Cider vs Mead...

[bmd2k1]

Curious why peeps would make mead over cider? Seems like ALOT more work (...and costs more cuz of the honey). I know there are many on HBT that do both. I'd like to hear from ya [emoji16]

I've enjoyed some meads over the years - but like cider much better.

Cheers [emoji111]

 

[MarkKF]

Mead is just different. I make a lot of cider but just some mead. It ages well and you can open a wine bottle on special occasions. Try a cyzer. Taste of a mead and ease of a cider. And you do it with cheap ingredients from the supermarket. Honey + FAJC + water (fruit optional). No step feeding required.

 

[JimRausch]

I do beer, fruit wine, cider, graf, melomels and other types of meads. Why? Why do any one of them? Because we like the taste, or maybe have tried something that we want to try and match, or just wondered "I wonder if....".
I also bottle and and just counted- I have 26 different beers, a couple ciders and grafs, some wines and meads all available. Never know what I might be in the mood for tonight!
I think I'll go crack open a Bud light......

 

[Justwingnit]

I do beer, fruit wine, cider, graf, melomels and other types of meads. Why? Why do any one of them? Because we like the taste, or maybe have tried something that we want to try and match, or just wondered "I wonder if....".
I also bottle and and just counted- I have 26 different beers, a couple ciders and grafs, some wines and meads all available. Never know what I might be in the mood for tonight!
I think I'll go crack open a Bud light......

Yep, Beer. Wine, Cider, Mead, all cost $ some more then others. What you like is what you are going to make. I do it as a cool hobby, and with being diabetic I get to control the sugar I'm consuming.

 

[Amadeo38]

Making a good mead is much more of a challenge than a good cider.

Pitching some yeast into apple juice isn’t much of a process.

Properly nourishing and feeding wine yeast to ferment various varieties of honey without off-flavors, then aging it and adjusting the final acidity to make it even more balanced and palatable; now that’s a fun challenge!

 

[Blacksmith1]

Don't know where you are, but just throwing yeast into AJ here, makes for a really nasty brew.

oh you're in north fl. How are you getting god results with AJ that way, at least two of us need your secret.

 

[Amadeo38]

Hmm, I’ve bought 100% fresh-pressed and pasteurized AJ by the half-gallon BOGO at Publix and pitched packets of us-05 or dumped it on top of a wlp001 yeast cake and it turns out fantastic. Just rack into a keg and carbonate. My wife and I like ours dry and 5% ABV, so never messed with additions other than some fruit juice in the keg before racking as a flavoring.

I’ve also use 100% AJ from concentrate via Sam’s club, pitched a packet of saf-cider in it, and thrown in some fruit purée for two weeks after primary ended. Also turned out great. Have never messed up a batch of store bought juice with these methods.

Mead on the other hand...that was a learning curve.

 

[Blacksmith1]

Maybe that was my issue, I've been using S-04 which stresses in the heat.

 

[Amadeo38]

Perhaps it’s a temperature control thing, if you’re not using that? I’ve always used a ferm chamber set to the mid point of the yeasts comfort range.

Sorry for derailing the thread. Back to the discussion!

 

[Maylar]

Curious why peeps would make mead over cider? Seems like ALOT more work (...and costs more cuz of the honey). I know there are many on HBT that do both. I'd like to hear from ya [emoji16]

I've enjoyed some meads over the years - but like cider much better.

Cheers [emoji111]

I started making mead because cider needs to be cold fermented and I can't do that in the summer. First one was a JAOM (see my avatar) and it was delicious after a few months. I was hooked.

I see mead as a wine, and cider as a pint drink, perfect with BBQ on the patio. I always keg cider, my meads are still. My meads are 11 - 13% ABV, ciders 6 - 6.5%. Then there's cysers, a combination of the 2, which can go either way.

When I first considered doing mead I asked the forum what commercial one to try to get an idea of what they're like. I was advised to just make my own because if a commercial one sucked it'd turn me off to them. Really glad I did that.

Your ciders are AJ and concentrate. That's gonna change next fall... I want you to acquire buckets and carboys and prepare to step up your game to bigger batches. More on that come October

If you do decide to make mead, please stay away from Chinese Walmart honey. See this thread:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/whats-your-favorite-honey-for-mead.662451/

 

[CKuhns]

Agree with pretty much what has been said.

The best response I have is that I like mead and cider and can do a pretty good job at both.

I can drink a pretty good cider from FAJC SO4 or SO5 and fruit in secondary in 4 to 6 weeks without doing much of anything to it. (Not much art or skill to it but then again it is nice to have a pint or two on occasion.) My meads end up at 14 to 16%. Drinkable in 6 months and good to great in 12 to 18 depending upon how well i treat them and the nutrient protocol used during the ferment. (Bit more of a challenge and you really must watch your conditions, match your practices and techniques to what works well with them and match your yeast, honey and any additions.) I kind of like the challenge and sure do enjoy it when i get it just right.

