Belgian Golden Strong Ale Duvel Clone

[rtg]

Mashing

Aside from water, beer’s chief ingredient, barley is the primary raw material. The barley has to germinate for five days in the maltworks before being dried with hot air. This results in malt. The colour of the malt and consequently, of the beer as well, is determined by the temperature. In the brewing hall we mix the ground malt with the brewing water that is drawn from our own sources. We have four 60m-deep wells. This mixture of water and malt, the mash, is brought to various temperatures in a series of steps. The enzymes that are formed during germination further break down the starch in the malt into fermentable sugars. Through filtration, the solids (draff) are separated from the liquid sugar extract (wort). During the cooking process, we add various types of hops which give the beer its characteristic bitterness and pleasing aromas. For the hops our brewers select only the best aromatic varieties, Saaz-Saaz from the Czech Republic and Styrian Golding from Slovenia. After the hops are removed and the mixture is processed in the whirlpool, it is allowed to cool and the beer extract is pumped into the fermentation vessels.

Primary Fermentation Day 2 to 8
The Duvel then ferments and ripens a first time in refrigerated cylinder/conical tanks for some 20 days. We work exclusively with our own top-fermentation strain of yeast (Saccharomyces cerevisiae cerevisiae). According to the top fermentation principle, at the end of the fermentation process, the yeast floats to the top of the young beer where it forms a thick layer of foam. This process takes place at a temperature of 20° to 26° Celsius over a period of 4 to 8 days.

Lagering Day 8 to 29
After the primary fermentation comes the lagering or maturing phase in the lager tanks, where the beer is chilled to -2° Celsius in order to allow it to gently continue to ferment. During this phase, which is carefully monitored with daily analyses and tasting, the beer acquires its balanced flavour and it develops its rich aromatic bouquet. After filtering, the beer is ready to be bottled.

Day 30: Bottling
Right before bottling, an extra dose of fermentable sugars is added along with active yeast cells, which leads to a secondary fermentation in the bottle.

Day 33-47: 2 weeks maturing in warm cellars
By adding a small dose of fermentable sugars and extra yeast to the beer, we cause it to undergo an extra, secondary fermentation in the bottle. This process gives the beer a richer aroma and a more full-bodied taste. This secondary fermentation takes place at a temperature of 22° Celsius in the warm cellars where the beer matures for 14 days.


Day 48-90: 6 weeks maturing in cold cellars

After that, the beer is allowed to rest in cold cellars, where it continues to mature for another 6 weeks (42 days) at a temperature of 5° to 6° Celsius. The cold cellars have a maximum capacity of 12 million bottles. The cool temperature refines the flavour and gives the beer a riper aroma. In other words, the entire production process actually takes
3 months from start to finish. Preparing a traditional beer of perfect quality takes time, lots of time.

 

[BeerPressure]

I've found that the recipe in brewing classic styles gets close to duvel with some aging.

 

[CheemsAF]

Well I found this thread pretty interesting just having tried to clone Duvel. I think I'm going to name my clone D'vel...it's missing something.

I tried the recipe out of "Clone Brews Recipes for 200 Commercial Beers" by Tess and Mark Szamatulski. My temps, times, hop schedule, etc were nearly spot on with the recipe; yet it turned out to something completely different.

I, right now as I'm typing, have the no-kidding original Duvel sitting next to my D'vel. Aromatics, colors, flavors are completely different. Darker, stronger, and seemingly more bitter. The book recipe called for less 2-row belgian pils, no cara, but a little bit of belgian aromatic malt, along with cane and clear candi sugar. Hop schedule is almost identical. It also called for the month long "lagering" at cold temps prior to bottling (but at 35 degs, not below freezing). Yet the mash schedule was a constant 151 for 90 mins. I'm thinking this is the biggest difference looking at the rest of the thread.
Any thoughts? Wife thinks the D'vel is definitely a Belgian, just not anything close to a real Duvel.
I'm puzzled
Thanks!

 

[pekabrewery]

Another tip from Jamil: You can increase the fermentability of extract by re-mashing it! So if you are doing a partial mash and want to get the final gravity down beneath 1.010-10.13, then add your extract to the mash and let the base malt enzymes chomp it down some more. 90 min at 147-149F seems to be the recommended temp for this style.

