Saison Cottage House Saison

[inkman15]

For those of you who have brewed this, what is the advantage of using Sorachi and Fuggles specifically as the FWH? I was just going to get the same IBUs out of some Warrior. I feel like using Sorachi as a FWH won't really add any of those characteristic lemon notes as they will be boiled off, no?

 

[jojacques]

That 3711 is a beast!

I used Danstar Belle Saison!

The beer taste amazing! Nice peppery, dry, slight banana taste.

 

[Oldskewl]

Bell Saison is a beast as well!

 

[troglodytes]

Bell Saison is a beast as well!

I've always used 3711 for every saison. Would it be worth while to pitch Belle first then 3711 on day 4-5 to ensure the level of dryness I like, or are the flavor profiles similar enough to just use either/or.

 

[jojacques]

^^ I finished incredibly low with Belle Saison, my beer is preeetty dry!

 

[Shenanigans]

Anyone brewed a more sessonable version of this? In the 5% range? My last version went down to 1.002 with belle saison and was over 9% would like to be able to drink a few and not be zonked after 2 bottels. :fro:

 

[troglodytes]

^^ I finished incredibly low with Belle Saison, my beer is preeetty dry!

Adding it to my shopping list as this is my next brew, but wanted to change something up from the past times brewing this.

 

[bolus14]

Anyone brewed a more sessonable version of this? In the 5% range? My last version went down to 1.002 with belle saison and was over 9% would like to be able to drink a few and not be zonked after 2 bottels. :fro:

I have done this once with this recipe and the same with a couple other Saisons I've made. First thing is drop the honey, if you're using 3711 it will still dry out, this strain will chew it down regardless of having the simple sugars, and I haven't found the honey to contribute anything flavor wise when added in the boil so nothing lost there either. That should drop about 1% ABV off.

If you want to go lower you can do one of two things, I just lowered the amount of 2-Row to get to the ABV I wanted, If you want to keep the recipe the same, you can use beersmith or brewer's friend to play with the percentages of each grain to keep them the same.

I didn't notice much difference when I just dropped the honey and lowered the 2-row, I think the difference mainly came from the lower ABV, maybe slightly less "sweet" from the lower alcohol, otherwise I thought it was very similar taste wise.

 

[Shenanigans]

I have done this once with this recipe and the same with a couple other Saisons I've made. First thing is drop the honey, if you're using 3711 it will still dry out, this strain will chew it down regardless of having the simple sugars, and I haven't found the honey to contribute anything flavor wise when added in the boil so nothing lost there either. That should drop about 1% ABV off.

If you want to go lower you can do one of two things, I just lowered the amount of 2-Row to get to the ABV I wanted, If you want to keep the recipe the same, you can use beersmith or brewer's friend to play with the percentages of each grain to keep them the same.

I didn't notice much difference when I just dropped the honey and lowered the 2-row, I think the difference mainly came from the lower ABV, maybe slightly less "sweet" from the lower alcohol, otherwise I thought it was very similar taste wise.

Thanks for the feedback. Might give it a go without the honey and then scale everything down to about 1.045 for a 5 to 6% beer.
Don't want to go too low or else it might not be possible to store it for as long before it starts going down hill.

 

[jojacques]

For those of you who have brewed this, what is the advantage of using Sorachi and Fuggles specifically as the FWH? I was just going to get the same IBUs out of some Warrior. I feel like using Sorachi as a FWH won't really add any of those characteristic lemon notes as they will be boiled off, no?

I used Sorachi and found that I get this small peppery/spicy after taste.
It might be because of the small amount of Paradise Seeds I used, but I'll never know

 

[jpoppinmoneyunit]

Just bottled this using WL 565 saison yeast. Went from 1.062 down to 1.006, kid you not. That was 4 weeks with temp starting at 68 ramping up one degree until 80 and holding for the remainder. Will let you know once I get a taste test.

 

[ten80]

Thanks for the feedback. Might give it a go without the honey and then scale everything down to about 1.045 for a 5 to 6% beer.
Don't want to go too low or else it might not be possible to store it for as long before it starts going down hill.

This beer cellars very nicely, even at 4.5% ABV. A friend of mine just opened a 3-year old bottle of a batch I did and reported that it had aged very nicely. I think that the 3711 yeast I used leads to beers that cellar well.

I think that this beer would also work nicely with WLP566 Belgian Saison II which produces similar esters and peppery notes

Adding it to my shopping list as this is my next brew, but wanted to change something up from the past times brewing this.

Belle Saison is a great yeast but many, including myself, have found that it lacks the spicy or peppery notes and esters that 3711 produces. However; it will ferment low to high gravity beers completely without any hassle and produces some glycerol which lends to some residual mouthfeel even if the beer ferments to near 1.000 FG.

HERE IS A LINK TO DREW BEECHUM's excellent AHA presentation on a test of all of the common Saison yeast strains (except Belle Saison) with some good tasting notes. Food for though for your future saison brews...

 

[troglodytes]

Woah, thanks man. I've learned a lot from Drew over the years (especially the "Brewing on the Ones" concept), but I've never seen this one. This is awesome stuff. Now to see what one pairs best with ginger cause that's what I truly love in a summer saison.

 

[askchucky]

I am looking to brew this in the next couple of weeks. Have brewed it about 4 times. Has anyone tried doing a fruit variant? Just trying to think about a split batch to mix it up.

 

[sweed]

I am looking to brew this in the next couple of weeks. Have brewed it about 4 times. Has anyone tried doing a fruit variant? Just trying to think about a split batch to mix it up.