 

[Brett_Bellmore]

Curious why peeps would make mead over cider? Seems like ALOT more work (...and costs more cuz of the honey). I know there are many on HBT that do both. I'd like to hear from ya [emoji16]

I've enjoyed some meads over the years - but like cider much better.

Cheers [emoji111]

Well, when my first wife divorced me, I wanted to drink myself into an early grave in an *interesting* way, and mead seemed more unusual than hard cider. Got over that quick, (Get stinking drunk because you've got a problem, the next day you've got a problem AND a headache!) but I did like the mead.

I'm perfectly open to trying cider some time, though, as I do like apples. Just haven't gotten around to it.

 

[bmd2k1]

Thx all for the feedback I make my ciders using locally pressed juice from a variety of cider mills and also store bought 100% AJ -- batches are in the 4-7gal range. I ferment using 20L & 30L Speidels...they are awesome. For other things I use only raw local honey which costs $20 for 3lbs. May try a cyser at some point to compare with my variety of ciders. My goal in starting this thread was to hear why folks make mead vs cider -- I should have added -- given you could Only Make one -- which would you choose and why? Cheers!

I started making mead because cider needs to be cold fermented and I can't do that in the summer. First one was a JAOM (see my avatar) and it was delicious after a few months. I was hooked.

I see mead as a wine, and cider as a pint drink, perfect with BBQ on the patio. I always keg cider, my meads are still. My meads are 11 - 13% ABV, ciders 6 - 6.5%. Then there's cysers, a combination of the 2, which can go either way.

When I first considered doing mead I asked the forum what commercial one to try to get an idea of what they're like. I was advised to just make my own because if a commercial one sucked it'd turn me off to them. Really glad I did that.

Your ciders are AJ and concentrate. That's gonna change next fall... I want you to acquire buckets and carboys and prepare to step up your game to bigger batches. More on that come October

If you do decide to make mead, please stay away from Chinese Walmart honey. See this thread:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum/threads/whats-your-favorite-honey-for-mead.662451/

u

 

[JimRausch]

I should have added -- given you could Only Make one -- which would you choose and why?

Ahhh, now this is interesting. I think that if only one, I would make cider. I've only started with the meads in the past year, and only cracked open 1 batch so far- it was great! But, for me cider is more accessible and more adaptable. Do I want a 5% easy-drinking? Or a 10% let's lay it down for awhile before opening one to sip on a cold winter's night? Do I want it dry, semi-sweet , still, carbonated? Cider seems to fulfill all these possibilities. Perhaps mead in all it's variations does as well, but I have a lot to learn about it.

 

[Maylar]

Thx all for the feedback I make my ciders using locally pressed juice from a variety of cider mills and also store bought 100% AJ -- batches are in the 4-7gal range. I ferment using 20L & 30L Speidels...they are awesome. For other things I use only raw local honey which costs $20 for 3lbs. May try a cyser at some point to compare with my variety of ciders. My goal in starting this thread was to hear why folks make mead vs cider -- I should have added -- given you could Only Make one -- which would you choose and why? Cheers!

Oh.. OK, sorry. For some reason I thought you were one of the 1/2 gallon experimenter guys. Must be mixing you up with someone else.

If I had to chose I'd do cider, mostly because it's something you can drink any time. It goes with practically everything. And I've been doing it for a long time. My first 5 gallon mead is in process now.

 

[MarkKF]

I still haven’t made more than one gal. Of mead or cyzer at a time. And I still have some in the basement from 2017!

 

[NeverDie]

Since you ask: I prefer meads because.... they taste magical! Nectar of the gods. Plus, it feels like an homage to my viking heritage. I started with ciders, then cysers, and now I'm primarily making only meads, especially now that I've found some really good yeasts for it.

So far I'm doing quick meads--and I'm very happy with them!--but maybe with time I'll gain the patience to tuck some away for longer aging.

 

[Brett_Bellmore]

All things being equal, I think I'd prefer mead making because fresh apple juice is only seasonally available, but you can get honey year round.

But, come apple season, I'm going to give cider a try.

 

[GeneDaniels1963]

given you could Only Make one -- which would you choose and why? Cheers! u

Hands down it would be cider. I make a nice 7% cider using FAJC to bump it up, and I can drink it every day. There are so many simple changes to add variety; backsweeten or not, different yeasts, berry adds, etc, etc.

I just planted two apple trees so I can up my game from store bought juice. One is a crab, the other is Arkansas Black. Can't wait until those are producing!

S now I made ciders for me, wines to enjoy with the wife and share with friends. But for my own personal tastes, it is cider hands down every time.

