Challenge

[leedspointbrew]

So my neighbor, who over the past couple years has shown the poor judgment of not just drinking but (supposedly) enjoying the beers I brew, presented me with a challenge : sweet potato pineapple holiday ale. With marshmallow, if possible. I explained my limited equipment and skillset, but he persisted.
I was thinking of starting by roasting sweet potatoes and pineapple w brown sugar and ginger; no idea whatsoever how to incorporate marshmallow.
If anyone cares to offer input, I'm receptive.
TIA.

 

[mac_1103]

Marshmallows are just sugar, water, air and gelatin. They would probably melt in the boil kettle, but I doubt they'd add anything to the brew besides a couple of gravity points. You could also throw them into the roasting pan with the sweet potatoes and pineapple.

Anyway, good luck. It all sounds pretty yucky to me, so I would make your friend promise to drink the whole batch before I brewed it.

 

[Hoochin'Fool]

I've never used any of their stuff, but I remembered reading about a marshmalllow flavor extract!

https://www.olivenation.com/marshmallow-flavor-extract-ttb-pg-free-natural.html

Personally, I'd just keep a bag of mini-marshmallows handy, and toss a couple in at serving time, maybe brulee them a touch with a lighter?

 

[Jonakr]

So my neighbor, who over the past couple years has shown the poor judgment of not just drinking but (supposedly) enjoying the beers I brew, presented me with a challenge : sweet potato pineapple holiday ale. With marshmallow, if possible. I explained my limited equipment and skillet, but he persisted.
I was thinking of starting by roasting sweet potatoes and pineapple w brown sugar and ginger; no idea whatsoever how to incorporate marshmallow.
If anyone cares to offer input, I'm receptive.
TIA.

My experience is that you don't actually want to use the exact ingredients, but try to re-create the feel once it's done. That's much harder.

 

[Kickass]

Vanilla might be a good “marshmallow” alternative.

Sweet potato, I’d skip and add a bit of pumpkin spice, that’s typically the flavor that’s sought after.

Pineapple, is tough if you don’t use a flavor extract. If you’re kegging, you can stabilize with sorbate and k-meta then add a little pineapple juice concentrate to the keg.

Good luck. This sounds like many iterations away from a drinkable beer, let alone an enjoyable one but you might strike gold on your first shovel load.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

As someone who put marshmallows in the kettle at the end of the boil once, I would not do that again. Just a mess floating around trapping the heat in like blobs of insulation.
If I were to want marshmallow flavor without using extract flavoring, I’d make a vodka tincture of marshmallow and add at packaging. With that said, toasted marshmallows on the other stuff might just be fine.

 

[leedspointbrew]

Your input has been duly noted.
I'm thinking of eliminating the marshmallow altogether, reducing the pineapple to a bare minimum, concentrating on the roasted pumpkin, sweet potato, yam, whatever I choose / brown sugar-ginger aspect. That at least I think I can do, to get some of the flavors that I'm being challenged to incorporate and still have a drinkable beer. Because I'm not going to waste my time brewing a beer that I won't even attempt drinking.

 

[Snuffy]

The Pirate Strong Ale recipe from here is the closest thing I've seen to something like this. It's got an entire can of pineapple and cinnamon sticks in the boil. Then rum soaked oak and vanilla beans in the secondary. I've brewed it 3 times and increased the quantities of vanilla beans, oak and rum each time. The only flavor I can readily detect is the rum. Something about fermenting the sugar out of even a strong fruit just takes away its recognizable flavor. The whole is something totally unique, but the parts just meld.

If I were to take this as a challenge, I would brew a holiday type ale with spices and then dose to taste with flavor extracts like vanilla and cinnamon at packaging. Some milk sugar in the boil would give it residual sweetness. Maybe serve it in a hollowed out sweet potato. That's probably the only way you'll get that element recognized. Or just go with a spicy beer.

I'd also make this a small batch. 5 gals of novelty hooch is hard for me to struggle thru.

 

[wdavis2003]

Consider roasting all that and dumping it in the mash. Make sure to add rice hulls.

If you add it to the boil put it in a bad to make clean up easier.

And never take suggestions from that neighbor again

 

[AlexKay]

First: ew.

Second, I tried pineapple once, using concentrate added during fermentation, and neither the flavor nor the mouth-sharpness (pineapple only feels sour because of the proteases attacking your mouth) came through in the finished beer.

BRU-1 hits me as pineappley. It may well work better than actual pineapple.

 

[user 345769]

at first I was taken back at the whole idea of sweet potatoes but as i read some of it was interesting and with pumpkin spice along with it, it might work. I have brewed beer with pineapple and will again I never had any issues i put 2 whole pineapples in my primary and dry hopped in my secondary. I was very happy with the end results.
Adding marshmallows could work with a bit of prep and i would add vanilla bean in for sure.

 

[day_trippr]

fwiw, aside from adding a lot of acid character to a brew, pineapples contain bromelain, a protease enzyme that can break down proteins and thus negatively affect head formation. Pasteurized pineapple juice denatures the bromelain, and one can pasteurize pineapple juice or blended slurry at home by bringing it to 140°F and holding it for 30 minutes...

Cheers!

 

[mac_1103]

a protease enzyme that can break down dextrins

?

 

[day_trippr]

Ooops - I was thinking "proteins" then wrote "dextrins" - dextrins also play a part in head formation/retention.
Fixed...

Cheers!

 

[wdavis2003]

bromelain, a protease enzyme that can break down proteins

Pineapple can dang near disintegrate a steak if left long enough.

