Hefe Hell

[MisterE]

I brewed a lovely sounding all grain Hefe Weizen last week, cooled it, pitched at 70 and slowly cooled it down to the fermentation temps asked for in the recipe, around 62 degrees. Though this seemed cool for an ale yeast, I was confident in the recipe... And now a week later, after patiently watching the temp and the airlock... I am loosing faith. I have seen no bubbles, I have seen no Krausen and I am getting THIRSTY.

Could there be anyone out there with a clue as to what I have done wrong? Is this a batch destined to be a fine toilet cleaner or is there hope yet?

Any tips would be much appreciated.

Best

Dimitris

 

[usfmikeb]

What yeast are you using, and did you make a starter? Have you taken a hydrometer reading?

 

[Stevo2569]

Those temps are fine. Sounds like you didn't pitch enough. Take a gravity. Swirl it a little and raise the temp a little. If that doesn't work you could add some amalyze enzyme and or re pitch some more yeast. Was it all grain? What kind and how much yeast did you pitch?

 

[Piratwolf]

Take a gravity.

This, first. I brewed a mild 2 weeks ago that never developed krausen, and a porter this past weekend that never bubbled my airlock. But the mild fermented right down to my expected FG and the porter (once I took off the plastic bucket lid) had a thick, active krausen. My point is only that all fermentations can be different... although that is a bit odd with a wheat beer!

Once you've established lack of fermentation as a scientific fact via hydrometer, it's time to consider other options like re-pitching big, healthy, active starter of yeast. (I'm assuming you've already warmed the temp up a bit and roused the present yeast.)

 

[AmandaK]

1) Gravity reading.

2) Next time, pitch at 62*. Don't pitch at 70* and then lower the temperature. Your yeasties won't like that.

3) Gravity reading.

 

[aubiecat]

1) Gravity reading.

2) Next time, pitch at 62*. Don't pitch at 70* and then lower the temperature. Your yeasties won't like that.

3) Gravity reading.

Yeast don't mind being cooled down if it is done gradually but if your temperature drops rapidly it can shock them into dormancy.
Ale yeast can be more sensitive to this than lager yeast.

 

[beernut70]

The instructions for WLP380 says to pitch between 70-75 and hold until active fermentation starts. Then ferment between 66-70 so I don't think there is a problem dropping to your fermentation temperature.

 

[usfmikeb]

I had asked what yeast it was specifically due to the ferment temp, as I haven't seen a wheat yeast that ferment at 62.

 

[BigRob]

Most Hefe yeasts ferment in the 60s.

 

[usfmikeb]

Most Hefe yeasts ferment in the 60s.

Yeah, in the 68 range. Never heard of one at 62 before.

 

[BigRob]

They work just fine in the low 60s, I ferment at 62F and 64F depending on the strain. I also pitch in the mid-50s. I found a vast improvement in my hefe's after reading a fair bit on HBT and other places like Braukaiser.

 

[MisterE]

The yeast was WLP300. I think I found the problem... The recipe called for two vials. Damn. I will get everything sanitized and check the FG it should have been done by today anyway as for the original primary schedule. I tried raising the temp slowly to around 65, but again, no action. So I took it patiently back down to 62. More Info to come.

Thanks for the advice

 

[duboman]

Are you absolutely sure there was no activity, did you open the lid, if a bucket and see no ring of krausen, did you take a gravity reading to verify the beer is still at its OG and not now at FG??

I've made several hefes using both 003 and 3068 and I pitch cold at 60 and ferment at 62 because I like the clove and hate the banana. In addition, 1 vial or 2 will not cause the issue you're having. In fact hefes prefer to be under pitched and fermented towards 70 to bring out the preferred banana notes of the yeast.

What was the date on your yeast, did you make a starter to ensure it was viable before you pitched?

Assuming fermentation never took place you can always buy a new vial and re-pitch....,

 

[usfmikeb]

WLP300's optimal ferm temperature is 68-72...

 

[BigRob]

It's also a banana party at those temps.

