Equally Obnoxious Hockey Trash Talk Thread, eh?

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emjay said:
Hah. I don't get that impression of Healy at all. Not saying he's always positive, but I haven't found him to be overly negative. Then again, I never heard that Reimer bit, which would definitely be bullshìt... just unbelievable. He may be trying to cultivate a Don Cherry-like persona, but Don Cherry's grinch/cynical attitude he has a lot of the time isn't even like that; he generally has a point he's trying to communicate, rather than being an ******* just for the sake of being an *******.

And speaking of the Leafs (and two goalies in particular... everything that's been passed up so far makes Burke's and the MLSE's apology and subsequent promises ring so false. The only thing that would justify it for me is if they've been holding out for a strong possibility of nabbing a Canucks goalie, in which case I'd immediately cream my pants, but I'm not exactly going to be holding my breath for that.
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I love how Burke isn't making a drastic move, it's finally what I've wanted for so long. Mpatience and develop from within. Make trades only if they benefit the team long term. Been a long time coming.
 
Barnzy02 said:
Nashville matches.

Expected it. Still bummed.
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I'm shocked. I was expecting them to let him go with the understanding that a trade with the Flyers for players in exchange for some of their first rounders would follow. I don't know how Nashville has this kind of money - $160 million tied up between Weber and Rinne alone.
 
jtkratzer said:
I'm shocked. I was expecting them to let him go with the understanding that a trade with the Flyers for players in exchange for some of their first rounders would follow. I don't know how Nashville has this kind of money - $160 million tied up between Weber and Rinne alone.
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Huh, me too. I guess everyone's contracts are structured way differently than Kovalchuks(rolls eyes).
 
Shane Doan is an idiot...he's 35 and wants a 4 year deal that carries a $7.5 million cap hit to leave the Coyotes? Fine, play the rest of your career with a team that will not win the Cup in any of those 4 years.
http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=401580

That demand is just stupid for a guy who hasn't put up more than 60 points since 2008-2009.

Who else carries a $7.5 mil cap hit?
Parise - hasn't been below 62 points in a full season since his rookie year.
Suter - not really that far behind and he's a d-man.
Heatley - nearly a point per game player over his career, but declining over the last few. Still managed 199 points over the last 3 seasons compared to Doan's 165.
Gaborik - had 210 points in the last three seasons and 26 more than Doan last year.
Stamkos - over 90 points each of the last three seasons (283 total).


Who the eff does Doan think he is? If he really just wants to stay with the Coyotes, then sign a farking contract and finish off the last few holes of the back nine of your career and go away quietly. Too late to avoid looking like an a**hole, though.
 
Doan's family is settled in Phoenix, and would prefer to stay there, so I don't think it's all that unreasonable to demand a lot to go somewhere else. It's not necessarily that he thinks he's worth that much, nor does he expect to get it - but it's what he feels is needed to justify uprooting his family and everything. Can't blame him.
 
I'd love for him to come to Detroit, but I'm not holding my breath. We need D more than another forward and probably won't give $$ away to a forward to get him to join the team.

35 isn't so bad. I think that was the average age of the Red Wings players for a few years...
 
emjay said:
Doan's family is settled in Phoenix, and would prefer to stay there, so I don't think it's all that unreasonable to demand a lot to go somewhere else. It's not necessarily that he thinks he's worth that much, nor does he expect to get it - but it's what he feels is needed to justify uprooting his family and everything. Can't blame him.
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I understand, but that number is selfish for what he gives the team and I understand the leadership experience, but by the nature of playing for Phoenix, it doesn't mean squat in the playoffs.
 
jtkratzer said:
I understand, but that number is selfish for what he gives the team and I understand the leadership experience, but by the nature of playing for Phoenix, it doesn't mean squat in the playoffs.
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The point is, he doesn't WANT to move. It's not that he's trying to rip anyone off or even thinks that it's a fair price. It's just that he needs a lot to justify the move. The extra money is just reflective of how much he wants to stay. Doan is a big family man, and strikes me as actually a pretty humble guy.

