Cannonballing advice - brew another batch on bottling day

[ILMSTMF]

Hey!

4 weeks in primary coming up next weekend. Thinking of brewing another batch same day because I'm cheap and want to recycle the cleaning products.

6.5 gallon primary is holding IPA. Will clean 6.5 gallon bottling bucket with PBW, will sanitize it with Starsan then rack from primary. I have a spare 6 gallon Better Bottle carboy. Questions:

• Can the PBW solution from bottling bucket be reused? Dump it into spare carboy perhaps?
• If yes, then Starsan the bottling bucket. (Where to dump the PBW solution from carboy at this point?) Rack from primary into bottling bucket.
• Dump the PBW into the primary, clean it good. The Starsan is now gone, had nowhere to put it from the bottling bucket.

Here's where my plan turns to... trub. Can't wrap my head around how to reuse the cleaning/sanitizing products. Ultimately, not sure if it's going to be worth the trouble of my attempt to be "efficient". Any advice? Thanks!

 

[bobeer]

I have a spray bottle that I put some leftover starsan into if it's good enough to reuse. I use blowoff tubes 100% of the time so I just put the leftover starsan into my blowoff bucket.

 

[ILMSTMF]

bobeer, thanks for your tips! Yes, I also keep a small spray bottle that I fill after each sanitizing session.

Using a blow off for the first time on this batch, actually. Side note - there is absolutely no crud in the hose! Anyway, it's fed into a large glass full of Starsan solution. I can't possibly fit a whole bucket next to the primary as I keep it stored in a mini fridge/fermentation chamber. Otherwise, yeah, pretty neat idea to keep your Starsan solution in a full bucket for blowoff/reuse.

Kinda figured I'd need another bucket to dump the solution(s) into...

 

[beergolf]

I bottle on brew day all the time. I mix up a bucket of starsan and use it for both the bottling equipment and bottles but the brew stuff too.

I mix up my priming sugar put it on to boil. Fill a pot with water for my mash. Once the sugar boils I let it cool slightly. Add to bottling bucket and rack the brew into the bottling bucket. By them my strike water is heated up and I start the mash. During the mash I bottle the beer from the bottling bucket. Since my bottles are clean all I have to do is squirt some starsan in them and bottle. I bottle over the dishwasher door so I can sanitize 12 bottles at a time and stick them in the dishwasher to drain. Bottle, repeat until batch is all done. So it is easily doable.

If you can just pick up another bucket for cleaning solutions and you can use them for the whole day.

 

[ILMSTMF]

Thanks for your tips, beergolf.

Shouldn't matter but I am extract brewing, FYI.

• I must first acquire a utility bucket for storing the cleaning product(s) in between main equipment use. Should this be specialized bucket suitable for brewing equipment or can I just get a cheap one from Home Depot?
• Can the function of this bucket be replaced by my spare carboy?
• Glad you mentioned the bottle sanitizing procedure. Normally I'd run the entire batch of bottles in the dishwasher on hottest setting without detergent or rinse aid the night prior. I can use my spray bottle of Starsan to hit the bottles just prior to bottling as you suggested. Do you feel the spray bottle method is more efficient?

Thanks!

 

[beergolf]

I can use my spray bottle of Starsan to hit the bottles just prior to bottling as you suggested. Do you feel the spray bottle method is more efficient?

Thanks!

I just use a turkey baster. I squirt the starsan in, put my thumb over the top, give a slight shake and drain back into the bowl of starsan. Fast and easy.

 

[MagicMatt]

The Starsan is now gone, had nowhere to put it from the bottling bucket.

I think you're going about the cleaning/sanitizing all wrong. You shouldn't be "filling up" your bottling bucket with either PBW or Starsan. The bucket should be relatively clean already, yes? All you'll need is a quart or two of PBW solution max - the bucket needn't be full at all. Think about it - you don't fill up a normal drink cup with dish soap so you can wash it, do you? All you need is a little liquid and a scrubber to wash it down. You can save this if you want, but we're talking like 1/8oz of PBW for 1/4 gallon of water.

Similarly, with Starsan you shouldn't be filling your bottling bucket either. You said you have a spray bottle - that's all you should be using. Spray the inside of your bucket down really good, which should only require about 3 oz of Starsan solution max.

 

[adamdillabo]

I have a spare bottling bucket I make star san in. 1.25 gallons of starsan solution for brew day. I make 2.5 gallons for bottling day.

You can save star san as long as the PH stays at the right amount. I dump my after a week or so depending on use and if it gets dust in it. Or how important what I'm about to do is. If I'm about to transfer wort but I know my starter isn't ready. So I won't pitch for 24 hours. Everything gets fresh starsan and a good soak.

For cleaning I use oxyclean free. It's much cheaper then the no rinse at my LHBS. You have to wash it off though. I just use what I need for most things but I keep a large container for my rinsed bottles with a few inches in it. Labels fall right off.

 

[ILMSTMF]

I think you're going about the cleaning/sanitizing all wrong. You shouldn't be "filling up" your bottling bucket with either PBW or Starsan. The bucket should be relatively clean already, yes? All you'll need is a quart or two of PBW solution max - the bucket needn't be full at all. Think about it - you don't fill up a normal drink cup with dish soap so you can wash it, do you? All you need is a little liquid and a scrubber to wash it down. You can save this if you want, but we're talking like 1/8oz of PBW for 1/4 gallon of water.

