Buying grain mill vs buying crushed grains

[IslandLizard]

I'd say owning a mill is justifiable if you don't have a decent shop nearby to buy ingredients per batch, or if the only one in town refuses to mill properly.

That's the general problem with buying pre-milled grain. Order any grain (or kit) from MoreBeer or Northern Brewer and the crush is total crap!

One of my 2 Local HBS' has been milling way too coarsely for the past 13 years I've been shopping there, and won't change it, and I know everyone there personally. A nice couple new to brewing had brewed a wheat beer that was milled on the store's mill. Any wheat flavor/character was nowhere to be found. The beer was thin, weak, bodiless. When we looked at the crush for their repeat effort, most of the wheat malt was still whole. Nuff' sed!

The other LHBS mills for you... and is not much better, especially when brewing BIAB, which I'd say over 3/4 of their customers do.

I buy base malt by the sack, and love milling my own for having total control. Small kernel grain gets milled separately on its own, tighter gap.
So yeah, the mill gets reset (at least) once each milling (brew) session. It stays on that gap for the next brew, where it mills the grain appropriate for that gap, then reset for the other.

 

[RyPA]

I mainly want it so I can order my grains further ahead of time and then brew when ready, versus buying pre-milled, ordered at the last minute for the sake of freshness. I am not experienced enough to know variations between mill level/quality, but that's something I can at least be mindful of and now control. It will also add another element to the brewing process/hobby, so why not. I don't foresee myself ever not being a beer drinker, and I enjoy brewing, so the mill will not go to waste.

As I mentioned in a previous post, I am the only beer drinker in my house, which is good and bad. I scored 2 corny kegs and a glass carboy at a garage sale years ago for $20, so I've been set on 5 gallon batches. I am considering doing smaller batches as I find myself wanting something else, while my keg is still half full. I guess I could do 2 gallon batches in my 5-10 gallon equipment, but then I think to myself, all of the work involved with brewing, why not do a full 5 gallon batch, especially if the batch comes out great. My current batch I kegged October 16, and I think I still have 1/4 keg left. To you sole household drinkers, do you do 5 gallon batches, and how long do they last?

 

[IslandLizard]

The other, cheaper option is buying a Corona style mill. Knockoffs can be found for $25 or less, shipped.
They need some tweaking to get the right "crush," but for BIAB they work very fine. Fine in both ways.

 

[RyPA]

I tend to splurge on stuff to avoid buyers remorse. $100 doesn't seem bad, and it looks like its plenty for me as it can rest on a 5 gallon bucket and can be spun with a drill.

 

[Transamguy77]

@RyPA you could brew a 5 gallon batch and split it in half and either add a different steeping grain, different dry hops or a different yeast then your still making 5 gallons but ends up as 2 different beers. I make 10 gallons at a time and I will do that occasionally, take a lightly hopped blond and turn half into a stout.

 

[MaxStout]

A big advantage for me in owning a mill is the freshness factor. I can mill right before I brew, so that the grain has little time to oxidize and go stale. If you buy whole grains and store them in airtight containers in a cool place, they will last a long time, maybe a year or so. You can stock up enough grains for a few upcoming brews.

Without a mill you could buy crushed grain on a just-in-time basis. Order only the ingredients you need right away and brew soon after they come in. But the time from the brew store milling them--the packaging and shipping--could still be a week or more. And there's no control over the conditions while in transit.

Buying crushed malt from the brew store means you have no control over crush. And if you brew with grains like rye or wheat, that standard mill gap set at the brew store may not crush those smaller grains very well.

 

[RyPA]

I'm sold. Where can I find the manual on good crush settings for each grain type?

 

[MaxStout]

There's no "manual." It's more trial and error to get the crush that provides best efficiency. Ballpark, I'd say around .030 to .035 for barley; tighter for small grains like wheat and rye, perhaps .025 or so. What works best can be dependent on the mill rollers--the depth of the knurling on those. Get a feeler gauge from the auto parts store to measure the gap.

 

[RyPA]

That's what I meant, just the general guidelines, I'll need to do some research

 

[RufusBrewer]

With all that's been said it sounds like I may not absolutely need a mill, but having one wouldn't hurt. Being it's not breaking the bank, and I have curiosity, I will likely pick up the cereal killer.

I guess I am conditioned to think of home brewers are (on the whole) a frugal bunch. I include myself a member of the penny pincher club.

if the money is not an issue, than go for it.

 

[KyBeer]

I have trouble finding that sweet spot between too small and best conversion. Glad I keep rice hulls on hand when it looks a bit too fine.

 

[RyPA]

That's another thing I need to look into...I assume rice hulls are used when your grains are milled too small?

 

[KyBeer]

Any time you feel the mash bed might result in a stuck mash. It add nothing to the flavor and is cheap insurance. I always add a hand full when I use wheat or sticky grains.

 

[Bramling Cross]

The idea of brewing without a mill is insane to me.

Getting the best price on an ideal crush for your base malts far exceeds any wastage on specialty malts. Besides, after you've been brewing for a while, you start writing your own recipes and ignore the specialty malts that you don't like--I'm looking at you Special B.

 

[Gozie Boy]

If you are brewing frequently, and/or with 10-12+ gal batches, a mill can be worthwhile. Find the setting which works best for your system, and don't change it unless you have to (e.g. wheat), as that is something of a pita (at least for my mill). Consider conditioning your grain for milling and use a handful of rice hulls in the mash, and you can then reduce the grain size to increase efficiency while managing the risk of getting stuck.