With that in mind, I don't think there's anything ridiculous about it. Although I doubt he'll get it, and imagine he doesn't think he'll get it either. And I'm pretty he'll be totally fine with that.
 
emjay said:
The point is, he doesn't WANT to move. It's not that he's trying to rip anyone off or even thinks that it's a fair price. It's just that he needs a lot to justify the move. The extra money is just reflective of how much he wants to stay. Doan is a big family man, and strikes me as actually a pretty humble guy.

With that in mind, I don't think there's anything ridiculous about it. Although I doubt he'll get it, and imagine he doesn't think he'll get it either. And I'm pretty he'll be totally fine with that.
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So then what does Phoenix ultimately give him?
 
emjay said:
The point is, he doesn't WANT to move. It's not that he's trying to rip anyone off or even thinks that it's a fair price. It's just that he needs a lot to justify the move. The extra money is just reflective of how much he wants to stay. Doan is a big family man, and strikes me as actually a pretty humble guy.

With that in mind, I don't think there's anything ridiculous about it. Although I doubt he'll get it, and imagine he doesn't think he'll get it either. And I'm pretty he'll be totally fine with that.
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So why hasn't he signed a deal with Phoenix? Why is he even a UFA? If he's such a humble guy that doesn't want to move, why didn't e get a contract in place before the end of the season? Why does it matter what's going on with Phoenix's ownership? It will be years before any other city has an arena and infrastructure to support an NHL franchise. Look how long it took Winnipeg to get a team back. Maybe they can be Atlanta's third team.
 
jtkratzer said:
So why hasn't he signed a deal with Phoenix?
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Dunno, you'd probably have to ask him or his agent. I imagine it's all just part of negotiations and trying to get the best deal he can from Phoenix, but unlike many here, I'm not going to pretend to be able to answer such a question. What I DO know is that many people close to him have repeatedly said that he wants to stay in Phoenix for his family's sake... though there's no doubt an extra pile of money could mean a lot to a family either, if it's big enough. I just don't see anything here that doesn't fit with any of that, so I'm inclined to believe it

By no means am I particularly a fan of Doan, or even Phoenix (though I'd love to see Balsillie get his wish and bring them to Ontario), but I just don't think it's fair to be attacking the guy with the things stated above when it's probably far from the truth. If it turns out he really believes he's worth that much, then he can go **** himself for all I care, but it just seems beyond unlikely to me.
 
what they are saying in the papers up here is that he does not want to sign a long term deal with phoenix and then have to move if the team relocates after a year or 2 so he wants to see if the ownership situation will be a little more stable.
 
I just don't see the need to go public with that. I'm not attacking the guy and we'll see what he ultimately signs for. I have to think he knows he won't get the $7.5.
 
Agreed on the amount. The number of guys in the league who should be signed for that amount I can count on my fingers, maybe even one hand.
Stamkos
A healthy crosby
Malkin
lundqvist (sp?)
Giroux
Chara
Weber?
Doughty?
 
jtkratzer said:
I just don't see the need to go public with that. I'm not attacking the guy and we'll see what he ultimately signs for. I have to think he knows he won't get the $7.5.
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I'm also pretty sure that he knows he won't get it... as far as going public with it, I think it's just a negotiation strategy.

Goofynewfie said:
Agreed on the amount. The number of guys in the league who should be signed for that amount I can count on my fingers, maybe even one hand.
Stamkos
A healthy crosby
Malkin
lundqvist (sp?)
Giroux
Chara
Weber?
Doughty?
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Doughty definitely made a case for himself, but I'm a bit surprised you put Lundqvist up there as the ONLY goalie.

Stamkos went to my high school. He was a freshman in my senior year. The kid was actually a total nerd, but I'd imagine that's the case with just about anyone who dedicates themselves so entirely to a single thing.

