Contaminated Yeast ?!

[brewit2it]

Hector has asked me for my thoughts on this thread.

I brew 2.5g batches.
I use 11.5 oz. US-05 packets. I only use half of the packet.
I sanitize my scissors and eyeball half the pack and pour it into a sanitized beaker of cooled, boiled water to rehydrate. I do not sanitize the packet. Then I fold the top a couple of times, staple it, and put it into a Ziplock bag in the fridge. I haven't had any problems that I can detect. My beer tastes pretty good to me.
I am not saying what I do is the correct way to do it.

Here are some quotes, and my ideas:
“After measuring 2 grams of the yeast. I would keep it closed in the Refrigerator.” - hector

Basically I do this, although I use half of the yeast for each batch. I eyeball the amount. Very non-scientific.


“The Yeast which I use is Safale S-04 Ale Dry Yeast." - hector

I believe S-04 is the English ale yeast, and I find English beer to be a little on the sour side. I have never used this yeast.


“You really can't save opened dry yeast more than a week, maybe two.” - Yooper
“[Fermentis says to] use the remaining yeast within seven days.” - badhabit

I have let my opened, folded, and stapled yeast packet sit in the fridge (In the cheese drawer of all places!) for a month before using the second half. Not saying it is the right thing to do, but I have not had any problems, yet.


I have never had an infected beer that I know of, and I am not sure I would know why a beer tasted bad if I did.
I do not use LME or DME for anything. Not since batch #9. I am an all-grain brewer.
So, I really have no authority or idea why your beer tastes sour.

All I can tell you is what I do. I can't say whether it is a good practice or not. Probably not, but two days ago, I just brewed my 51st batch in two years, and I have never had a problem.

Good luck finding better results!

Wow, AG is a lot of work for 2.5 gallon batches, more power to you.

 

[eanmcnulty]

Wow, AG is a lot of work for 2.5 gallon batches, more power to you.

Yeah, I know what you mean. But I was at a point when I wanted to go all-grain, but I didn't want to spend the cash on a bigger pot. So, I decided to brew half-batches. It probably would have been cheaper in the long run, because I now have six 3g Better Bottles, a 5g cooler MLT, a new 5G cooler HLT, and a 20' CFC!
When I first started brewing AG I was doing a no-sparge process, and I was able to brew in 3 hours 15 minutes roughly. That was great. I could brew after work and be done by 8:00PM. Then I started brewing bigger and bigger beers and I had to start sparging. The 5g cooler wasn't big enough. (Any of you who told me I should have bought a 10g cooler, I will give you the I-told-you-so.)
Well, now I'm invested in the 3g batches. It takes me about 4 hours now, and I can still brew after work, which is nice. I brew all the time now. 10 batches in the past moth and a half. I brewed 30 batches last year, and I hope to brew 40 this year. It's nice because I always have new and different beer. It doesn't cost me and arm and a leg, either.
I know most people can't do it, because of time constraints. I'm a teacher. In the summer I can golf in the morning and brew in the afternoon..., everyday if I want! Cheers!

Oh yeah. Back to the sour beer, you guys...

 

[hector]

Thanks !

But , I was waiting to hear Comments about what I wrote in the Post #149 !

Hector

 

[eanmcnulty]

Thanks !

But , I was waiting to hear Comments about what I wrote in the Post #149 !

Hector

Okay.
It looks like you process is sound. I don't know why your beer tastes sour. I'm sorry I can not help you.

 

[Revvy]

Okay.
It looks like you process is sound. I don't know why your beer tastes sour. I'm sorry I can not help you.

Unfortunately I agree with Ean, there's nothing intrinsically wrong with what you're doing, if anything you're more anal that most of us about sanitization- Glass rods, latex gloves....I really don't use any of that stuff, nor do I use soap and water to clean. I tend to hot water rinse a lot of stuff, and if I do use any cleansers it's oxyclean soaks with copious amounts of rinsing.

I'm stumped as well. Maybe you are just experiencing green beer as sour and being pre-mature in your judgement. You don't talk about your bottling process though...what's that? Have any of these ended up in bottles and had a change to condition?

Also going back to the dry yeast storage, I am also like Ean, I just re-seal the packets on dry when using them in small batches (sometimes just rolling up the packet tightly and sealing it with a rubber band) and I just toss it in my fridge. When I reuse it I spray it with starsan. But I've never had any issues with using it even after several months.

Also any dry yeast that one doesn't want to use, just store it and dump it in the boil on your next batch- it's a great yeast food, since yeast are cannibals. They will go for it first and get all uppity for eating all the sugars in your wort. So it won't go to waste.

Now as to the comment about "AG being a lot of work for small batches" I do batches all the way from 1 gallon to 25 gallons, and do a LOT of 2.5 gallon ag batches mostly in the winter, on my stove but I also do it for doing a lot of test batches, or batches where I know I don't want 5 gallons of beer (mostly experimental batches.) Just because it may not be everyone's cup of tea, a LOT OF US DO SMALL BATCH BREWING.

And to me, it's a hobby, I ENJOY my brewing sessions, regardless of the size of the batch. It's never "work" for me. If any of it were work I sure as hell wouldn't be doing it......

 

[hector]

Unfortunately I agree with Ean, there's nothing intrinsically wrong with what you're doing, if anything you're more anal that most of us about sanitization- Glass rods, latex gloves....I really don't use any of that stuff, nor do I use soap and water to clean. I tend to hot water rinse a lot of stuff, and if I do use any cleansers it's oxyclean soaks with copious amounts of rinsing.

I'm stumped as well. Maybe you are just experiencing green beer as sour and being pre-mature in your judgement. You don't talk about your bottling process though...what's that? Have any of these ended up in bottles and had a change to condition?