I just bottled a saison last night and poured about a half bottle (2 oz) of peach flavoring for the last ~2 gallons I had. Initial taste was really good and complimented the beer very well I thought. I have 3 gallons of "plain" saison, and about 2 of peach saison. Can't wait for it to carbonate!

 

[HomebrewingDNA]

Hey guys. I brewed this recipe 2 weeks ago, but now I need the primary fermenter for a new brew. I understand that the yeast is very important in this recipe, so would racking to a secondary affect the final product too much? Should I wait out the whole 4 weeks in the primary and rack directly into the keg or am I fine transferring to my secondary fermenter?

 

[bolus14]

Check the gravity. If it's within a couple points of where it should end up, with this recipe and 3711 most hit close to 1.000, then rack to secondary or keg whichever you prefer. Nice thing about this and many saison recipes is they can be turned around quickly. If it's not near 1.000 then I would wait it out.

 

[HomebrewingDNA]

Hey. The beer has gone down to 1.006. I am using Wyeast 3711. I transferred it to secondary and left it room temp. Not a lot of citrus yet when I tasted the hydrometer sample. Any dry hop suggestions? Also, thanks for the tip bolus 14

 

[jpoppinmoneyunit]

Well the WL 565 produced a fantastic beer down to 1.006 as well. I wouldn't say that the pepper or the Sorachi Ace gave it much of a spicy taste but the lemon flavor sure came through.

I bottle conditioned and tried a few but the plan is to age some and see how they come along every month or so.

 

[zonkman]

Anyone developed an extract recipe?

 

[tellyho]

About to brew this with American Farmhouse. Will update.

 

[JonM]

I'm going to try this without the honey this year and I'll brew it up on Memorial Day weekend. I've made it every summer for the last couple years, but I'm going to try making it a little more sessiony this time.

 

[Rush]

Brewed this yesterday but made a few changes. I went 50/50 pale 2-row and pilsner for base malt, and used 100% Willamette for the hop additions. I also had a few LBs of regular honey left over from another brew so I added 1LB of the regular honey at flame out and added the zest of 2 oranges with the black pepper at 5 minutes left.

Brew was poured into the carboy around 1PM and rehydrated Belle Saison was added. Fermentation was visibly very active by 7-8PM, bubbling the airlock once per second. Excited for this one!

 

[Satevis]

I also brewed this yesterday. Well, kinda.

I hopped with Pacific Jade and Huell Melon and used Mangrove Jack's French Saison yeast and added 1 oz Orange Zest at 5 min.

Hop schedule was the same. But changed Sorachi for Pacific Jade and the Fuggles for Huell melon.

I ended up missing my mash temp and mashed at around 145-146. Ended up hitting OG of 1.063. Really excited for this one. Currently fermenting away at 75 degrees.

 

[Rush]

Welp, this is first for me. My fermentation temp got out of control and went up to 82f, actual beer temp. Using Belle Saison yeast. Stayed at this temp for 24-36 hours. Hopefully it didn't throw off any esters that will kill the beer.

Dropped it into a swamp cooler and brought the temp back down to mid/low 70's.

 

[Oldskewl]

Welp, this is first for me. My fermentation temp got out of control and went up to 82f, actual beer temp. Using Belle Saison yeast. Stayed at this temp for 24-36 hours. Hopefully it didn't throw off any esters that will kill the beer.

Dropped it into a swamp cooler and brought the temp back down to mid/low 70's.

I think you will be fine. I have seen several people ferment this yeast into the 80's and it turns out great!

 

[BrewCityBaller]

Welp, this is first for me. My fermentation temp got out of control and went up to 82f, actual beer temp. Using Belle Saison yeast. Stayed at this temp for 24-36 hours. Hopefully it didn't throw off any esters that will kill the beer.

Dropped it into a swamp cooler and brought the temp back down to mid/low 70's.

At what point in the fermentation process did you get up there? For a Saison low 80s probably isn't too bad. I doubt it killed anything.

 

[Rush]

At what point in the fermentation process did you get up there? For a Saison low 80s probably isn't too bad. I doubt it killed anything.

Within the first 48 hours. I know Saison yeast likes high temps so I didn't put it in my swamp cooler and just let it hang out at room temp (74-75f). After a couple days I took a reading during active fermentation and realized it was much higher than ambient, which is when I dropped in in the swamp cooler.

I guess I'll see how it turns out after a month or so. Not like I'm planning on dumping it or anything.

 

[Dcpcooks]

Welp, this is first for me. My fermentation temp got out of control and went up to 82f, actual beer temp. Using Belle Saison yeast. Stayed at this temp for 24-36 hours. Hopefully it didn't throw off any esters that will kill the beer.



Dropped it into a swamp cooler and brought the temp back down to mid/low 70's.

You'll pick up some fruity bubble gum esters with a bit of pepper at that temp. It wasn't hot enough to produce much fusel alcohol. The max temp for that yeast is 95f according to the manufacturer.

You may have a challenge finishing the attenuation on that batch however. A ten degree drop isn't helpful for the yeast. I'm sure they were shocked a bit by the temp swing. I'd let it have extra time to finish and let the yeast clean up off flavors. I'd probably try to warm it up a few degrees at the end.

I ferment most saison yeast between 74 and 82.5.

 

[Abrayton]

I'm planning to brew the original recipe as is in two weeks. When I enter all info into beersmith and set FWH as well as other hop additions I get 49 IBUs. Assuming I just need to scale down hop additions in order to hit the correct IBUs? Just not sure why same batch size and same amount of ingredients is giving such different numbers. Sorry if this has been answered already, I'm only up to page 77 of this thread.