It's definitely cool to see the absolute machine he's become... that once-nerd is *carrying* a freaking NHL team. He also plays in my local softball beer league when he's back home in the summer (on a team with a bunch of his old HS friends), and unsurprisingly, he totally carries those nerds as well.

punkrockdave said:
I'd pay 7.5 mill not to live in Zona. Christ, whatta pit.
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You and me both! People who WANT to live there definitely have a screw loose.
 
emjay said:
He also plays in my local softball beer league when he's back home in the summer (on a team with a bunch of his old HS friends), and unsurprisingly, he totally carries those nerds as well.
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Ha! You get best at softball by a team of nerds!
 
I love how they wait so long to hammer this crap out. Did they forget the CBA was expiring?

NHL presents some ridiculous offer. NHLPA takes 3 weeks, then presents their own offer, some of which contains concessions and good ideas. NHL laughs it off as something from "another world".

And all this happening a month before training camp. What a farce.
 
I hate to pick sides, since all I really want is hockey, but I agree that the players seem to have counter offered with some pretty good concessions right out of the gate, while the NHL seems to have started out offering to make huge cuts to player income and rights. I don't know the details, and perhaps the league *should* have started in a position to give somethings back, but it seems the players are offering a reasonable counter and I don't understand why the league has to portray the counter in such a negative fashion.

And they want to take away player arbitration?? WTH? It almost seems as if they added that just to be able to give something (or appear to) when they finally get down to brass tacks.

I may be hated for saying this, but I just wish Bettman would just choke on his own ck and die. He's done nothing positive for the league that I can see. He's running straight toward another lockout just when things are starting to pick up again.

Last time the players made huge concessions and the league was happy they had a contract they could live with for years. Now they need MORE huge concessions?? So they can prop up some clubs in cities that don't really want hockey?? So they can expand into some other cities who can't appreciate the sport?

I've never been a fan of his, but at this moment I'm really starting to hate him for ruining what should be an exciting time in hockey.
 
It's a fallacy to believe that Bettman is operating with total autonomy. He's only doing what his bosses tell him - but in his own greasy, snaky way.

I don't think a deal will be done until late January. Then they'll postpone the WC a couple weeks, leaving the 110,000 fans who are going to see the Leafs/Wings scrambling for alternate hotel, transportation, and vacation arrangements.

I'd like to believe that both sides would work together to come to an agreement quickly, but when I see them taking week-long breaks before even talking to one another, I have little faith. The owners know we'll all be back, so what the hell do they care whether or not they lose a couple months to get their extra millions in the long-run?
 
Bettman is a moron, that much is for sure. This league is not like the NFL or Major League Baseball where they roll in highly rated playoffs, huge TV money, and sustained national interest. Sure some of the more Hockey-centric teams will recover nicely if we have a lock out. Others were on very shaky ground to begin with.

It makes no sense to me to have an NHL lockout if your job is to maintain and grow the sport. Get to the friggin table and work out a deal.
 
solbes said:
Bettman is a moron, that much is for sure. This league is not like the NFL or Major League Baseball where they roll in highly rated playoffs, huge TV money, and sustained national interest. Sure some of the more Hockey-centric teams will recover nicely if we have a lock out. Others were on very shaky ground to begin with.

It makes no sense to me to have an NHL lockout if your job is to maintain and grow the sport. Get to the friggin table and work out a deal.
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The last lockout led to record attendance and increased profits, and arguably a better on-ice "product" (I hate when they call hockey a product, by the way).

So history kind of works against your statements here.
 
" the nhl says they won't play past september 15th on the current deal, apparently they don't like the deal they designed" -Henrik Lundqvist
 
paulster2626 said:
The last lockout led to record attendance and increased profits, and arguably a better on-ice "product" (I hate when they call hockey a product, by the way).

So history kind of works against your statements here.
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It took years for them to get back to where they were.

