Cost of making home brew

[Bobby_M]

The rule would have to be that you get to pour it out without the brewer even getting to taste the result. That way you don't get suckered into pouring out a batch the brewer already wrote off as terrible, dump-able anyway.

Incidentally, my homebrew costs about a dollar an ounce.

 

[Arkador]

No, it would benefit you A LOT!!!

+1 to joining a homebrew club, it greatly improved the quality of my brewing, and opened up other oppertunities as well!

 

[beerocd]

Someone will take me up on it. I have a crisp $20 and unlimited flight benefits. Point me to your barleywine.

It would actually COST you more than $20 to dump my beer. Your time is worth something and traveling from where you are to where I am would take up quite a bit of time. Also - even if you could dump my beer for only $20; I wager you wouldn't since you can't make a beer for $20 considering labor costs involved. So you would take it back with you as checked luggage, and get charged a fee for it being too heavy. It really is a no win situation.

I think consumables should be the only thing counted in cost per batch. That's the only way to make fair comparisons. If a brain surgeon and a taxi driver both make beer from the same $20 worth of ingredients; one batch is not worth $5,000 more because that is the brain surgeons billing rate. $1 for electricity vs. $5 in propane I think is a fair comparison too.

______________________________________________________________
GOT IT - just came to me. As with your tax returns - if its YOUR LABOR you can't deduct it. If you pay someone to do something for you - you can. I propose this is the new standard for costing out beer.

 

[justflow1983]

Also, why would you charge time on something you enjoy? People would pay to have that much fun at Disneyworld... there's no way epcott is more fun than making a good beer.

 

[olllllo]

I can't tell if you are intentionally missing the point, but either way beerocd. I think you're scared that I would do it.

 

[TexLaw]

So what is the amount of money that you will accept for me to dump your beer?

That is the labor cost... the amount of money that you will accept to compensate you for your time brewing.

But that is not the brewer's cost to make the beer. You are confusing the cost of the labor with the beer's value. Those are two very different things. I've made some beers that I would be more than happy to accept $20 for you come over and dump, or even less.

And, just like with any other hobby or other leisure activity, I don't even think of setting a price on my time or effort when it comes to brewing or any other hobby. It's not like I would be working during my brewing time if I weren't brewing. It works the same way if I am going out for a beer, for dinner, to a ballgame, or a movie. If I had to account for time when it comes to doing something other than work, and I used my normal billing rate, I could send my kids to college on the cost of my television, and my mattress would cost more than the space shuttle. That's all I will say about that.

Back to OP's question, not accounting for equipment, my average batch cost on ingredients comes out somewhere around $4-5 per gallon of beer that makes it into the keg. I buy my base malts in bulk, but not as part of a pallet-sharing thing (although I am not against it, should the opportunity arise at the right time). I do not specialty malts in bulk. I buy my hops in bulk. I don't reuse yeast enough for that to make a difference (and that is roughly 20-25% of my cost). I buy my water for $0.35/gallon (although I often use treated tap water for half). In the end, the ingredients cost me roughly half (or a little more than half) of a good craft beer or micro in the store and a hell of a lot less than I can buy it at the bar. However, it's more important that I made it and that I cannot find that beer anywhere else in the world.

When it comes to equipment, I have no idea how that works out. I've had some of my gear for almost fifteen years. I have a carboy that I bought over 16 years ago. I have lots of other doo-dads that I have accumulated over that time. I have some stuff that I bought last month. It's a hobby, not a business, so I don't keep such records, so long as it is within my budget.


TL

 

[beerocd]

I can't tell if you are intentionally missing the point, but either way beerocd. I think you're scared that I would do it.

Nah, just having fun in a senseless, no win subject. If I had beer to spare, I'd take you up on it, just so I could have a beer with you.

-OCD

 

[olllllo]

With all due respect TxLaw, you're assuming that all people get into this hobby because they find the process enjoyable. Some people ask about the cost of producing beer because they feel they can save money. They are interested in the result.

From the OP

If you were to add up the cost, of your hops, grains etc. how much does it cost you to make your brew? If you were to estimate cost per 12oz botttle, what would it be? Just curious, I just started getting into the idea of brewing my own beer, and as a cheap basterd I want to see how much less it is.

I am not confusing cost with value. The fact that two beers can have different values despite having the same labor cost and grain bill does nothing to diminish my argument. Using your logic, the beer that you value so little that i could throw away for less than $20 hasn't also lost it's ingredient cost.

 

[TexLaw]

I am not confusing cost with value. The fact that two beers can have different values despite having the same labor cost and grain bill does nothing to diminish my argument. Using your logic, the beer that you value so little that i could throw away for less than $20 hasn't also lost it's ingredient cost.