 

[tmm0f5]

Yeah, in the 68 range. Never heard of one at 62 before.

The Jamil Show on TBN recommends 62 specifically for Hefes and American Wheat.

 

[ak-71]

Yeah, in the 68 range. Never heard of one at 62 before.

"Brewing Classic Recipes" suggests 62F (for Roggenbier for example) for 3068
I managed to keep it @64F during the active stage (VERY active), just couldn't keep it cooler in a 59F room with a water bath and a T-shirt.
I had a healthy starter, O2 aeration and 3068 was very happy, no sulfur, thick foam (lost some through the tube). But I did gradually raise the temp to 68F after fermentation slowed down.

PS. For me starter and O2 makes a huge difference in lag, attenuation and general fermentation time and off-tastes. I know shaking shoud do it, Wyest package says I shouldn't need a starter, it's still better if I do O2 and a starer by Brewsmith IMHO

 

[usfmikeb]

I've never seen them brewed at those temps, but will have to try it next time.

 

[MisterE]

I brewed the recipe from Brewing Classic Styles for that very reason, I can't stand banana in my beer. The Belong in Splints and Fosters and that's about it. I carefully opened after three days to see what was going on and saw no Krausen Ring, nada. Almost as if I had forgotten to pitch. The yeast was new from the brewshop here and not past the expiration date and I neglected to make the starter assuming it was fresh and viable.

 

[Dok]

I would recommend if you don't want banana don't use this strain. I love WLP 351 (when its available) or Wyeast 3638. WLP 300 makes a good banana beer. Go to the White Labs site and look up the info on how much isoamyl acetate is produced in the mini fermentation by each strain.

: A complex alternative to the standard German wheat strain profile. This strain produces apple, pear, and plum esters in addition to the dominant banana character. The esters are complemented nicely by clove and subtle vanilla phenolics. The balance can be manipulated towards ester production through increasing fermentation temperature, increasing the wort density, and decreasing the pitch rate. Over pitching can result in a near complete loss of banana character. Decreasing the ester level will allow a higher clove character to be perceived. Sulfur is commonly produced, but will dissipate with conditioning. This strain is very powdery and will remain in suspension for an extended amount of time following attenuation. This is true top cropping yeast and requires fermenter headspace of 33%.

-from Wyeast 3638

 

[rjwhite41]

For those that seem to be in disbelief, I also pitch in the upper 50s and ferment at 62 for my hefe's.

 

[ghpeel]

I'll chime in with another vote for low-60's for Hefe's. Its not what the yeast bank's recommend, but they are much, much better at 62-65 than at 65-70, in my opinion. Unless you really, really love that Hefe banana flavor. Anything over 65F and you're in banana territory.

I just fermented a batch with WLP380 at 63F, after doing a ferulic acid rest at 112F. That combo yields virtually no banana, just a bare whiff of it, and its all clove/spice. If you do a single infusion mash and ferment that WLP380 at 63-65F, you'll get a very nice, balanced mix of clove & banana.

 

[usfmikeb]

I would recommend if you don't want banana don't use this strain. I love WLP 351 (when its available) or Wyeast 3638. WLP 300 makes a good banana beer. Go to the White Labs site and look up the info on how much isoamyl acetate is produced in the mini fermentation by each strain.

: A complex alternative to the standard German wheat strain profile. This strain produces apple, pear, and plum esters in addition to the dominant banana character. The esters are complemented nicely by clove and subtle vanilla phenolics. The balance can be manipulated towards ester production through increasing fermentation temperature, increasing the wort density, and decreasing the pitch rate. Over pitching can result in a near complete loss of banana character. Decreasing the ester level will allow a higher clove character to be perceived. Sulfur is commonly produced, but will dissipate with conditioning. This strain is very powdery and will remain in suspension for an extended amount of time following attenuation. This is true top cropping yeast and requires fermenter headspace of 33%.

-from Wyeast 3638

3638 is what I use for Hefes. I use an appropriate starter, pitch and ferment at 68, and only get mild banana undertones. Makes a great Hefe, IMO.