First Brew went badly, need some help troubleshooting.

[jakegreen58]

Just to reiterate, this is my very first attempt at brewing beer. So I expected mistakes. Can you (EXP'ed brewers) help me identify the errors. I tried to brew a wheat beer. I had around ten pounds of wheat/barley (90:10) malt mashed, sparged w/ 170F water and then boiled + minimal hops and finished the wort successfully. I placed it in the fermenter and by 26 hours the fermenter was bubbling vigorously. I wanted to bottle condition the beer (as is customary w/ edelweiss) so I wanted to bottle it at 3 days. I ran into one problem, I couldn't properly siphon the beer out of the fermenter. Then I committed the worst crime. I tried to mouth siphon the beer into my bottling bucket. I was so frustrated at the siphon that I snapped it in half while I was working with it. To make the long story short I bottled the next day (day 4) with a new auto-siphon. I waited the allotted 11 days and took the specific gravity of each bottle that I tried. My starting gravity was 1.046 and my final gravity ranged from 1.012 to 1.011 over 6 bottles. The taste was horrible, I would never wish this beer even on my worst enemy. It tasted like sweet wort and a backwash of alcohol. I fear the fermentation stopped at some point and the wort never quite turned into beer. I believe my mistake was in bottling it (with no added sugar) at 4 days and killing the fermentation process by trying to bottle too early. Thus a flat somewhat alcoholic wort is what I have in bottles. The color and clarity is great. But this liquid is not beer. Is there a way to salvage it? Can I add a small amount of sugar to each bottle to get some fermentation and some carbonation to occur? What can I do in the future to avoid this situation and is there a way to save this beer. I call upon you, the beer pathologists among you. Lol.

* Edit: First, the recipe called for bottling after 3 days and conditioning for 11 days in the bottles. According to the recipe, no bottling sugar is needed because the fermentation in the bottle will lightly carbonate the beer. Second, I did transfer from the ferment-er to a bottling bucket before putting it into bottles.Thanks for the replies.

 

[brewski08]

Hm, interesting.

Never heard of anyone placing there beer in bottles so soon. I guess it's the same concept as casks.

How many days did you leave it in the bottle before you tasted it?

 

[jakegreen58]

11 days.

 

[hypergolic]

I can tell you what you can do to avoid this in the future. Don't bottle after 3 days. I am not an expert but I am not sure what you can do to save this batch.

 

[mrajc]

I am going to bottle about 6/7 day when fg stays the same then leave in bottles for 2 weeks if I don't drink before lol

 

[bige9920]

yeah i have never heard of bottling 3 days in. you prolly didnt give the yeast enough time to do its thing. i just brewed a wheat beer and i let it sit for 3 weeks without racking to secondary then i bottled. i have learned that beer needs time. also i learned how i hate that it takes time LOL. patience patience patience. what would you rather have, quicker beer or better beer?

 

[BrewerBear]

Did you bottle straight from fermenter using auto siphon? Beer needs time to finish,the recommendation is to take gravity reading and if it is the same for three days bottle. I usually just give it plenty of time(2 to 3 weeks for average gravity,longer for higher) then bottle. I bottle on my time once I am sure the beer is finished and yeast settled,no point rushing it. After bottling it is recommended at least 3 weeks to condition, I think most of us have drank them sooner, just don't worry if it's not where it should be if you do.

If the wort still had residual sugars it may finish and carb up, if it had to much remaining it may not be pretty.What did the recipe say f.g. should be?

 

[Special Hops]

You definitely bottled too soon. You should give it three weeks not three days to before you bottle. And then at least 2-3 weeks in the bottle.

What you have is under carbed, green beer. Not sure what else might have happened.

The only thing that could save your beer is time. Put it in a dark closets and forget about it for a month. Then try one and it see if it's better.

 

[jaynik]

Agree that your mistake was bottling way too soon. Bottle conditioned beer is fully fermented and is then put in bottles (generally unfiltered) and carbed with a little bottling sugar. The residual yeast in the beer will eat the sugar generating the co2 you desire for your finished beer.

I would personally be afraid that your current batch will explode since fermentation isn't/wasn't likely done, but hard to tell. I guess just box it up and leave it for a few weeks and give it another try. It'll take a few weeks to carb up anyway.

 

[Darwin18]

You bottled way, way too soon. I give my beers three weeks in primary and then move to the keg/bottle to condition/carbonate. Three weeks might be longer than necessary, but it has worked wells for me.

 

[kh54s10]

I also have never heard of anyone bottling with this procedure.
Bottle conditioning usually takes about 3 weeks. Wait another couple of weeks and try one, it might be totally different.

In the mean time read up on how most other brewers do it. Why try to reinvent the wheel?

 

[tonyc318]

+1 for putting those things in boxes. Maybe something like Rubbermaid totes and stored somewhere for another 3 weeks. You just might get bottle bombs since you bottled during active fermentation.

 

[Bobby_M]

All grain on your first attempt with 90% wheat and bottling on day 4. The odds of doing something wrong was probably close to 100%.