And there is just something satisfying about performing more of the overall brewing process.

 

[RyPA]

Is it bad to mill too small and always use rice hulls to avoid the stuck mash? It seems like you can always get a good efficiency without worrying about your mill setting.

 

[Bramling Cross]

Is it bad to mill too small and always use rice hulls to avoid the stuck mash? It seems like you can always get a good efficiency without worrying about your mill setting.

Eventually you learn your system and "too small" stops being an issue. I know my system and I know how to mill my malt without thinking about it. That said, I do toss in some rice hulls whenever I use flaked wheat or a lot of oats.

 

[RyPA]

Does 'your system' correspond to the bazooka tube/false bottom in your mash tun?

 

[Bramling Cross]

Does 'your system' correspond to the bazooka tube/false bottom in your mash tun?

Yeah, it's whatever LT or MLT you run. Eventually you learn it.

 

[Transamguy77]

Does 'your system' correspond to the bazooka tube/false bottom in your mash tun?

After some brews you’ll start to figure out your system, even if it’s the same system as other people it’s going to be slightly different than others. On my system I have figured out my water volumes and strike temp and other things that now I just know what I need to do, and I have never used rice hulls I don’t know why I do a fair amount of rice beers and beers with wheat but have never needed them and other people can’t get away without using them.

 

[RyPA]

Seems kind of odd being I'm sure plenty have the identical setup (same HD cooler for example, possibly same bazooka/false bottom). Maybe some choose rice hulls as an insurance policy, where others have brewed enough times where they have more confidence in not needing the hulls.

 

[Transamguy77]

@RyPA im sure that’s the case and I don’t know what their reasons are I just know that after you get some brewing done you’ll figure it out.

 

[Gozie Boy]

Seems kind of odd being I'm sure plenty have the identical setup (same HD cooler for example, possibly same bazooka/false bottom). Maybe some choose rice hulls as an insurance policy, where others have brewed enough times where they have more confidence in not needing the hulls.

I've brewed many batches at 0.045" without rice hulls and never had a problem (I use a Spike 20 gal MT with false bottom; I also continuously recirculate and fly sparge). I then reduced my crush slightly (to about 0.04) and had a couple of close calls - whew! Then I went to grain conditioning and using rice hulls and was able to reduce my crush to 0.032", and have never had a problem. Rice hulls are cheap, do not alter the flavor, and provide ample insurance/peace of mind. So it's a no brainer for me, as I never want to deal with a stuck mash or sparge.

 

[BrewZer]

I tend to splurge on stuff to avoid buyers remorse. $100 doesn't seem bad, and it looks like its plenty for me as it can rest on a 5 gallon bucket and can be spun with a drill.

That metal base is a real enhancement.

Meanwhile, brewing in a bag* means never having to say "stuck runoff."

*with the right mesh size

 

[govner1]

Adds half an hour, for me, at most. And it's a hobby, so there's no hourly wage accounting going on in my books.

How much grain are you milking that takes half an hour?
I just did a batch with about 20 lbs of grain in ten minutes or so. My mill runs at about 150 RPM.

 

[Soulshine2]

With all that's been said it sounds like I may not absolutely need a mill, but having one wouldn't hurt. Being it's not breaking the bank, and I have curiosity, I will likely pick up the cereal killer.

Just keep in mind whichever one you do buy, if it has a hand crank on it, you can choose to not go hand crank and attach a drill to it to power it. some guys build a dedicated motor on theirs. i already own a few Lithium battery power drill drivers and they work just fine. my milling of 13 pounds takes maybe 3 minutes at most. Not sure how anyone is taking 30 minutes to mill doing a home sized batch.

 

[KyBeer]

Each of my brew systems have been different in the way they worked and the effency of the mash. My electric system uses a 10 gallon round cooler with a false bottom. My strike water volume is added to the MT and recirculated through a HERMS coil in the HLT. When trying to achive maximum effency I mill my grains to about .035 - .038. I add two hands full of rice hulls to the mash then the grains. I let the grains rest for about 10 minutes then a continous sparge for about 45 minutes. Drain the MT and Sparge with a slightly lower PH water at about 165 degrees.
Long story short, I could never reach effency in the low 90 percent range without a fine mill and rice hulls.

 

[Steveruch]

Milled grains kept in an airtight container last quite a while. My current batch was BIAB with grains that sat in a closed bag inside a plastic tub for over three months and smelled and tasted just as fresh as when I first received them. While I wouldn't hold on to milled grains for over a year, a few months shouldn't be an issue.

 

[NewJersey]

I bought a grain mill just because I wanted to mill my own grain. I wanted a finer crush than my lhbs was willing to do. I could have just added 1/2 lbs of grain from them but I wanted to do just to do it tbh.
This hobby, like every hobby, allows you to control your involvement. I don't plan to ever malt my own grain, but who knows lol

 

[BrewZer]

How much grain are you milking that takes half an hour?
I just did a batch with about 20 lbs of grain in ten minutes or so. My mill runs at about 150 RPM.

Most of that time is the weighing, since I use the scoop that came with my Vittles Vault to parcel it out and my scale only has a 4x4 inch platform.

And it's "at most" -- so far, that's about the longest it has taken, and that includes dragging out the scale, the pot I dump the weighed grain in, hooking up the drill to the mill, blowing residue off the mill, etc.