I did a extract + grain duvel clone two days ago. I re mashed 5 lbs LME with 5 lbs of base malt in 148F for 90 minutes. With added Candi sugar I ended up with a OG of 1.082 and the fermenter is bubbling like crazy right now. Hopefully i will end up with a FG down towards the goal of 1.006.

Thinking about redoing the brew without the re mashing to see if the experiment worked. however, i'm gonna wait for this batch to finish first to see

Have anybody else tried this with success?

 

[sudbuster]

Anyone know what happened to "The Pol"?? He simply went missing. Wonder if he is still alive? Some rumors claim he came back on under a new ID, but I very much doubt that, as it just wasn't his style. Anyway, so-long "The Pol".......

 

[HumanGarbage]

Anyone know what happened to "The Pol"?? He simply went missing. Wonder if he is still alive? Some rumors claim he came back on under a new ID, but I very much doubt that, as it just wasn't his style. Anyway, so-long "The Pol".......

I noticed his absence too. I hope the man is OK, just not posting for some reason...

My Duval clone is nothing close too. I will keep on working on it.

 

[mortox]

Ok i've had this one in the fermentor a little over a month now. the alcohol presence is pretty strong in the taste but besides that is quite nice. Is there a way to mellow this out? airlock is still bubbling too.. maybe a few times an hour at this point.

i did add candy sugar to the primary after about a week.

 

[Amanofbeer]

I think BLAM says it's all pils and plain ol' sucrose. That aromatic will make a huge difference

I highly recommend reading that book if you want to brew this...and preferably the whole book, because you read about how the monks do there thing, then you read how Duvel does it. Same idea, same goal, way more intense regimen. But even the Brewmaster will attest to the yeast never really being all that predictable. The only secret to this beer (other than getting the bill accurate) is attenuation.

 

[aaronkaz]

I realize the post is old, for anybody still looking, searching, etc, I've got some tips from my own experience that could certainly help.

#1 - You really want the grist to be 100% pilsner. Looking at fermentables, this is 85% whereas the sugar is around 15%. Any bit of specialty malts whatsoever are inappropriate for the style, can increase your FG, and in my opinion, are just plain ol' unnecessary. Its best to add the sugar at flameout or during fermentation. For this particular style, I feel that dextrose (corn sugar) creates the right flavor profile. With anything else, I get too much sugar flavor even with a low FG.

#2 - The practice of acid rest/protein rest as part of the Ramp mash schedule is really unnecessary for home brewers. The malts we get are very well modified. Belgian breweries are sourcing their ingredients from all kinds of malt houses that have a variety of characteristics. The breweries understand this science and adjust their procedures accordingly. I've actually used that method several times and I've just found it has its problems for the home brewer. Most of all, a waste of time, there's no benefit. Second, it kills the head. Third, I've found a tannic flavor in all the beers that I've done this that takes a while longer to mellow out. Doing an infusion or even step-infusion between the 142-149F range produces better results and the same fermentability with well-modified malts.

#3 - You gotta bring the fermentation temperature up towards the end of primary (while the yeasts are still visibly active). Not too early as to get hot alcohols, but while the yeasts are still charged up enough to make the best use of that temp boost. Duvel supposedly ramps up as far as 80F.


The last Golden Strong I did was with the Wyeast Flanders Golden Ale Strain (private collection). This one was a big attenuator. I used the guidelines above and got a starting gravity at 1.072 that finished out at 1.002. Yes that's 95% attenuation! I've found that the big attenuator yeasts create other compounds, like glycerols, that create the impression of sweetness and body even in a beer that dry. Definitely doesn't taste too thin.

 

[Dgonza9]

Has anyone done a ramp mash with a typical auber PID (no ramp function)?

I'm not sure how much my 1500 watt element will ramp a mash for a 10 gallon beer. I imagine it's got too much power to set it at 170 and leave her alone.

But I was thinking that there must be a manual mode % I can set it to that would ramp it about the right amount in the time required.

I might run some tests later. But if anyone's already figured this out, holla!

 

[HumanGarbage]

Dgonza9,

I do 5 gallon batches and my element is 4500w run on 120v (maybe 1125w). It has been no problem for me to set the temp to 170 and let it run itself up. I usually start at 120 and it takes about 1:15 to get up there. No scorching evident on the element post mash either...

I know it doesn't answer your question per se, just food for thought.

 

[mmcshmi11]

Have not done my Duvel clone yet, but it will be my next brew... and there is a lot of great information in this thread.