You are correct. The ingredient cost has not gone away any more than any labor cost has, to the extent there is any labor cost. However, cost does not necessarily create a minimum value. I could spend all day and $100 on ingredients that winds up infected. That doesn't change the fact that I would gladly take your $20 and watch you dump it. Fortunately, we are dealing with a hypothetical world, here (knock on wood).


TL

 

[Bobby_M]

I guess I was sucked in too. Darn.

Another way to put it is, if brewing is such fun that the only cost is that of consumables, surely you wouldn't mind starting over as I dump this carboy out. In fact, I'm actually doing you a favor by freeing up a carboy so you can brew again immediately.

Ok, it's a bunch of nonsense in the real world but we're a group of brewers who really do love the process probably more than the beer itself. You have to be objective when someone literally asks about "cost".

You could say that time + money invested = beer and the enjoyment of reflection on the brewing process, pride, and the learning experience..

If you're the type of person that would discount the pride and learning experience, now you just have time + money = beer. That's a losing investment.

 

[TexLaw]

Well, if you want to be objective, then you have to have to acknowledge that this time or labor "cost" is a subjective matter (ironically). In other words, everyone has their own measure. For some, it's $0 or virtually so. For others, it's too much. Then, we just leave it at that.


TL

 

[dantodd]

Calculating the cost of labor into your homebrewing HOBBY is like calculating the cost of labor into your sexlife. We're supposed to be doing these things because we enjoy it.

So, unless you're a professional brewer or hooker the time spent is part of the pay off not the cost.

 

[olllllo]

Calculating the cost of labor into your homebrewing HOBBY is like calculating the cost of labor into your sexlife. We're supposed to be doing these things because we enjoy it.

So, unless you're a professional brewer or hooker the time spent is part of the pay off not the cost.

That's not a very good analogy. There are some people that will brew all day every day if given the opportunity. I've done double batch days and I can tell you that a third batch would be out of the question. It's a sliding scale of enjoyment.

But If I were to use your analogy. Some people are into the entire practice and others are into the last 15 seconds.

 

[COLObrewer]

If I were to only use cost of consumeables for my last few batches it would come out to appx. 0.0066666 cents per oz. of beer (appx. $4 per batch). But it certainly doesn't feel that way.

Very labor intensive when you count time to irrigate and tend/harvest hops, home malt your own barley, roast your own barley and malt, harvest/wash/store yeast, read numerous brewing books, research internet for countless hours, but that's the fun part right? Or is that the brewing part only?:rockin:

I do it because I can. Oh yeah and because I like beer.

 

[TexLaw]

Calculating the cost of labor into your homebrewing HOBBY is like calculating the cost of labor into your sexlife. We're supposed to be doing these things because we enjoy it.

I would have said the same thing, but I no longer agree. Jeep Man was absolutely correct when he said some people check out homebrewing solely to save money. It's like some who cook at home. They may not enjoy cooking, but they do it to save money. Sure, many cook at home because they enjoy it or for health reasons or who knows what, but many others do it to save money, period. The same goes with mowing your own yard, growing your own vegetables, painting your own house, redoing your own roof, etc. Some may view brewing the same way.


TL

 

[Boerderij_Kabouter]

Opportunity cost exists. You pay it for every action you take... yes including sex. Just because you want to ignore it doesn't mean it isn't there. Econ 101.

 

[olllllo]

*puts away revenuer's axe*

 

[chucke]

OK, from one cheap bastard to another- yes you can save money, with the following caveats;
- You have to look at *your time* as something spent on a hobby and not part of the total cost. If you don’t enjoy making beer and view brew time as a cost, you won’t save money…. stop here.
- You have to first buy/make a bunch of equipment.
- You have to brew enough to have the knowledge to; brew AG, buy in bulk and reuse yeast.
- You have to resist the urge to constantly upgrade your equipment.

Given those caveats, sure you can save a ton of money.

I brew mostly mid-range pub ales. Averaging the cost if my last 7 brews, including propane, is $12.85 per 5-gallon batch… or about 24 cents per 12 ounce bottle.

 

[flyangler18]

I normally stay as far away from these threads as I can manage, but I always seem to be drawn in. Guess I'm just a sucker.

Anyway, we have to recognize that there's a lot of brewers who enter into the hobby/pursuit/whatever you call it purely as a cost-saving measure. Craigtube comes to mind - I know he's often maligned on here, but let's face it: he's faced with prohibitive beer costs in Canada and he's trimming cost by making it at home and seems perfectly satisfied with his kit + kilo approach. I can't argue with that - he embraces the homebrewing spirit of DIY or die.

Our own LGI has been tormenting himself for ages trying to perfect the bitter he grew up drinking - but he's doing so by using well-established AG brewing methods.

There's really not much difference between them, fundamentally.