I'm not positive the on-ice product is better. More even, maybe. There were some good rule changes that helped and some not so good rule changes. Neither of which were related to the lock outs, just the natural course of evolution of a sport.
 
paulster2626 said:
(I hate when they call hockey a product, by the way)
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Unfortunately, that is the nature of the beast. Major league sports are, first and foremost, a business. The game itself is secondary.

I don't have empathy for either side of table. I can't relate to a player who earns as much for one game as most people make in a year.

They probably won't be playing until January.

jackasses, one and all
 
I remember driving downtown Toronto one day. I heard on the radio that the League, the NHLPA, Wayne Gretzky, Lemieux, and a few other friggin legends were all together trying to hammer out a deal. It was in, like, late January. Word was it was now or no season. I was so hopeful, clinging on to every word the radio had to report.

The next day, the season was cancelled.

Never again will I care what the billionaires are fighting about with the millionaires. Yeah, I'll be here when this whole mess is over, but jaded and cynical. Wake me up when these fools get something done. It seems the League has been planning for a lockout since day 1. Makes sense, given that a large number of teams lose money if the season starts anyway.

I hate these idiots.
 
I think another lockout so soon after the last one will seriously hurt the league. I would be very surprised if there aren't masses of fans who just give up on the NHL.

That being said, everybody has a lot to lose if there's another lockout, but it will hurt the ownership more than the players. Hopefully they realize that there's FAR more to lose with another lockout than merely the terms that are being disputed. I can only hope that common sense prevails.
 
emjay said:
I think another lockout so soon after the last one will seriously hurt the league. I would be very surprised if there aren't masses of fans who just give up on the NHL.

That being said, everybody has a lot to lose if there's another lockout, but it will hurt the ownership more than the players. Hopefully they realize that there's FAR more to lose with another lockout than merely the terms that are being disputed. I can only hope that common sense prevails.
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I agree with you. Maybe the NHL did emerge from the last lockout with some gains, however two lockouts within 10 years?? That can't be good.

I don't think fans will ever give up on the NHL. Hockey fans are too attached to their sport, too grounded in heritage to just walk away because of something like this. We all ***** and moan about it, but we would do anything to watch our teams.
 
Looks like talks have encountered a "recess". Word has it the League decided to postpone the talks because the NHLPA's latest counter proposal didn't cause their private parts to tingle.

In case anyone isn't aware, a lockout will affect not only the players, the league, and their fans, but also the business that count on fans coming to games and then stopping by for a drinks or food, or even lodging. Millions of dollars in revenue to surrounding businesses will be lost. Some of them may not survive if the lockout is lengthy.

In other news, the odds that the Grand Rapids Griffins, Ferris State University Bulldogs, and Western University Broncos will get more of my money this winter has been reported to be "increasing".
 
Boleslaus said:
I agree with you. Maybe the NHL did emerge from the last lockout with some gains, however two lockouts within 10 years?? That can't be good.

I don't think fans will ever give up on the NHL. Hockey fans are too attached to their sport, too grounded in heritage to just walk away because of something like this. We all ***** and moan about it, but we would do anything to watch our teams.
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If 18 teams are losing money by having a season, then it benefits the owners to not play this season until they get what they want.

The fans will return en masse, just like they did the last two times.

This lockout will hurt the players far more than the League, and they must know it. I don't understand why they don't just start with the 50/50 split and go from there. Idiots.
 
paulster2626 said:
If 18 teams are losing money by having a season, then it benefits the owners to not play this season until they get what they want.

The fans will return en masse, just like they did the last two times.

This lockout will hurt the players far more than the League, and they must know it. I don't understand why they don't just start with the 50/50 split and go from there. Idiots.
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Isn't it already a 54/46 split for the owners and they want more? I'm still trying to figure out what "revenue" is. I thought the players were paid with a contract from their employee the owner and everything else was the owners to deal with, profit and loss.
 

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