One thing I noticed is that nobody mentioned harvesting yeast from a bottle of Duvel. In an experiment with my Tripel, I harvested Orval yeast by basically dumping a little bit of cooled DME wort into a bottle of Orval dreggs. After a few days on top of the fridge, it was fermenting and smelled just like Orval. Now, a year later, the 5 bottles I dumped this into have a nice acidic character that reminds me of Orval (and it was not infected!). I have listened to cloning podcasts by Jamil and he has said something similar is expected.

There has been a lot of talk about mashing temperatures and other processes for getting the attenuation needed. I think part of the reason some people may not be getting the low FG they want is that the yeast simply doesn't attenuate that well. If you think about a professional brewery, every % point in attenuation means cost savings by requiring less grain for each batch. With millions of bottles of beer, higher attenuation will mean more profit for the brewery.

I have heard of others stepping up dreggs from some Bruery beers (20mL > 50mL > 100mL > 200mL > 500mL > 1L > 2L) and attenuation was something ridiculous like 97%. It makes sense that better yeast means you don't need as much of it (or grains) to get the same amount of alcohol through better attenuation.

Even if you find out what yeast a brewery uses for its beer it does not guarantee you will get that beer. I guarantee that the house strain at Duvel has mutated away from whatever strain it started from initially (WLP570 is mentioned in the first post of this thread). I'm curious if anybody else has used Duvel dreggs and whether they were successful. I will post my results from my next brew, but it will be a few months

 

[etrain666]

Found this thread in a search. Recently did a batch similar to this recipe, but used dark candi sugar for added color. I did a single infusion mash at 144. Fermented at 69 for two days with WLP545, then ramped it up to 75 and added 2 pounds of corn sugar. Finished at 1.0005. Pretty darn dry and 11.5% ABV. Bottling this weekend.

 

[highgravitybacon]

Used the Jamil recipe. 80/20 pils malt and sugar. Mash @ 149. Hops were Wilamette at 75 and 45. Maybe a half ounce each time. 30 min add one oz Saaz.

90 min boil. SG was 1.074. Goal was 1.072. At about a week, it was down to 1.009. Quite fruity taste with some peppery thing going on. Wyeast 1388. About two days at 60. Then heated up over three days to 81.

I used beet sugar. The cheap stuff from Aldi. By boiling it for 75 min, you in theory should make invert sugar by time and heat alone.

Still copious yeast in suspension.

I see people adding fruit and **** to this recipe. Totally unnecessary. It is plenty, and I mean bordering on excessive, fruity.

 

[Brizonian]

What's the general consensus on when to add the sugar?

 

[highgravitybacon]

What's the general consensus on when to add the sugar?

There is no consensus. If it works at boil, add at boil. If it wouldn't attenuate, add during fermentation.

 

[Brizonian]

There is no consensus. If it works at boil, add at boil. If it wouldn't attenuate, add during fermentation.

Huh?

What are the differences I can expect between adding the sugar at the start of the boil, end of boil, or in the primary? Is there no difference?

 

[highgravitybacon]

Huh?

What are the differences I can expect between adding the sugar at the start of the boil, end of boil, or in the primary? Is there no difference?

It depends. Try it and see. Nobody has your kettle, your fermenter, or your setup. The simplest is to put it in during the boil. But if you're not getting the attenuation you want, put it in during fermentation. This is a recommendation from Brewing Classic Styles.

You seem frustrated at the answer, but you are dealing with a living organism and thousands of variables. What works for me won't work for you every time. Hence, the no consensus.

 

[germanmade84]

Add once they ferment has somewhat slowed.

 

[aaronkaz]

I think the 'it depends' statement may really translate to: are you trying to duplicate the Duvel process, or are you just trying to brew a good Golden Strong?

In my opinion, and in my homebrewing experience, cloning a specific Belgian beer is quite hard to attain. Whereas, I've had great success brewing Belgian-style ales in general. With American styles, if you match the malt bill and hop schedule, you can get pretty close to spot on. However, with Belgians, there are often so few ingredients you're really left trying to mimic the respective breweries processes and proprietary 'x-factors'.