Was it wheat malt or flaked? What mash temp did you use?

 

[jakegreen58]

Okay let me start by saying, thanks for all the advice and suggestions. Let me clarify some of the process and why I chose to bottle at 3-4 days in the fermenter. The recipe I followed specifically called for bottling at 3 days. The book I was reading from is written by the Brooklyn Brew Shop. The specific recipe I was working with is called an Edelwiess that should be bottle conditioned. I understand that fermentation takes 2-3 weeks to complete. I assumed that the final stages of fermentation would happen in the bottle thus producing carbonation and a fully fermented beer. I will leave the beer in the bottles for a few weeks and see if it begins to taste like beer. Any advice about Hydrometer readings Like I said I started at 1.046 and the first reading 14 days out was 1.011. It is clear to me that fermentation did occur and is possibly still occurring. Keep sending ideas guys, this only helps me growing.

 

[jakegreen58]

All grain on your first attempt with 90% wheat and bottling on day 4. The odds of doing something wrong was probably close to 100%.

Was it wheat malt or flaked? What mash temp did you use?

I used Wheat Malt, no flaked wheat. My mashing temps were between 140F and 157F and I boiled at 210F. Your right though, this was an unorthodox-ed beer to begin with.

 

[Darwin18]

Bottle conditioned doesn't mean fermenting in the bottle...it's the period post fermentation when the beer carbonates, yeast settles out, and flavors mellow/meld. Your book gave you some pretty terrible advice IMO. Honestly, I doubt your beer will improve very much over time. I would give it a shot, but move on to brewing another batch.

 

[Alemann]

Yeah 2-3 weeks in fermenter then 2-3 weeks in bottles I'm surprised your bottles didn't explode

 

[JonM]

I'd say get rid of that book and start reading up on HBT, especially the stickies. Then don't get discouraged and try another batch!

 

[temptnmonkey]

Already a lot of comments describing what went wrong. Keep an eye out for bottles blowing up and gushing when opening.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is you can't take accurate hydrometer readings of partially or fully carbonated beer (bubbles will play some mean tricks)

 

[nicklepickles]

First, im a first tome poster and newbie brewer. Just wanted to add that brooklyn beer shop kits are very frustrating, ive made their nut brown ale and everday ipa, both were too frustrating for the timy amount of beer you get (only 1 gallon), so in the future id avoid their refill lits

 

[Darwin18]

Honestly, do yourself a favor and get a beginner kit from Northern Brewer, AHS, Midwest, etc. Their kits are solid.

I've never heard of Brooklyn Brew Shop but it from the posts in here, it just sound like they really have no idea of what they're doing.

 

[StanJohnson]

Is this an "April Fools" joke? I mean you did post this on April 1st at 01:11 am. Just askin'.

 

[cincydave]

Is this an "April Fools" joke? I mean you did post this on April 1st at 01:11 am. Just askin'.

This apparently is not a joke. Looked at Brooklyn Brew shop website, which was very hard to figure out, but couldn’t find the Edelweiss kit or recipe. Did find their book on Google books, but the edelweiss recipe was not part of the free preview. Found a blog from someone who did this one and he also bottled 3 days after brewing. http://beer-logging.blogspot.com/2012/03/211-edelweiss-ingredients-5-lbs-pale.html
With the variety of factors, mainly temperature, that can affect fermentation, it seems very risky to recommend bottling after 3 days due to possible bottle bombs. Seems they could be incurring liability with advice like that.

I would do as others have said. Put them in a Rubbermaid container in a cool place and forget about them for a month or three. Chill one up for a couple days and open carefully (gloves and goggles anyone).

Don’t let this first one discourage you. You just happened to pick a really weird recipe/process. Get a kit from one of the shops others have suggested and try again. I can almost guarantee you’ll have better luck.

 

[Pie_Man]

Just curious what your fermentation procedure was during the brief fermentation? Fermentation temperature control is extremely important and can be difficult given the Florida heat. Definitely implement the advice already given, but if you haven't done so already, research how to keep your beer and the yeast happy while fermenting. An old fridge/freezer with a temperature controller is the easiest IMO, but there are other methods using more low-tech options (search swamp coolers on the forum). Welcome to the forum and keep brewing.

 

[brewski08]

have you all lost your faith?!

i'm rooting for you, jake...i actually think this could be a hybrid fermentation/carbonation process, and i do think good beer will be produced.

give it a month and ferment in the low 60s.

 

[brewski08]

have you all lost your faith?!

i'm rooting for you, jake...i actually think this could be a hybrid fermentation/carbonation process, and i do think good beer will be produced.

give it a month and ferment in the low 60s.

...and by ferment i mean "bottle condition".

