. It's not the ideal place to live, but it's far from the worst.

Another tidbit, Central NJ has one of the lowest occurances of dangerous wildlife in the whole country. We have no poisonous snakes, very few spiders, no scorpions, etc. We do get the occassional shark attack. It's actually funny that my wife is terrified of snakes and she has no idea how much of a non issue it is when I run a northern brown over with the lawnmower.

Apply the factor of total square mile ratio to these numbers. For example:

Texas: 268,601 Square Miles
New Jersey: 8,722 Square Miles

Factor of: 30.8

24 Disasters x 30.8 = 739

Now, I know that they aren't really perfectly congruent factors (square miles versus disaster probability), but you really do have to admit that when your state is 30 times as big, it's bound to have a few more problems.

 

[Ó Flannagáin]

I'll deal with the tordado's and draughts to live in my home state. Texas is worth it. :rockin:

Man, I've been living in Texas for 2 months and I hate it here... can't leave til Mar 08 though

 

[Ryan_PA]

Remember last year when NYC had some funk about it (originally thought to be a gas leak), they blamed Jersey. That was funny. They could not figure out where it was coming from, so it had to be NJ.

Jersey is the root cause of everything.

 

[Soulive]

Man, I've been living in Texas for 2 months and I hate it here... can't leave til Mar 08 though

Yeah you don't strike me as the type to enjoy residing in Texas

 

[ShortSnoutBrewing]

Having been born and raised in NJ till I was 22, and living near the shore I have vivid memories of huricanes, floods, and sewage filled beaches. No thank you. I'm happy and at home in the Pacific Northwest.

 

[Bobby_M]

Pacific Northwest is probably where I'd move also.

 

[iamjonsharp]

Here's a photo of a typical roadway, provided by the New Jersey DOT:

 

[Soulive]

Here's a photo of a typical roadway, provided by the New Jersey DOT:

Nope, not so much. If we're generalizing, the last time I rode through VA was the only time I've seen a grown man in a diaper giving a rap performance...

 

[iamjonsharp]

Nope, not so much. If we're generalizing, the last time I rode through VA was the only time I've seen a grown man in a diaper giving a rap performance...

So you've met my cousin!

 

[jezter6]

Nope, not so much. If we're generalizing, the last time I rode through VA was the only time I've seen a grown man in a diaper giving a rap performance...

Technically the Parliament Funkadelic play all over the USA, so that's not really a VA specific thing.

I was kinda scared when I saw them in concert myself, but hey - it was funny.

 

[Soulive]

Technically the Parliament Funkadelic play all over the USA, so that's not really a VA specific thing.

I was kinda scared when I saw them in concert myself, but hey - it was funny.

Last time I saw them, the show sobered me up. It was like reverse effect...

Bottom line is, everyone's state has pros & cons. We all know that no state is perfect...

 

[Evan!]

Last time I saw them, the show sobered me up. It was like reverse effect...

Bottom line is, everyone's state has pros & cons. We all know that no state is perfect...

Some states are less perfect than others

 

[iamjonsharp]

Last time I saw them, the show sobered me up. It was like reverse effect...

Bottom line is, everyone's state has pros & cons. We all know that no state is perfect...

This is how we like to park here in Virginia:

 

[olllllo]

What state is it that requires you to get your dope tax stamp?
My guess is that the NJ law is there so that if you run afoul of Federal law then NJ can get their slice of the pie and get you for evasion.

Ain't no party like a P-Funk party...

 

[Soulive]

These are my Jersey-style cousins-in-law...

 

[Bobby_M]

Hah, the last time I visited virginia it was on a business trip during that sniper incident. We were all ducking and weaving our way from the car to the hotel.