cleaning chillers

[Owly055]

I use a home made immersion chiller, but would like to have an internal chiller of some type. What holds me back from this is the fact that there really is no way to be sure they are clean inside. A plate chiller bothers me more than any other, in that I have cut open oil coolers of similar design, and always found an abundance of sediment in areas where there is no direct flow. Plate chillers have lots of dead spaces to accumulate settlings where no amount of flushing is going to get it out. If they were not so expensive, cutting one open after a year or two of use would be interesting.

The other day I watched my friend who owns a microbrewery clean his plate chiller with a hose. Take a few wing nuts loose, and spread the plates, and hose it out. The water passages didn't spread open, but the wort passages did. It had a LOT of trub in it, but he hadn't flushed it with water first.

Every brew, he opens and cleans the chiller! Needless to say, it's quite large and very expensive.

A counterflow chiller has no dead spaces, and in theory at least could be swabbed internally using something a suitable swab pushed through by water or compressed air. It also could be flushed using a combination of water and compressed air like flushing a radiator..... with some assurance of getting it all.

For this reason, and because I can build it myself, I will go to a counterflow when I do finally go to an internal chiller. I want an internal chiller for two reasons. One is so I can use a Hopback, and the other is sanitation. Hot wort goes in one end, cold wort comes out the other, and if the water is not turned on until the wort comes out the far end, it should be sanitized by the hot wort, and it can flow directly into the fermenter. A win win situation. As it is, I have a full kettle of wort with the chiller sitting in it, and the top wide open. For around half of the 8 minutes it takes to chill my wort, it's vulnerable to microbes from the environment..... being cool enough for them to survive.


H.W.

 

[j1n]

Check out the CFC that Jaded brewing has. it allows you to see the insides. maybe design the one your going to build like theirs....

 

[Owly055]

Check out the CFC that Jaded brewing has. it allows you to see the insides. maybe design the one your going to build like theirs....

I've seen photos of that before in the adds on this forum, but never gave it much thought. I can't imagine trying to build something like that!!

I have a vision of a plate chiller where the plates carry water, and the works is in a housing that directs the wort through between the plates. The housing is removable, exposing all the cooling surfaces... That would be complicated to build also.

The simplest chiller to build would be a counterflow using a hose around a copper tube. I do believe a cloth swab could be pushed through the tube fairly easily. I suppose I should try it.

H.W.

 

[kombat]

I use a plate chiller and have been extremely happy with it. My cleaning regimen is to backflow it with hot water, then a hot Oxyclean solution (made using the hot "waste" water produced during chilling), then flush it with cold water. I run each cycle for between 10-15 minutes while I clean the boil kettle, oxygenate the wort, and pitch the yeast.

That first backflush produces some "gunk," but after that, it runs perfectly clean. If there are hidden deposits inside the plate chiller, I don't care, because:

• I sanitize the entire system by running boiling wort through it for 5 minutes with 15 minutes left to go in the boil.
• I haven't found any particles floating around in my resulting beer that I would blame on the chiller
• I haven't detected any off flavours that I would attribute to an unclean chiller
• I've never had an infection in almost 100 batches of beer (knock on wood)

So if I can't see any contaminants in my beer, and I don't taste any contaminants, and even if there were contaminants they'd be sanitized because I flush the chiller/hoses/pump with boiling wort before chilling, then why would I care if there happen to be hidden deposits somewhere deep inside the chiller? It's not affecting the product, and the tool is remarkably effective at chilling the beer (boiling down to 64° F in around 4 minutes).

 

[govner1]

I use a home made immersion chiller, but would like to have an internal chiller of some type. What holds me back from this is the fact that there really is no way to be sure they are clean inside. A plate chiller bothers me more than any other, in that I have cut open oil coolers of similar design, and always found an abundance of sediment in areas where there is no direct flow. Plate chillers have lots of dead spaces to accumulate settlings where no amount of flushing is going to get it out. If they were not so expensive, cutting one open after a year or two of use would be interesting.

The other day I watched my friend who owns a microbrewery clean his plate chiller with a hose. Take a few wing nuts loose, and spread the plates, and hose it out. The water passages didn't spread open, but the wort passages did. It had a LOT of trub in it, but he hadn't flushed it with water first.

Every brew, he opens and cleans the chiller! Needless to say, it's quite large and very expensive.

A counterflow chiller has no dead spaces, and in theory at least could be swabbed internally using something a suitable swab pushed through by water or compressed air. It also could be flushed using a combination of water and compressed air like flushing a radiator..... with some assurance of getting it all.

For this reason, and because I can build it myself, I will go to a counterflow when I do finally go to an internal chiller. I want an internal chiller for two reasons. One is so I can use a Hopback, and the other is sanitation. Hot wort goes in one end, cold wort comes out the other, and if the water is not turned on until the wort comes out the far end, it should be sanitized by the hot wort, and it can flow directly into the fermenter. A win win situation. As it is, I have a full kettle of wort with the chiller sitting in it, and the top wide open. For around half of the 8 minutes it takes to chill my wort, it's vulnerable to microbes from the environment..... being cool enough for them to survive.