 

[kev211]

I know OP said he was gonna ditch the mallow, but (just my opinion so dont shoot me) pineapple and sweet taters seem like an odd combo. If it were me, id ditch the pinas and keep the mallow and sweet potato. That said, if you want to keep them, you do you, and let us know how it turns out .

Back on to topic... To get the mallow flavor, any thoughts on making this a braggot kinda setup? Or a "honey holiday ale"? You could add meadowfoam honey to the fermenter just after high krausen to avoid fermenting off the flavors from the honey and give you a boost in abv. Best way to describe meadowfoam for those unfamiliar is... picture eating a spoonful of honey, but only after the honey was dipped in a bowl of mini mallows.

 

[Hoppy2bmerry]

Your input has been duly noted.
I'm thinking of eliminating the marshmallow altogether, reducing the pineapple to a bare minimum, concentrating on the roasted pumpkin, sweet potato, yam, whatever I choose / brown sugar-ginger aspect. That at least I think I can do, to get some of the flavors that I'm being challenged to incorporate and still have a drinkable beer. Because I'm not going to waste my time brewing a beer that I won't even attempt drinking.

There was a 1970s recipe for a holiday sweet potato dish (to liven up the old standard) that had pineapple and orange juice, so perhaps orange peel or zest would help tie it together. Just a thought.

 

[user 345769]

Pineapple can dang near disintegrate a steak if left long enough.

oh my dose it ever, papaya is the worst for protein loving enzymes Take the toughest cut of meat and wow, it won't be tough no longer lol My husband learned that the hard way literally disintegrated a chuck roast.

 

[leedspointbrew]

I know OP said he was gonna ditch the mallow, but (just my opinion so dont shoot me) pineapple and sweet taters seem like an odd combo. If it were me, id ditch the pinas and keep the mallow and sweet potato. That said, if you want to keep them, you do you, and let us know how it turns out .

Back on to topic... To get the mallow flavor, any thoughts on making this a braggot kinda setup? Or a "honey holiday ale"? You could add meadowfoam honey to the fermenter just after high krausen to avoid fermenting off the flavors from the honey and give you a boost in abv. Best way to describe meadowfoam for those unfamiliar is... picture eating a spoonful of honey, but only after the honey was dipped in a bowl of mini mallows.

I was actually thinking of mostly ditching both pineapple and mallow, and going w pumpkin - yam / brown sugar/ ginger. Maybe I'll dose a couple bottles w pineapple extract for my neighbor; incorporating pineapple seems like it would be way beyond my limited skillset.

 

[kev211]

I was actually thinking of mostly ditching both pineapple and mallow, and going w pumpkin - yam / brown sugar/ ginger. Maybe I'll dose a couple bottles w pineapple extract for my neighbor; incorporating pineapple seems like it would be way beyond my limited skillset.

Just make it with the sweet taters and toss a pineapple wedge and umbrella on the rim. A little aloha with your holiday beer. Meme kalikimaka if you will…

 

[pvtpublic]

@leedspointbrew Do you all grain or extract brew? I'm going to take this challenge on with you at my brewery. This sounds fun. I've worked with all of these ingredients, and I'll work up an all grain recipe. I'm pretty busy right now, but I'll post a recipe by the end of the weekend.

Pineapple can dang near disintegrate a steak if left long enough.

It's an enzyme, so it will denature with the right temperature.

 

[leedspointbrew]

@leedspointbrew Do you all grain or extract brew? I'm going to take this challenge on with you at my brewery. This sounds fun. I've worked with all of these ingredients, and I'll work up an all grain recipe. I'm pretty busy right now, but I'll post a recipe by the end of the weekend.


It's an enzyme, so it will denature with the right temperature.

I brew all grain BIAG. I'll certainly keep an eye out for your recipe!

 

[Northern_Brewer]

My experience is that you don't actually want to use the exact ingredients, but try to re-create the feel once it's done. That's much harder.

Yeah, this. There's a reason most of these things aren't normally used in beer, because they're a nightmare. So trying to recreate the feel with more normal ingredients should make life easier and ultimately be more satisfying.

Fortunately pineapple is relatively easy to recreate, with hops like Bru-1 and Sultana (fka Denali). A yeast like WLP644 and its clones will also contribute.

Starchy flavours are kinda difficult due to the nature of beer. A bit of pumpkin spice is probably not a bad shout, but some dextrin/chit to built up the body, maybe some amber or something. But you can add pureed sweet potato, look to pumpkin recipes for inspiration but bear in mind it's a stronger flavour than pumpkin and some rice/oat hulls are a good idea to help the consistency of the mash. You probably don't want a pale beer or a stout, but somewhere in between.

I'd tend to the idea of using some vanilla as a nod to the marshmallows. A more "beery" approach would be to use the fact that charring oak barrels forms vanillin (as found in oak-aged chardonnay) and supposedly Hungarian oak has the most vanillin precursors, so maybe a few cubes of medium-toast Hungarian oak for a few days in or after the later stages of fermentation?

I really don't like lactose in beers and wouldn't add it if I was doing this, but these kind of novelty beers are one place where it can belong.

 

[AlexKay]

Fortunately pineapple is relatively easy to recreate, with hops like Bru-1 and Sultana (fka Denali). A yeast like WLP644 and its clones will also contribute.

And Harlequin! I get pineapple from Harlequin, and it plays well with BRU-1

 

[leedspointbrew]

If anyone is interested, my neighbor lost interest so I brewed something more typical. Zero pineapple anywhere, some spices at flameout, some vanilla beans in a bourbon tincture that I'm going to add at bottling.