For example, take Duvel .... (I wish I could find the link to this old obscure-looking article I found a while back, which had specific times, temps, and gravities, but here it is paraphrased)
#1 - Ramp style mash - bring malt from somewhere in the 120-130F range up to 160F at a constant rate over the course of 90 or so minutes. Of course, the grain they use is malted specifically for Moortgat to their specifications.
#2 - After boil, where SOME of the sugar is added (they mention dextrose/corn sugar), the wort is split into two separate fermentations with 2 proprietary yeast strains to each respectively. From what I remember, one strain provides most of the signature esters and flavors but is not as attenuative while the other is more neutral in flavor but highly attenuative. One of the yeasts is Scottish in origin.
#3 - After primary fermentation is complete, the batches are lagered for 2-3 weeks.
#4 - The batches are blended together in unknown proportions, brought back up to ale ferm. temp (low 60's F), and the rest of the dextrose and more yeast (of the high attenuation type) is added.
#5 - After a slower secondary fermentation (10-14 days) is complete, the beer undergoes a second lagering phase.
#6 - bottle conditioning - plenty of info online for this step

Whew!!

 

[aaronkaz]

Assuming that Duvel does use corn sugar and a yeast strain at least similar to the WLP570 that is claimed to be 'the one', I have found in my own attempts that I simply do not like either one of those ingredients used in this context and have just dropped the whole mission to clone it. Corn sugar puts off these cidery flavors, and I just don't really like WLP570 with anything I've tried. And this may be because of my brew setup as highgravitybacon alludes to. Those elements don't work for me and thus I have found what DOES work for me in creating a pleasurable Golden Strong.

Its also your taste. What do you want? I like it super dry so I both mash low and add sugar (evaporated cane juice crystals or clear candi syrup) during primary. Also, I oxygenate well before pitching and do open primary fermentations, so I consistently hit the higher end of attenuation with whatever strain I'm using. If I want a little more body, I'll either mash a little higher or add all the sugar to the boil. There is a flavor difference because of the carmelization that happens in the kettle. Sugar added to the fermenter, in my taste, has a 'raw' sort of flavor. "Tastes like sugar" whereas the boiled sugar incorporates with the malt better in my taste. And in that case, I don't mind the flavor of boiled dextrose or cheap white sugar, but can't stand it unboiled.

Whatever you do, I think the style requires some personal experimentation. Good luck!

 

[Brizonian]

Very nice. Thanks for the feedback everyone!

Guess its time for me to start experimenting...first up - Pranqster clone. Lets see how close I can get; or end up with a good Strong Golden Ale, anyway.

Prost!

 

[NevermoreBrew]

So I make beer and my dad makes wine and I want to try and make a collaboration brew with some grape juice in it. My dad has some old vine Zinfandel grapes and I was thinking I'd use this Duvel recipe for the beer. I want to put grape juice in the primary with the beer yeast. Anybody have any thoughts how this would work out? Too fruity? And thoughts on not adding the sugar as the grape juice should be very fermentable? I was thinking of doing something around a 4/1 ratio beer to grape juice. maybe 9/1

Thanks

 

[jCOSbrew]

Question about fermentation temps for Duvel or similar GSA?
After fermentor temp is ramped to 80 deg F (over 1 week) should I just leave it at 80F for a few weeks?
OR drop back down to 70 deg F after a period of time for additional conditioning in the primary?

 

[highgravitybacon]

Question about fermentation temps for Duvel or similar GSA?
After fermentor temp is ramped to 80 deg F (over 1 week) should I just leave it at 80F for a few weeks?
OR drop back down to 70 deg F after a period of time for additional conditioning in the primary?

Once fermentation is done, I would (did) lager it at 30f for a few weeks to clear it up. Mine tastes kind of boozy. Not sure if I under pitched, ramped temps up too quickly or what. I'm not sure if I f-ed it up.

I've been lagering it for a while, and I'll bottle condition for a few months and see if it turns out.

 

[homebrewdad]

I think the 'it depends' statement may really translate to: are you trying to duplicate the Duvel process, or are you just trying to brew a good Golden Strong?

In my opinion, and in my homebrewing experience, cloning a specific Belgian beer is quite hard to attain. Whereas, I've had great success brewing Belgian-style ales in general. With American styles, if you match the malt bill and hop schedule, you can get pretty close to spot on. However, with Belgians, there are often so few ingredients you're really left trying to mimic the respective breweries processes and proprietary 'x-factors'.

