First time brewing

[Merledm]

That headspace is o.k. for the beginning but after a week or two the cider should be up to the neck.

The two on the left have been racked into the secondary. The right two are still in primary. I got the most foam in the first few days, it settled shortly after. Does it get foamy again in the secondary after a while?

 

[MarkKF]

The only foam you'll get is the first week. I rack into secondary after fermentation slows but before its done to insure the neck fills with CO2 then age at least 6 months.

 

[CMcPherson]

It's not so much about math -...

ultracrepidarian
[uhl-truh-krep-i-dair-ee-uh n]

adjective
1.
Noting or pertaining to a person who criticizes, judges, or gives advice outside the area of his or her expertise.

 

[slym2none]

hmm

 

[CMcPherson]

Just some good natured ribbing Slym.

 

[Merledm]

Yesterday (Day 20 I think), I tested and racked the last two batches. Two Nottingham, one with maple syrup. They tested 1.005 and 1.010 w/syrup. Both fizzy, fairly clear. At 1.005 it tastes like a slightly fizzy apple wine. I'd like a bit more carbonation. I recently bought some natural apple flavour at the brew store(no fermentable sugars). After sampling each batch I added a drop at a time in the remaining sample to taste. I tried a Stevia blend as well, very small amounts at a time. It's amazing how little it takes, too much is gross(bad aftertaste).
Likewise with the Apple flavour, too much is like apple candy extreme.
From sampling all four batches, I've concluded I like the cider when it's between 1.005 and 1.010.The path forward is to let sit in the secondary for a week or two, drop Campden tablets, let sit for a day or so, sweeten to taste with flavour and stevia(if needed) then bottle/carbonate and drink. I'm looking forward to carbonation. Any suggestions on paying with CO2? I've been told to do it with the cider cold. Is how much carbonation you get based on the psi thats applied or how much you shake it? Id like to achieve a finer carbonation to some of them. Any tips or tricks out there?

Just bartered for a 12-15lb bucket of honey, going to use it in the next batches. I see mead in the future as well.

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[Maylar]

I recently bought some natural apple flavour at the brew store(no fermentable sugars). After sampling each batch I added a drop at a time in the remaining sample to taste. I tried a Stevia blend as well, very small amounts at a time. It's amazing how little it takes, too much is gross(bad aftertaste).
Likewise with the Apple flavour, too much is like apple candy extreme.

That's my experience as well. I use flavor concentrate from Nature's Flavors and just 1/4 TSP per gallon is all that's needed. Any more and you get Jolly Rancher fake apple taste.
I haven't tried Stevia yet tho I just bought some ($$). I hate sweetener aftertaste, so I dunno if I'll risk it. I've used Xylitol with success though, 3 TBSP per gallon works for me.

From sampling all four batches, I've concluded I like the cider when it's between 1.005 and 1.010.The path forward is to let sit in the secondary for a week or two, drop Campden tablets, let sit for a day or so, sweeten to taste with flavour and stevia(if needed) then bottle/carbonate and drink.

Campden for what purpose? It won't stop fermentation.

I'm looking forward to carbonation. Any suggestions on paying with CO2? I've been told to do it with the cider cold. Is how much carbonation you get based on the psi that's applied or how much you shake it? Id like to achieve a finer carbonation to some of them. Any tips or tricks out there?

If you're talking about using Carbonater caps, yes it's a time, temperature and pressure thing. Lower pressure at cold temp. Time can be reduced by shaking.

 

[Merledm]

Campden for what purpose? It won't stop fermentation.

I thought Campden would bring the fermentation to a halt. I plan to consume it within two weeks of bottling. Should I worry about bottle bombs even if I'm using stevia as my sweetener? I was hoping the Campden and refrigeration would slow/stop any fermentation enough that I could sweeten with stevia/xylitol, carbonate and bottle, drinking it within two weeks.

I've noticed that the two batches with Nottingham were much clearer after racking than the M02 and S04
Temperatures have fluctuated a bit. Low side 60, high side 68..

 

[ericbw]

I thought Campden would bring the fermentation to a halt. I plan to consume it within two weeks of bottling. Should I worry about bottle bombs even if I'm using stevia as my sweetener? I was hoping the Campden and refrigeration would slow/stop any fermentation enough that I could sweeten with stevia/xylitol, carbonate and bottle, drinking it within two weeks.

I've noticed that the two batches with Nottingham were much clearer after racking than the M02 and S04
Temperatures have fluctuated a bit. Low side 60, high side 68..

First, campden will stop yeast or bacteria from reproducing. But it won't stop it on an active ferment.

Stevia and xylitol are not fermentable, so you won't get carbonation from it.

You need sugar and yeast to bottle carbonate. You're talking about trying to stop the yeast and adding non carbonating sweetener. If it all works, you'll get flat sweet cider.

 

[ericbw]

If you're carbonating in a keg (since you mentioned psi), i have success with putting it at 30 then putting it in the fridge. After 24 hours, reduce to 12 or so. In 2 weeks it is ready.

 

[Merledm]

If you're carbonating in a keg (since you mentioned psi), i have success with putting it at 30 then putting it in the fridge. After 24 hours, reduce to 12 or so. In 2 weeks it is ready.