I was sure my brewing Process is nearly perfect ( just similar to a Surgery ) !

So why does the Beer come out always too SOUR ?!!

After 3 Weeks in the Primary and then 3 Weeks at 70F in the Bottle , I would not call it a green Beer , as it had a medium O.G. and enough time .

As I opened the first Bottle , my Mother who was sitting near me said : " Oh , what a sour smell ! It's just Vinegar ! "

I already described my bottling day in the Post #125 of this Thread .

I dissolved 0.18 Oz. ( 5.1 Grams ) of Dextrose in 200 mL of Water , boiled it

for 15 Minutes and after cooling it , racked the Beer onto it in a bottling Bucket .

Then I bottled the Beer and it gave me three Pet Bottles ( 330 mL each ) .

Imagine yourself a Sourness Scale between 0 and 100 . On the bottling day it was 20 , but 3 Weeks later as I opened the first Bottle , it was 90 !

There were no detectable Malty Aroma !

Only Sourness in the Mouth !

Even a green Beer can have Malty aroma to some degrees , I suppose .

I'm going to brew another small Batch using some new DME which I bought recently to see if the Problem is caused by the quality of the Extract .

Hector

 

[Revvy]

quality of the Extract .

Hector

I already posted it once, the "quality" of your extract has nothing to do with sour beer!!! There's no anti microbial function is "brewer's" grade extract that's not in "baker's grade" extract- As I stated in post 147;

As to the dfferent grade of extract, indeed there are two grades, the brewing grade is more pure in flavor than the baker's grade, BUT they are interchangable, just as you can bake with brewer's lme, you can make drinkable beer with the cooking grade extract. In fact the baker's grade LME you are getting is probably on par with the brewer's grade we got prior to legalization of homebrewing in 1978.

So that's not a source of your problem, the difference would be let's say if we made an all grain beer with grain we bought at the homebrew shop that may have been made and malted from last year's crop, and us growing our own barley, plucking it immediately , then malting it and making beer with it. Obviously the latter would be a tad better than the former, but they'd both work.

But this has nothing to do with souring....something is happening post boil to your wort which is causing it. But your grade of extract has nothing to do with it.

 

[janivar123]

Still talking about the unhopped batch or did you have a chanse to bottle something else?

 

[Revvy]

The thing to remember about "food grade malt extract" is that it is still produced by the malters that is making the ones for beer. In fact the ONLY REASON folks are using it for food these days is that the breweries were looking for a way to stay open during prohibition. Someone realized that the LME that was being made for brewing was tasty and would make a good thing to use in baking...so some were able to stay open during prohibition. They even produced cookbooks (although they tended to still put hops in SOME of the extract. ) and if you asked really nice about making beer with it, you would usually get the baking cookbook in the mail....but a few weeks later you would get mimeographed sheets in a plain brown envelope that described how to make beer with it.....

For all intents and purposes it IS the same product.

HISTORY OF PREMIER MALT PRODUCTS

Premier Malt Products was born in the early 1920’s as a response to the beginning of a period of prohibition across America. During the years of prohibition in the early 20th century the Pabst Brewing Company as well as other family breweries were closed. It was during this time that the Perlstein brothers bought controlling interest in the Pabst Brewing plants and changed the name to Premier Malt Products, Inc. The new company began to produce a line of canned malts both with and without hops to sell into the grocery trade across America under the trade name of Blue Ribbon Malt.

While disguised as malt for the housewife to bake cakes and cookies the unwritten and most practiced use for Blue Ribbon Malt was the manufacture of beer by people in their homes. In 1933 as the era of prohibition came to an end the Pabst family reacquired the breweries with their family name and again began to brew the beer that made Pabst Blue Ribbon one of the most popular beers in America. The demand for the “Blue Ribbon” home brew products as well as the popularity of malt in commercial baking and cereal manufacturing continued, so the Pabst family continued the manufacturing of these products within their breweries at Milwaukee and later in Peoria, Illinois until 1980 when they closed their Peoria plant.

In 1981 the business Premier Malt Products, Inc. was purchased by a group of private investors and still today manufactures, sells and distributes the same high quality malt extracts that were used in home brewing kits sold during prohibition. These all-natural malt extracts and syrups are used today for manufacturing of healthy foods such as cereals, breads, baked goods and a multitude of fine products for human and animal consumption. In addition Premier sells a host of other organic sweeteners made from rice, cane sugars and other natural ingredients. Premier has affiliated production and warehousing facilities in the United States, Canada and Europe that enable it to meet the requirements of it’s vast customer base and deliver it’s products around the globe.

 

[hector]

I already posted it once, the "quality" of your extract has nothing to do with sour beer!!!

The DME I used for my Batch is made in India .

Yesterday I met someone who imports Malt Extract into my Country . He said that some Brewing Companies in my

Country used such Extract and the Result was not satisfying at all .

He said also that he has never seen any good quality Extract which is made in India . He recommended me to use LME and gave me a Sample .

It is a " Vegetal Extract Concentrate " as it's written on a sheet of paper which is given to me with the Sample .

It's written also that it is free from off flavors .

It is manufactured by " PureMalt Products Ltd. " in Scotland .

What do you think Revvy ?

Is it a good Idea to brew with it ?!

If yes , then should I use it alone or is it better to use some DME , too ?!

Hector

 

[Revvy]

It is manufactured by " PureMalt Products Ltd. " in Scotland .

I just looked at their website. If you can get ahold of either their lme or dme, then you're good.

 

[caughtablaze]

this thread warms my heart. best of luck to you Hector.