Similarly, with Starsan you shouldn't be filling your bottling bucket either. You said you have a spray bottle - that's all you should be using. Spray the inside of your bucket down really good, which should only require about 3 oz of Starsan solution max.

Ha! Never really thought of it like this...
So here's the new plan. The bottling bucket is relatively clean by looking at it. But I don't trust that, gotta hit that with a small solution of PBW and use a soft sponge to scrub from top to bottom. Dump it, rinse it, make a small Starsan solution in the bucket and scrub the same way I just did. I don't trust my spray bottle for this which has month old Starsan solution in it. I've never tested PH, not sure where to get the right test strips locally anyway. Now rack to bottling bucket and bottle the beer.
However, I'll still need to do a comprehensive cleaning on the primary after racking to bottling bucket. This gets done regardless because (duh) I'm not storing the pail dirty. It gets hose blasted to get all the solid matter out. Then a 5 gallon PBW soak, dump that into bottling bucket, rinse out the primary and fill again with Starsan solution in prep for brew that's about to happen. Brew new batch! Dump the Starsan into the bottling bucket because, why not, then finish brew day as usual. I've now (sorta) made use of the 5 gallon PBW mix that would've been dumped at end of bottling day anyway. Caveat - based on MagicMatt's advice, maybe I don't need to do a full 5 gallon mix of PBW in the primary at end of bottling day...hmmmm...

Also, as soon as I finish this PBW, I'm switching over to Oxy free. Not the first time I've seen that product recommended. Thanks all!

 

[MagicMatt]

Caveat - based on MagicMatt's advice, maybe I don't need to do a full 5 gallon mix of PBW in the primary at end of bottling day...hmmmm...

That's really depends on 3 things: what type of primary (bucket or carboy), how dirty it is, and how you clean it.

If it's a carboy and you have no device to really scrub the inside, you'll likely find it's best to indeed fill it up to the brim with a warm PBW solution. Let it sit for anywhere from 30 minutes to 24 hours (I've let it go 3 days from being lazy without issues).

Personally, unless it's really dirty, I just use about 4" of PBW solution and use a carboy cleaner (the kind that goes into a handheld drill and has the green cloth pads on the end). It gets a good scrubbing with that, then I rinse completely with water.

And if it's a bucket, obviously you only need a gallon or less to clean it with a scrubber.

Also, you still shouldn't have to completely fill your primary with Starsan. It only needs to contact a surface for ~1 minute to be effective. Just add like a gallon's worth and give it a really good shake, ensuring the whole inner surface is wet and/or foamy. You must go through that stuff like crazy if you're making it in 5 gallon batches and just dumping it after using!

 

[ILMSTMF]

That's really depends on 3 things: what type of primary (bucket or carboy), how dirty it is, and how you clean it.

If it's a carboy and you have no device to really scrub the inside, you'll likely find it's best to indeed fill it up to the brim with a warm PBW solution. Let it sit for anywhere from 30 minutes to 24 hours (I've let it go 3 days from being lazy without issues).

Personally, unless it's really dirty, I just use about 4" of PBW solution and use a carboy cleaner (the kind that goes into a handheld drill and has the green cloth pads on the end). It gets a good scrubbing with that, then I rinse completely with water.

And if it's a bucket, obviously you only need a gallon or less to clean it with a scrubber.

Also, you still shouldn't have to completely fill your primary with Starsan. It only needs to contact a surface for ~1 minute to be effective. Just add like a gallon's worth and give it a really good shake, ensuring the whole inner surface is wet and/or foamy. You must go through that stuff like crazy if you're making it in 5 gallon batches and just dumping it after using!

First, thanks to all for their advice. It doesn't look like I'll be able to brew on bottling day due to time constraints. However, I'm going to try this for the next bottling day.

Primary is a plastic bucket, I expect it to be pretty dirty based on past experience, and I would usually do a full bucket volume of PBW to clean it after hosing out all the solid matter. But glad to know that I can likely get away with doing just a gallon of PBW in there plus scrubbing with soft sponge after the hose-out step.

On brew day, I'll do a full volume solution of Starsan in the bucket after letting utilities soak in a full volume of PBW during the boil. I actually go through PBW a lot quicker than the Starsan. That's where I'm trying to save some money. But F it, I'm changing over to Oxy free once I finish this PBW.
Meanwhile, I like that idea for sanitizing the primary. I'll just make a gallon Starsan, cap the bucket, and shake it well. Cool!
In the way of saving the Starsan in a spray bottle, I need to invest in test strips but having a challenge figuring out which ones to purchase. Will continue the research though, thanks!

 

[2ellas]

I did this Sunday and it was a bit more work than I expected. I think it can be done quickly and efficiently but I sure as hell didn't do it quickly or efficiently. The good news is that I've got something bubbling away and something conditioning. Working on my pipeline!

 

[modelafish]

I keep my cleaning and sanitizing solutions in plastic storage containers with lids. I can use them several times this way, as no contamination or evaporation. I think they're about 20 gal,(but I use 5 gal solution) and they have some for 6 bucks at wally world. They're long enough to lay the buckets lengthways, and I just turn them every few minutes to get good coverage.