It's easy to forget when we get into these diatribes that there's still lots of brewers out there who brew, say, 5 batches a year and do so with the least amount of effort and equipment as they can - because it's all about the consumables. I'd say that most of us here brew ahead of the volume curve.

 

[Laughing_Gnome_Invisible]

My time is extremely valuable to me. If I felt that i was was wasting it by brewing, then I would stop.

I won't put a dollar amount on my brewing time just as i won't put a dollar amount on time spent on scratching my ass or completing my plans for world domination. There are some things that we do just because we can.

I don't expect to get paid for scratching my ass, and i don't put a dollar amount onthe time spent on my hobby either.

 

[sudbuster]

*puts away revenuer's axe*

olllllo,
Well, now that this all seems to be settled, I've only one thing to say, you can come to my house any time and pour out my beer. I'll even give you the 20. Be kinda fun to meet you.

 

[Vuarra]

My time is immeasurable, my reward (in beer) is incalculable. I make beer for the same reason I have sex -- I like doing it. I invested in my hardware, and compare my consumables in comparison to my favourite mass market brew, and I justify my abilities in accordance to my tastes.

BTW, one batch of home brew is about the same as one 2-4 of premium Canadian beer. I love making beer. Cases closed.

 

[Bildo]

I think you all have some good points, I thought about this last night and realised, I could spend 3-4 hours a day playing a video game I payed $40 for, just to be bored of it in a week and spend another $40. Or I could buy a big chemistry set and get something good out of it!

 

[dantodd]

That's not a very good analogy. There are some people that will brew all day every day if given the opportunity. I've done double batch days and I can tell you that a third batch would be out of the question. It's a sliding scale of enjoyment.

I'd say that fits in quite nicely with the analogy One or two batches a day is plenty. Do you remember the old saying about the young bull and the old bull?

 

[dantodd]

I would have said the same thing, but I no longer agree. Jeep Man was absolutely correct when he said some people check out homebrewing solely to save money.

See, I agree to some extent but, if they are completely disinterested in the process and just want an economic advantage through homebrewing then I'd place them in the latter category who are completely disinterested in the process but just have an economic interest in sex. Perhaps in this case they are more of a trophy wife type than an outright hooker but that's just a fancy name for the same thing.

 

[alexdagrate]

There's another aspect to it as well:

The first time I ever tasted a Cascadian Dark Ale was when I cracked open one I made. I had read about this style of beer online and in the newspaper and even seen videos of brewers talking about the style, but it wasn't available in bottles anywhere in my area (And I live in Western Washington State, so there's no shortage of decent beer stores here).

So, I looked up some recipe ideas, went down to my LHBS, created my own recipe, and it turned out great. Friends were impressed that I created a beer they had never tried before.

About a week later, I went on a road trip to Bend, OR and tried Deschutes' version of the style. It was fantastic, but I was still amazed and how well my own version held up.

 

[chuggs]

p.s. Mind telling which Guinness clone you are using? I'm still searching for 'the grail' as I go toward making my first batch this fall of the dark goodness.

-J

Not at all,

I had bought the book, "Clone Brews"... It's amazing how many recipes that are available today. They had a clone of Guinness Extra Stout. I wasn't able to get the exact ingredients from my LHBS...so I substituted some...and went without rice hull...just try to be careful to avoid a stuck mash when you go to sparge. I'm sure I've got it on my other computer stored away somewhere.

I can't say it's perfect...but it's pretty smooth and the acidulated malt gives it that twang. It's worth comparing to all the other recipes...to see what they have in common and where they diverge.

Charlie

 

[mparmer]

Fascinating thread, I probably have about $100 in my little extract brewery, I've made about 5 batches so far,and yes, there's no question that equipment cost, utilities, time, etc all count toward total cost per six. But, I have had so much fun learning about this and doing this, the only thing that really applies to my assessment is the ingredients. That whopping $100 equipment? Honestly, how many out there doesn't have a wife that goes shopping 2 or 3 or more times a month and spends more than that and you NEVER SEE A CRAPPING THING TO SHOW FOR THAT $. Who knows what the heck they spend all that $ on. I'm just gonna brew extract kits and keep my eye out for cheap stuff to adapt to AG over time and not worry about it. It's fun and I'm enjoying my beer. My calc's so far have me at about $3.25 a 6. Brew on!!!!

 

[Bildo]

Wow mparmer, $3.25 is still pretty good, hopefully I'll have completed my beer kit soon, after researching. I'm not ashamed to say that I use a mr. beer kit, it works for what I need it for. But it's time to move on now, I want to brew more beer!

 

[humann_brewing]

I did not get into this hobby to save money, in fact this comes out of my pocket where as if I buy it from the grocery store, it goes on the family account so basically I can get half priced beer at the store or pay for it all if I homebrew. I rarely buy beer at the store now so that says a lot.