That's great advice, thanks. I'm using a CO2 tank and regulator hooked up to an adapter to fit the 500ml green bottles. Tried one with my brother, hooked it up, turned the pressure to 30 and shook the bottle. It was too bubbly for me. I think I'll experiment with water to get the right amount of bubbly then try it with cider. I'm not sure if I'm going to try a keg yet. I'm only doing one gallon batches so far.

 

[Maylar]

First, campden will stop yeast or bacteria from reproducing. But it won't stop it on an active ferment.

Campden alone does nothing (other than being an antioxidant). Potassium sorbate and campden together will inhibit yeast reproduction.

I thought Campden would bring the fermentation to a halt. I plan to consume it within two weeks of bottling. Should I worry about bottle bombs even if I'm using stevia as my sweetener? I was hoping the Campden and refrigeration would slow/stop any fermentation enough that I could sweeten with stevia/xylitol, carbonate and bottle, drinking it within two weeks.

Campden will not stop fermentation. But your plan is still viable. Let the cider finish fermenting, and clear to whatever point you want it to. Then sweeten with Stevia/Xylitol and add priming sugar before bottling. I suggest carbonating to 2.4 or 2.5 "volumes of CO2" (that's how they measure carbonation). This calculator will tell you how much priming sugar to add:

http://www.northernbrewer.com/priming-sugar-calculator/

Test a bottle after 2 weeks to see what you have for bubbles. My last batch took a full month to fully carbonate.

Edit: If you're going to force carbonate, then skip the priming sugar. You can rack onto campden and potassium sorbate, wait 3-4 days, then sweeten with whatever you want and carbonate.

 

[ericbw]

Campden alone does nothing (other than being an antioxidant). Potassium sorbate and campden together will inhibit yeast reproduction.



Campden will not stop fermentation. But your plan is still viable. Let the cider finish fermenting, and clear to whatever point you want it to. Then sweeten with Stevia/Xylitol and add priming sugar before bottling. I suggest carbonating to 2.4 or 2.5 "volumes of CO2" (that's how they measure carbonation). This calculator will tell you how much priming sugar to add:

http://www.northernbrewer.com/priming-sugar-calculator/

Test a bottle after 2 weeks to see what you have for bubbles. My last batch took a full month to fully carbonate.

Edit: If you're going to force carbonate, then skip the priming sugar. You can rack onto campden and potassium sorbate, wait 3-4 days, then sweeten with whatever you want and carbonate.

Yes that's right about campden and sorbate. I misspoke.

And definitely right On priming sugar.

 

[ericbw]

That's great advice, thanks. I'm using a CO2 tank and regulator hooked up to an adapter to fit the 500ml green bottles. Tried one with my brother, hooked it up, turned the pressure to 30 and shook the bottle. It was too bubbly for me. I think I'll experiment with water to get the right amount of bubbly then try it with cider. I'm not sure if I'm going to try a keg yet. I'm only doing one gallon batches so far.

How long did you leave it on the gas? Keep it cold when carbonating so it absorbs faster. But lower pressure will also help to get it where you want it. It might take some trials with those bottles. Be careful!

 

[Merledm]

Campden alone does nothing (other than being an antioxidant). Potassium sorbate and campden together will inhibit yeast reproduction.

Test a bottle after 2 weeks to see what you have for bubbles. My last batch took a full month to fully carbonate.

Thanks, It's the potassium sorbate that I forgot. Gotta pick some up.

So, my plan is to test the batches again mid week, add Campden/potassium sorbate, wait a few days then force carbonate in the bottles.

 

[Merledm]

How long did you leave it on the gas? Keep it cold when carbonating so it absorbs faster. But lower pressure will also help to get it where you want it. It might take some trials with those bottles. Be careful!

Just a couple minutes after the bottle was shaken. I'm definitely going to experiment with water first.

 

[podz]

If you want to save on yeast and time, just make a 20 litre starter i.e. start a batch of cider as you normally would. After 3 days, split it 4 or 5 ways and start new batches.

That's what I normally do.

 

[Merledm]

So a month has past since I last posted. Life happens and the cider took a back bench. It was not a bad thing though, the two batches with Nottingham yeast cleared right up and the taste improved. I placed both batches in the fridge to slow any possible fermentation. I siphoned one batch into bottles, put a small amount of stevia( 100 grains ish) and a small drop of apple flavour, force carbonated and drank.
I found them very fresh tasting, dry to semi-dry with a nice roundness to the apple flavour, not heavy. I could drink this cider often. I was a little rushed getting the bottles ready. There were some off flavours but only in two bottles, my bad for not rinsing thoroughly. Getting the carbonation in each bottle consistent is going to be tricky. It definitely works best when the cider is cold.
I am definitely going to stay with 1 gallon batches for now. The jugs are proving very easy to transport, clean and maintain. Very little real estate is needed, so much better if I want to let a few batches sit for long periods of time. They are also more versatile for experimenting, which is my main goal.
I'm so very happy I started this journey, it's been a great learning experience. This was the first batch but not the last.
Brew on brothers and sisters!

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