 

[jakegreen58]

I have not given up all hope in brewing beer. I believe it may be more difficult for me since I live in Florida. My fermentation temp is in the upper 70s, undesirable I know, but is there a strain of yeast that ferments better in the warmer range? I understand that the heat plays against me. I will let the beer sit for another couple of months before I toss it to see if it turns into beer. I have an IPA in the primary right now and I still have hope for it and there will be no early bottling for this one. I clearly need to get some sort of cooler. Has anyone ever modified a wine fridge to be a fermentation incubator? Florida Brewers, how do you do it?

 

[kc1123]

I just purchased the same book and that recipe stood out to me as something I really wanted to try. Keep us updated! Until then I think I'll hold off on trying this out.

 

[ludomonster]

A basic approach is to put the fermenter in a bucket of water and control the temperature by occasionally adding ice. This approach will give you temperature swings, but the thermal mass of the water should keep it slow enough to keep up. There are other DIY designs that range from cheap to "How much money do you have?" Check out Son of Fermentation chiller.

 

[Pie_Man]

I have not given up all hope in brewing beer. I believe it may be more difficult for me since I live in Florida. My fermentation temp is in the upper 70s, undesirable I know, but is there a strain of yeast that ferments better in the warmer range? I understand that the heat plays against me. I will let the beer sit for another couple of months before I toss it to see if it turns into beer. I have an IPA in the primary right now and I still have hope for it and there will be no early bottling for this one. I clearly need to get some sort of cooler. Has anyone ever modified a wine fridge to be a fermentation incubator? Florida Brewers, how do you do it?

Check back earlier in the thread. A wine fridge with a temp. controller would be ideal. You can also use a swamp cooler. Upper 70s is too warm for most yeast and will give your beer off flavors.

 

[yancydc]

Give the remaining bottles to your mortal enemies, and tell them to sleep with the bottles under their necks.

 

[Bamsdealer]

Pop em all open and try to kick up the fermentation again with a gallon of prepared wort. Leave it go for another week or two and bottle with a little sugar... U may be able to turn an undrinkable beer into a terrible one

 

[william_shakes_beer]

LHBW makes their coin by selling ingredients. 14 days batch means you're coming back quicker to buy more. For ingredients go to the store. For advice come here. What did you use for a fermentation/bottling schedule on the second batch?

 

[Pie_Man]

I have not given up all hope in brewing beer. I believe it may be more difficult for me since I live in Florida. My fermentation temp is in the upper 70s, undesirable I know, but is there a strain of yeast that ferments better in the warmer range?

I haven't used this yeast before, but it's temperature range is 70-80F, WLP568 Belgian Style Saison Ale Yeast Blend. Saisons are nice summer beers too. Might be something you'd like to try while you're working out your fermentation temperature controller approach. There are other yeasts listed on whitelabs.com that have similar temperature ranges.

 

[jakegreen58]

I have now purchased a wine fridge that my carboy can fit into. I will use that from now on. I still have the IPA in the primary it is at 2 weeks, right now. I am a little scared to bottle it. I have the same fear that the same thing happened to the IPA that happened to the Edelweiss. It also fermented in the upper 70's. I would like to know if you guys think that I should place it in the wine fridge for a couple of weeks longer before I bottle it or bottle it now (assuming fermentation is done) and then put it in the wine fridge?

 

[kc1123]

Hi Jake. I just started brewing stuff from Brooklyn Brew Shop and based on everything I've read, the two weeks in primary and two weeks in bottle is not enough time. I left my Everyday IPA in primary for three weeks, then bottled. No exploding bottles at all. I'm not gonna crack anything open until 3 or 4 weeks in bottle.

See this video about bottle conditioning time:
[ame]http://youtu.be/FlBlnTfZ2iw[/ame]

I would give your IPA at least a little more time at room temp. Putting it in the fridge after that will help drop a lot of the cloudiness out, but some yeast will remain in suspension for bottle conditioning.

Good luck! I have yet to taste my first brew.

 

[ScoRas]

have you all lost your faith?!

i'm rooting for you, jake...i actually think this could be a hybrid fermentation/carbonation process, and i do think good beer will be produced.

give it a month and ferment in the low 60s.

This is my interpretation as well. I did some googling, and it seems like this style is traditionally put into casks while still fermenting. Glass bottles seem dangerous in my opinion, but I guess with experience, one could measure the gravity and bottle just before fermentation was done.

I might try this in a tap-a-draft bottle with a 15 PSI regulator cap.

 

[jakegreen58]

Hi Jake. I just started brewing stuff from Brooklyn Brew Shop and based on everything I've read, the two weeks in primary and two weeks in bottle is not enough time. I left my Everyday IPA in primary for three weeks, then bottled. No exploding bottles at all. I'm not gonna crack anything open until 3 or 4 weeks in bottle.

See this video about bottle conditioning time:
http://youtu.be/FlBlnTfZ2iw

I would give your IPA at least a little more time at room temp. Putting it in the fridge after that will help drop a lot of the cloudiness out, but some yeast will remain in suspension for bottle conditioning.

Good luck! I have yet to taste my first brew.

Thanks for posting that great video, it helps me understand what I should be looking for. I am about ready to begin taking FG readings to see if it's steady.