Fresh Corn in the Mash or Boil?

[jgln]

I was boiling and freezing all the corn we picked from the garden recently and with all the corn we got I was thinking of uses for it. Besides freezing the ears, making soups and feeding the buggy/wormy ones to the chickens I got to thinking brewing.

So, I see a lot of recipies using corn in different dried states but why can't you use it fresh, right off the cob?

 

[kanielb1]

You can eat it. You need to dry and malt to be able to extract the fermentable sugars from the corn. I dont think you can do anything else with it. I will be watching this thread to see what else can be done.

 

[Freezeblade]

Certainly, once it is boiled to free up the starches, put it in the mash with some base malt and it should convert your starches to sugars just fine. Perhaps a cream ale is in order, or some other lighter style.

 

[jgln]

Certainly, once it is boiled to free up the starches, put it in the mash with some base malt and it should convert your starches to sugars just fine. Perhaps a cream ale is in order, or some other lighter style.

Can't it be put in fresh into the mash and be converted there?

 

[dutch-brew]

I don't know how he did it, but a customer gave me a bottle of sweet corn wine.. i have it in my fridge right now..

 

[Bobby_M]

The starch really isn't going to be accessible if you put whole kernels in the mash. If it were me, I'd cook it first, then put it into a blender, then dump that into the mash.

 

[dutch-brew]

hmmm...how do they do it then when they make corn-whiskey..? hadn't thought about that.. they need to get the sugars out for that too, don't they?

 

[Bobby_M]

Well, you'd have to malt the corn first but that's a bit more work than using it as an adjunct in a mostly malted barley mash.

 

[jgln]

The starch really isn't going to be accessible if you put whole kernels in the mash. If it were me, I'd cook it first, then put it into a blender, then dump that into the mash.

So cutting it off the cob fresh, exposing the insided of the kernels, maybe smashing them some too, would still not work? It needs to be cooked first before adding to the mash? I am not using processed frozed corn that is whole kernels, I would be cutting it off the cob with a knife. I know it is not that big a deal to cook first, just want to understand the process.

My other question is does it really give flavor and if so how much to use for a 5gal recipe?

 

[big supper]

you need to cook it first. to gelatinize the starches, i think..........

 

[Denny]

You can eat it. You need to dry and malt to be able to extract the fermentable sugars from the corn. I dont think you can do anything else with it. I will be watching this thread to see what else can be done.

Most corn used in brewing is not malted. That's why you need to use it along with a diastatic grain.

 

[david_42]

gelatinize the starches

This is the process of partially dissolving the starch. It's a slow process at mash temperatures. Once gelatinized, the starch will breakdown in the mash.

Fresh corn is 50-60% water, so double the weight compared to flaked.

 

[Denny]

The starch really isn't going to be accessible if you put whole kernels in the mash. If it were me, I'd cook it first, then put it into a blender, then dump that into the mash.

Not necessary to cook it....corn gelatinizes at mash temps.

 

[Bobby_M]

CHeck out the footnote there.. "Starches made from these materials must always be cooked before mashing" and it's against corn, etc.

 

[Denny]

DOH!!!! My only excuse is that it's early here.....thanks for the correction!

 

[jgln]

Ok thanks guys, I understand what I need to do now and why.

 

[MVKTR2]

Not necessary to cook it....corn gelatinizes at mash temps.

That's a helpful little chart for the adventurous brewer, thanks Denny. Saved to my HD.

Schlante,
Phillip

 

[Bobby_M]

DOH!!!! My only excuse is that it's early here.....thanks for the correction!

...and the font was pretty darn small too. I bet it would still convert if added raw as long as it was pulverized.

 

[Denny]

I bet it would still convert if added raw as long as it was pulverized.

Yeah, I know of people who have done that. You'd probably want to extend the mash time, too, just to be sure.

 

[wendelgee2]

I know this thread is a year old, but it's sweet corn season again. Does anyone have anything to report on making a sweet corn beer? How much corn did you add? Was it basically neutral, or did it add any character? Any recipes you'd like to share??

 

[jgln]

I know this thread is a year old, but it's sweet corn season again. Does anyone have anything to report on making a sweet corn beer? How much corn did you add? Was it basically neutral, or did it add any character? Any recipes you'd like to share??

I didn't do it but I still have my fall crop in, I cooked and froze the first crop.

Off topic but I am not sure this crop is going to produce. The tops with the pollen are already out and the corn is barely an inch long. Seems to me the pollen will be gone before the silk appears, we will see.

 

[1Mainebrew]

So did anyone use their sweet corn from this fall in a brew? If so, que paso (what happpened)? How did it turn out? How did you use it? Boil it first then add to the mash after it's cooled a bit? I've been thinking about doing an American Light Lager with fresh sweet corn as an adjunct this upcoming harvest. Thanks for keeping the threat alive.

 

[Powers]

i just ate some frozen sweet corn that my in-laws put up last fall. it was so amazingly sweet that i just couldn't help but think about fermenting it. but, alas, i came here to see if anyone else had ventured down the path, and am coming up short on any insight. perhaps i will pioneer a 1 gallon batch...

 

[pjj2ba]

I meant to try this but never got around to it last year.

If one buys/grows a supersweet variety, then one could just cut it off the cob and homogenize it up and add it to the mash. The supersweet varieties have mutations that prevent starch formation so the kernel fills with sugars and it stays as sugars when picked (hence supersweet). In old fashioned sweet corn (only one mutation) the conversion to starch occurs, but is much slower than what happens in field corn. If one plants sweet corn and field corn too close together and the field corn pollinates the sweet, then your sweet corn will more quickly convert to starch once picked. Field corn would need to be cooked. Very fresh sweet corn would not need to be. I would cook less fresh (ie. less sweet) sweet corn.

 

[Powers]

but by your explanation, you would agree that putting sweet corn in the mash doesn't really matter. no conversion is necessary for sweet corn, so you could drop it in post-boil like fruit. but if there are some residual starches, putting it in the mash may help.

the problem with putting sweet corn in the mash is that you risk losing some of the fresh sweet corn flavor. that said, i have no idea what flavor would remain after fermentation.

jack keller has a wine recipe for cracked corn and also one for fresh corn (doesn't say sweet variety, but assume that's what it's for).

 

[Kyle999]

There are three ways to convert the starches to sugars. 1 You can add 6 row malts to your mash if you are using mostly corn. 2 you can malt your corn, there are plenty of forums that show how to do that. Or 3 you can get amylase enzyme from a homebrew shop or website. Both 2 and 3 will let you use 100% corn if you want. The amylase enzyme will work on any type of starches, it is the enzyme found in malted grains and is also in our saliva.

 

[Denny]

2 row malt has almost as much diastatic power as 6 row these days. Use 6 row for it's flavor, not necessarily the enzymes.