fish poo+ fert: for hops

[ReefkprZ]

This may be a new one on a lot of you. but I am a hardcore planted tank person, I used to do reef tanks, but I gave that up for now. but my planted tank is run on an Estimated index dosing schedule, which for non-planted fish tank people translates roughly to, dosing NON-limiting amounts of nutrients. I am talking pure KNO3, KH2PO4, K2SO4, and a micro nutrient dose of plantex CSM+B. all in pure form for my plants (this may seem extreme to some but I have flowering red tiger lotus lilies in my living room check here for pics http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/tank-journals-photo-album/129013-red-tiger-lotus-about-flower.html).

now, to the point of this thread. or the question rather. I do 50% waterchanges at periodic intervals to keep the nutrients at a predetermined level. does anyone think that the excess water will be be too high a nutient solution to use on hops. my roses love it, my peonies love it all my tulips and other bulbs love it. but with waterhungry hops am I risking burning the roots with this? I can tell you the nutrient level is low enough to allow fish to thrive (and breed).

I am just unfamiliar with growing hops so I don't know what they are susceptible to. if they are prone to fert burn I can tweak their water supply since I have pure forms of phosphate, potassium, nitrate etc..... any tips on hops fert requirements would be appreciated, should be getting my rhizomes soon.

 

[Hopfarmer]

Hops grown conventionally 160 lb n pr/acre.There is no way to over fert them.Hey get into some vermiculture to ,we are starting some now,wellst\etup any way at the farm Cheers Glen

 

[ReefkprZ]

my wife is creeped out by the thought of worms in the house.... since I live in maine the winters are fairly cold, I don't think they would winter over well outside. I would hate to get a mini ecosystem running just to have it all die off every winter. I personally would love to have one since soon our city is going to zero sort trash and recycling which means we will have to buy garbage bags at an exorbitant price to pay for any trash that has to be removed. I may go ahead and do it outside anyway just to reduce our garbage output during the summer.

hmm. I'll have to talk to my neighbor and see if he wants to build a 2 family composter not only will that help reduce trash but it wont put the "worm bin" in sight of my wife I could put it on the far side of the garage.

 

[Hopfarmer]

How about making a cold frame to put the wigglers in.I want to do it so I can turn my pile of hop waste(from picking) into worm casings and tea.Its a big pile at least 25000 lbs.Plus I can sell casings and tea to all the pot growers around here.I know a guy that has a trout farm about 120 miles away and I am going to try some of his fish poo.Anything that reduces my input costs and is good I will try.

 

[ReefkprZ]

the 5 or 10 degree difference afforded by a cold frame wont be enough to save the worms on -15 or -20 degree maine winter nights. if I did it out doors it would have to be a heated enclosure for the winter or it will freeze solid.

on a side note: I mentioned doing one out of doors for the summer at least and the wife mentioned about the worms dying in the winter, and she seems to be coming around to the Idea of doing in doors, especially if it can be clean and she doesnt have to see the worms. we are both pretty serious about trying to reduce the amount of garbage we create. so even though she is icked out by the thought, I think given some time she will agree that it is a good idea in the long run.

 

[DrJerryrigger]

As far as over fertilizing: Like any plant you can burn them with too much. I don't know numbers, but from a little internet search; hops relative cannabis like about 1200ppm in a hydroponic system. As there is moisture in your soil when you water, I think you could exceed that by 50% with out any worries.

 

[ReefkprZ]

As far as over fertilizing: Like any plant you can burn them with too much. I don't know numbers, but from a little internet search; hops relative cannabis like about 1200ppm in a hydroponic system. As there is moisture in your soil when you water, I think you could exceed that by 50% with out any worries.

1200ppm of what? or rather which? total?

thanks.

 

[DrJerryrigger]

1200ppm of what? or rather which? total?

thanks.

That's a total of dissolved salts.

Edit: I should add, though the plants are related, one is a annual, so the root structure is quite different, and the plants needs and tolerances may also be quite different.

 

[ReefkprZ]

you mean tds, total disolved solids?

 

[ReefkprZ]

Edit: I should add, though the plants are related, one is a annual, so the root structure is quite different, and the plants needs and tolerances may also be quite different.

absolutely, that's why I am trying to get as much first hand growing input as possible. Maine climate is a tough one, and for a perennial a proper root structure is very important. if you fert scorch a plant going into fall to force heavy fruiting chances are that plant is not coming back in the spring.

 

[B-Hoppy]

I am just unfamiliar with growing hops so I don't know what they are susceptible to. if they are prone to fert burn I can tweak their water supply since I have pure forms of phosphate, potassium, nitrate etc..... any tips on hops fert requirements would be appreciated, should be getting my rhizomes soon.

I think maybe you're putting a little too much thought into the whole hop growing scenario. They're basically weeds that 'dare you' to try to kill them. After growing them for 20+ years, it seems that the more you fuss over them, the poorer they perform. They prefer deep well drained soils but seem to grow on just about any type of soil. Topdress them with a little compost spring/fall and a little water if it doesn't rain and they'll be fine. When I first started growing them I was all excited and tried to use my agronomy degree on them but they didn't seem to care so now it's as simple as possible. I do feel, in my case, that the heavy clay they're in is pretty much the limiting factor when it comes to harvest. But a 1-2 pounds per plant isn't too shabby.

 

[DrJerryrigger]

absolutely, that's why I am trying to get as much first hand growing input as possible. Maine climate is a tough one, and for a perennial a proper root structure is very important. if you fert scorch a plant going into fall to force heavy fruiting chances are that plant is not coming back in the spring.

The best first year plants I've ever seen (not mine) where planted in lots of composted manure. They love lots of food, and organics will not burn them. Also there is a great advantage with long term soil structure, which is quite important with perennials.

 

[ReefkprZ]

I think maybe you're putting a little too much thought into the whole hop growing scenario. They're basically weeds that 'dare you' to try to kill them. After growing them for 20+ years, it seems that the more you fuss over them, the poorer they perform. They prefer deep well drained soils but seem to grow on just about any type of soil. Topdress them with a little compost spring/fall and a little water if it doesn't rain and they'll be fine. When I first started growing them I was all excited and tried to use my agronomy degree on them but they didn't seem to care so now it's as simple as possible. I do feel, in my case, that the heavy clay they're in is pretty much the limiting factor when it comes to harvest. But a 1-2 pounds per plant isn't too shabby.

this I like to hear.

my soil around my house is all fill with a little loam on top (very little). the disadvantage of living in the city. But I will most likely use a raised bed for the hops (both to keep them from getting mowed over, and to ensure they have some real soil to grow in).

 

[Hopfarmer]

Link to nutrient needs of Hops http://extension.oregonstate.edu/catalog/pdf/fg/fg79-e.pdf Cheers

 

[ReefkprZ]

I can't seem to open that link. I dont think I have any programs for PDF files going to have to install adobe

 

[Hopfarmer]

Adobe down loads for free.I just got a new computer as the old one crashed during shipping.Got it going till the new came.Cheers Glen