H.W.

I've used a CFC for several years w/ no cleaning issues. The internal parts that contact the wort are copper. I soak/rinse w/ StarSan prior to use and then give it a thorough rinse w/ SaniClean following each use.

 

[jdr01]

Made this out of 1/2" and 3/4" copper tubing and some T's and reducers. Cools remarkably fast. Inexpensive to make. Cleans with a bore brush if needs but normally just rinse it. Wish I had some better photo's of it.

View attachment IMG_1519.MOV

 

[Owly055]

Made this out of 1/2" and 3/4" copper tubing and some T's and reducers. Cools remarkably fast. Inexpensive to make. Cleans with a bore brush if needs but normally just rinse it. Wish I had some better photo's of it.

I like this........... The commercial one with the clear lines has so many sections and fittings that with all the materials and time, it would make sense to just buy one! The problem of course is where to you put something that big? I brew in the kitchen. I suppose I could hang it from the ceiling. A new concept "kitchen sculpture" ;-)

H.W.

 

[Owly055]

I've used a CFC for several years w/ no cleaning issues. The internal parts that contact the wort are copper. I soak/rinse w/ StarSan prior to use and then give it a thorough rinse w/ SaniClean following each use.

I understand and tend to agree with that mindset to some extent..... What you don't know won't hurt you. I just don't like the inevitable deposits as a personal prejudice. Those presumably sterile particles are not going to hurt anything and will simply end up as trub if they are dislodged.

It might make sense with one of these to simply leave if filled with starsan when not in use perhaps??

H.W.

 

[conpewter]

I understand and tend to agree with that mindset to some extent..... What you don't know won't hurt you. I just don't like the inevitable deposits as a personal prejudice. Those presumably sterile particles are not going to hurt anything and will simply end up as trub if they are dislodged.

It might make sense with one of these to simply leave if filled with starsan when not in use perhaps??

H.W.

be careful with leaving copper soaking with star-san. I left an immersion chiller in a bucket of star-san for a week and got green corrosion at the water line. Might happen in the CFC if there are bubbles or it slowly leaks out.

 

[dobes]

I use a PC and I backflush the chiller when done. Then throw it in the oven one day while cooking dinner. Give it a rinse after then I'll either use it for brewing or I may throw it back in the oven one more time keeping it sealed up and ready for use.
If for some reason I don't use my oven it gets boiling water running thru it before use.
I don't have a CFC but if I were buying again I would probably go with making one that could be taken apart for ease of cleaning. Not that I ever had an issue with my PC but just for peace of mind.

 

[Owly055]

I use a PC and I backflush the chiller when done. Then throw it in the oven one day while cooking dinner. Give it a rinse after then I'll either use it for brewing or I may throw it back in the oven one more time keeping it sealed up and ready for use.
If for some reason I don't use my oven it gets boiling water running thru it before use.
I don't have a CFC but if I were buying again I would probably go with making one that could be taken apart for ease of cleaning. Not that I ever had an issue with my PC but just for peace of mind.

"Peace of mind" ...... That says it in a nutshell..


H.W.

 

[govner1]

I understand and tend to agree with that mindset to some extent..... What you don't know won't hurt you. I just don't like the inevitable deposits as a personal prejudice. Those presumably sterile particles are not going to hurt anything and will simply end up as trub if they are dislodged.



It might make sense with one of these to simply leave if filled with starsan when not in use perhaps??



H.W.

I only have an average of 2+ brews per month over 2 1/2 years w/ no issues. I don't leave anything in the CFC after rinsing w/ Sani Clean and emptying. Also, remember I fill w/ StarSan & let it sit at least 20 minutes before flushing prior to chilling.

 

[DrunkleJon]

I've seen photos of that before in the adds on this forum, but never gave it much thought. I can't imagine trying to build something like that!!

I have a vision of a plate chiller where the plates carry water, and the works is in a housing that directs the wort through between the plates. The housing is removable, exposing all the cooling surfaces... That would be complicated to build also.

The simplest chiller to build would be a counterflow using a hose around a copper tube. I do believe a cloth swab could be pushed through the tube fairly easily. I suppose I should try it.

H.W.

I think I understand what you are getting at. Shoot a cotton ball spit ball through the inside of the CFC. Probably wouldnt work with a convuluted style CFC though. If only there were disassembleable plate chillers. I am sure that the builders of one of those could make a fortune on replacement gaskets for them too.

 

[Komocabo]

I use a plate chiller and also really like it. Its the dudadiesel 30 plate long chiller. I also back flush to clean and fill it with Starsan and cap it when done. On brewday, I run boiling water through it right before I start to chill. Also no problems to date. I get what you're saying and I was the same way. I had a hard time trusting the cleanliness for the first several batches. Now I am confident in its ability to stay clean and not cause any problems.