For example, take Duvel .... (I wish I could find the link to this old obscure-looking article I found a while back, which had specific times, temps, and gravities, but here it is paraphrased)
#1 - Ramp style mash - bring malt from somewhere in the 120-130F range up to 160F at a constant rate over the course of 90 or so minutes. Of course, the grain they use is malted specifically for Moortgat to their specifications.
#2 - After boil, where SOME of the sugar is added (they mention dextrose/corn sugar), the wort is split into two separate fermentations with 2 proprietary yeast strains to each respectively. From what I remember, one strain provides most of the signature esters and flavors but is not as attenuative while the other is more neutral in flavor but highly attenuative. One of the yeasts is Scottish in origin.
#3 - After primary fermentation is complete, the batches are lagered for 2-3 weeks.
#4 - The batches are blended together in unknown proportions, brought back up to ale ferm. temp (low 60's F), and the rest of the dextrose and more yeast (of the high attenuation type) is added.
#5 - After a slower secondary fermentation (10-14 days) is complete, the beer undergoes a second lagering phase.
#6 - bottle conditioning - plenty of info online for this step

Whew!!

I remember reading a similar article. Makes me despair at ever doing a really good clone.

 

[jstuts2260]

After reading all of these pages I think I've found my inspiration for a crazy high gravity Belgian Golden Strong. I've wanted the challenge of brewing a quality high abv beer, and the opportunity to do some more Belgians. So...hijacking this recipe sounded like a perfect idea! Any suggestions to my proposed shenanigans?

5 Gallons
OG 1.091
FG 1.006
ABV 11.14%
5.5 SRM
34 IBU

90 minute boil
16# Pilsner (Bel)
10oz Carapils
1# Corn Sugar (added @ 15 min)
1# Clear Candi Sugar (added @ 15 min)

1 oz Saaz FWH
1.25 Strian Goldings @90 Min
1 oz Saaz 15 min
1 oz Citra dry hop 7 days

Yeast - yeast cake from 1.050 brew using Wyeast 3787 Trappist High Gravity
Mash - 75 minutes at 150 so it's nice and dry.


I realize Citra isn't traditional, but I think the hop would really add to the aroma. Especially since it will dissipate with time since I'm bottle conditioning this beer.

What temp should I ferment at? Start at mid 60's and bring it up? Or just let it slowly gurgle away 65? Suggestions on staggering the sugar additions to keep the yeasties eating away?

Any suggestions would be appreciated! I'll be brewing this one the first of feb. I wasn't sure if people would read it, but I did post it here too https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/double-duval-381508/#post4785140

 

[germanmade84]

3737 isnt usually the yeast of golden strong, but it would handle the abv, so not bad choice. Adding half of sugar after primary begins to slow would be a fail safe that i would use. I love the citra plan! All in all it will be a massive success as is tho. So youve done good.

 

[ZombieBrew83]

Wanted to share my results on this thread since it is close my attempt at Jamil's Duvel clone recipe from Brewing Classic Styles. I did this recipe PM, BIAB with a 7.5 gallon kettle on my stove top. Here are the stats:

7 lbs Pils Two-Row
3 lbs Pilsen DME
2.5 lbs Cane sugar @30 minutes
US Saaz and Styrian Golding additions to hit 33 IBU

-Mash Pils and DME together @147 for 2 hours. Dunk sparge @165 for 10 minutes.
-Added a gallon of spring water to reach ~6 gallons going into boil
-90 minute boil
-Chill
-Aerate with drill mixer
-Pitched 3 packs of 1388
-OG 1.084 (anticipated only 1.079 w/75% efficiency)
-Ferment for 3 days at 66degF
-Raise temp to 80degF and hold for 5 days
-Let temp settle back to ambient ~68degF

After 11 days total my FG was 1.006!!! ~10% ABV. Gravity sample was a little boozy but also could pick up some fruityness like a cross between tangerine and Asian pear in the background. I plan on letting this sit in the fermenter at room temp for about two more weeks before I keg it and let it carb at 12 PSI.

My results confirm that yes, you can remash DME with base grain to make it more fermentable. I'm very encouraged by how things have come along so far and encourage anyone to try this recipe if you are looking for a Duvel clone.

 

[jCOSbrew]

Brewed my first BGSA and it turned out well after a couple months of aging, however, there is not a lot of the fruity yeast esters that I get from commercial examples of BGSA.

Is this typical of the Duvel yeast strain?

Maybe I will do the temp ramp soon on my next batch. This batch fermented quickly with good attenuation but without much krausen compared to the american ale yeast strains I typically use.