 

[GeneDaniels1963]

All things being equal, I think I'd prefer mead making because fresh apple juice is only seasonally available, but you can get honey year round.

But, come apple season, I'm going to give cider a try.

You can make some really nice cider with store bought juice if you add crab apples. I add 2-3 lb of frozen and crushed crabs to each 2 gal fermenting bucket of cider. Gives it a nice, crisp taste that is FAR superior to the sicky sweet ciders that are typical in the American market like Angry Orchard.

 

[Brett_Bellmore]

You can make some really nice cider with store bought juice if you add crab apples. I add 2-3 lb of frozen and crushed crabs to each 2 gal fermenting bucket of cider. Gives it a nice, crisp taste that is FAR superior to the sicky sweet ciders that are typical in the American market like Angry Orchard.

The amusing thing is, I've tried Angry Orchard, and think it's too dry...

 

[madscientist451]

Curious why peeps would make mead over cider? [emoji111]

You can add flavors to cider to change it up somewhat, but with mead you have more opportunities to add things like coffee, spices, and fruits that would clash with cider.
The cider you can make is of course limited by the apples and juice you can get.
Most people can't get real cider apples or even heirloom varieties, it just doesn't pay to grow them anymore. You can get a wide variety of honey shipped right to your house.
Mead is way more expensive, (but I have spent as much as $12/gallon for juice made from real cider apples) and I don't make as much mead as I do cider, but I like to have a variety of things to choose from when I decide to have a drink.

 

[MarkKF]

Hands down it would be cider. I make a nice 7% cider using FAJC to bump it up, and I can drink it every day. There are so many simple changes to add variety; backsweeten or not, different yeasts, berry adds, etc, etc.

I just planted two apple trees so I can up my game from store bought juice. One is a crab, the other is Arkansas Black.

Did you check if those two will cross pollinate? Otherwise you might not get any fruit.

 

[Brett_Bellmore]

According to this, white blossomed crab apples will typically do the job for Arkansas Black. (A delicious variety, one of my favorites!)

https://www.orangepippintrees.com/pollinationchecker.aspx?v=1181

But it's kind of tricky because Arkansas Black requires two different pollinators that are mutually fertile, or that it's pollinator be self-fertile.

So I guess it depends on which crab you picked. But you'd probably be better off if you planted a third tree of the right variety.

 

[mwilcox]

making cider or perry I'm proud of may involve me driving several hundred miles for the right apples/pears. With milling and pressing and the general lower alcohol levels compared to mead, and the delicate nature of some of these apple and pear aromas that tend to blow off with a fermentation as vigorous as that of my mead, I consider cider anything but easier to make than mead. YMMV.

 

[Wanne]

I don't know. I'm new to all of this and I like to make both since the ciders take A LOT less time and I can enjoy while I'm waiting for my meads. I've got 3 different batches of cider going on right now in gallon jugs. And three 1 gallon different meads and a 3 gallon batch of cherry mead I just a couple weeks ago. From a cost perspective..the ciders are much cheaper...that's a big plus.

 

[wasully]

According to this, white blossomed crab apples will typically do the job for Arkansas Black. (A delicious variety, one of my favorites!)

https://www.orangepippintrees.com/pollinationchecker.aspx?v=1181

But it's kind of tricky because Arkansas Black requires two different pollinators that are mutually fertile, or that it's pollinator be self-fertile.

So I guess it depends on which crab you picked. But you'd probably be better off if you planted a third tree of the right variety.

Could always have the 2nd tree grafted with a 3rd variety.

I'm waiting for it to stop snowing intermittently so I can plant a couple 4x1 cider apple tree from here: https://raintreenursery.com/fruit-trees/4x1-cider-maker-apple-d-hm-gr-hr-kb-mm106-a8504sc

 

[Brett_Bellmore]

Could always have the 2nd tree grafted with a 3rd variety.

I'm waiting for it to stop snowing intermittently so I can plant a couple 4x1 cider apple tree from here: https://raintreenursery.com/fruit-trees/4x1-cider-maker-apple-d-hm-gr-hr-kb-mm106-a8504sc

They're a good nursery, I've bought from them before.

 

[GeneDaniels1963]

According to this, white blossomed crab apples will typically do the job for Arkansas Black. (A delicious variety, one of my favorites!)

https://www.orangepippintrees.com/pollinationchecker.aspx?v=1181

But it's kind of tricky because Arkansas Black requires two different pollinators that are mutually fertile, or that it's pollinator be self-fertile.

So I guess it depends on which crab you picked. But you'd probably be better off if you planted a third tree of the right variety.

The Doglo is supposed to be self-fertile, so it is a good pollinator for the Black, or so I read on several orchard sites