Framboise "clone" recipe

[RedIrocZ-28]

There is about 6" of beer added on top of the raspberry concoction. Take note of the color, a very ruddy brown contrasting the deep red of the raspberries. This was taken on Thursday, 2/10/11

Here it is about an hour ago on 2/12/11 after 39 hours in the secondary. Notice the color is already very different. The Raspberries on top are completely depleted of color and are a tan color. The yeast has re-awoken and is really working on this sugary mixture. There are chunks of raspberry floating near the surface.

 

[GuldTuborg]

Interesting - let us know how things turn out. Did you add pectic enzyme?

 

[Barc]

How much beer are you going to add? I've heard as high as 2 lb per gallon and as low as 1 lb per gallon to get much flavor. If you add about half a gallon of beer to that, it should be right in that range.

And boiling the raspberries probably set your pectin. Unless I'm mistaken, I don't think it will ever really clear up (i.e. it will have haze) if that bothers you. I could care less as long as it tasted good.

Oh, stop brewing and post more damn pics in the Boneyard!

EDIT... you answered my question before I could post! Looking good!

 

[RedIrocZ-28]

GuldTuborg, no Pectic enzyme, no.

Barc, I know there is less than a gallon, and less than a pound of raspberries so its roughly 1lb/gal on this batch.

 

[Houblon]

Boiling set the pectin 100% , needs more fruit

This beer started off as a straw colored blond before adding pounds & pounds of fruit- blueberry,rasberry,cherry,blackberry.
Then using dregs from a laundry list of beers> Cantilon Iris 2005, 3 Fonteinen Kriek, Fantome de noel, Orval and Guezes over the past 2+ yrs. Probably 20+ different beers in total along with a WY Lambic blend







I'll post a current pic later showing most of the fruit has been eatten, we're talking yrs and its still not done.

 

[RedIrocZ-28]

Wow I wish I had your patience!

Or well, I wish my sweety had your patience

I really want to do maybe 3 or 4 more test batches. The recipe cost me $17 to brew, plus fruit so far I'm at $25. If I make a fantastic beer thats over the top on raspberry goodness I'll probably have 5 gallons of it for around $85 or so. Not sure if it'll be like Framboise, probably not exactly, but hey, the experiment is fun.

 

[RedIrocZ-28]

Wanted to update this post. I stole about 3oz out of the fermenter yesterday night. I tasted it with the little woman. We both agreed it was very tart with raspberry, not overpowering but it was there, front and center. The body was very thin compared to what I was expecting, almost like a cider. I will need to do something else to get the mouthfeel up there. I did use 8oz bag of malto dextrine and 4oz cara-foam in this brew. But I feel it needs more mouthfeel to it. I did not take enough to do a gravity reading but my mouth tells me its 1.010 or lower.

I am wondering if the Lindeman's brewery uses any potassium sorbate to stop fermentation and then back sweetens with puree? Perhaps I'll have to try that. I would be worried about bubblegum flavor showing through though.

 

[alanwelam]

Carbonation should help the mouthfeel a little bit. The high carbonation levels of these lambics can add some body... you do want the gravity to be fairly low to give it that crisp/dry taste too.

In terms of wine, it will end up almost like a Riesling...

 

[Barc]

Lindemanns stops fermentation then pasteurizes. They use juice, sweetener, and extract to get the flavor / aroma.

 

[RedIrocZ-28]

Barc, i have read that too. HOW they stop fermentation is the big mystery to me. Any ideas?

As to the mouthfeel, I made an Irish Stout that I kegged 2 weeks ago. Coming out of the fermenter at 1.018 it was quite thick. This was very much more thin in body that I expected, considering that I used the same amount of cara pils and malto dextrine to try to up the body like I had done on the Irish Stout. They were worlds apart "straight out of the fermenter".

 

[GuldTuborg]

HOW they stop fermentation is the big mystery to me. Any ideas?

It doesn't really matter if they're pasteurizing anyway. My guess would be that's how they stop fermentation, but I can't say I know for sure.

 

[Houblon]

Heres a current pic showing how the cherries/fruit have been broken down.

 

[Barc]

Barc, i have read that too. HOW they stop fermentation is the big mystery to me. Any ideas?

As to the mouthfeel, I made an Irish Stout that I kegged 2 weeks ago. Coming out of the fermenter at 1.018 it was quite thick. This was very much more thin in body that I expected, considering that I used the same amount of cara pils and malto dextrine to try to up the body like I had done on the Irish Stout. They were worlds apart "straight out of the fermenter".

Don't get hung up on the fact that this is like any other lambic. The fermenation might stop on its own, at least partially, but I'm not 100% sure of the exact method. I am almost positive it has sulfites in it so it probably has a dose of campden (potassium or sodium metabisulfite) just in case the pasteurizing does not 100% kill everything. Keep in mind that it has sugar syrup in there and this syrup adds a lot to the mouthfeel and "thickness." Additionally, they are pretty well carbonated so that adds to the mouthfeel.

After talking with folks at Cantillon and other breweries in Belgium, I can tell you that they say Lindemans and other "sweet lambic" producers don't do anything like traditional lambic producers so far as fermentation and handling goes.

 

[SumnerH]

After talking with folks at Cantillon and other breweries in Belgium, I can tell you that they say Lindemans and other "sweet lambic" producers don't do anything like traditional lambic producers so far as fermentation and handling goes.

Jean-Pierre Van Roy hates Lindemans with a passion, though; he's not exactly unbiased in judging them.

Certainly the Cuvee Rene offerings from Lindemans have are pretty traditional, so they know _how_ to make a traditional lambic. And Lindemans' web site describes a fairly traditional process (30% wheat; turbid mash; aged hops; spontaneous fermentation; etc) even for their "less sour and more fruity Lambic" krieks and the like. http://www.lindemans.be/start/lambik/en/?PHPSESSID=76e8b7722446cdc0ecd3a455eb5fce8c

The translation there is a bit awkward and I'm not sure I take them at 100% face value either, so I'm not really sure what's the case.

 

[Barc]

Agreed. He did seem to be a bit biased!

And also agreed. They know how to make it traditionally. I doubt, however, the sweetened ones are done with that much care / time. If I was making a beer only to be sweetened to hell and back, I doubt I'd do it 100% traditionally as you'd lose so much of what you're after and, in that regard, why bother? I do taste some funk in there. How much is up for debate. Maybe they use a portion of "new" beer and then some small percentage of "aged" beer?

 

[RedIrocZ-28]

I do want to update a bit. The beer is very raspberry. Its also very high alcohol. It finished out at about 1.007-1.008, Couldn't tell exactly. I bottled 3 Framboise bottles full, carbonated to 4.0 units with table sugar (had no corn sugar on hand). And we plan to drink these within about 3 weeks when they're "done" being the test batch. I have a few pics I'll upload when I get home. The beer is not quite as red as framboise but it sure has that raspberry bite to it.

 

[Sol_Rosenberg]

2011 last update, wow. How did this turn out?

 

[RedIrocZ-28]

Just kegged it 9 days ago. Yes it is the batch I made wayyyyy back when I posted this, NO there was no yeast death. This sat on the cake for over 4 years. It was incredible. I will be making this again.