Burned a batch...

[RVAgaffer]

So I was making a batch today and managed to burn the crap out of the wort when i started the boil. I think I milled my grains a touch to fine so I got a lot of sediment when i mashed out. Not positive though if it was my milling or that I used a paint mixer on my drill to dough in and during the batch sparges

I have been doing split boils lately (and finally just got a larger second pot so I don't have to add any water to the fermentor, leading to better efficiency I managed 86% today even with burning the wort). When i was taking my last batch sparge I started the boil on the main pot and in less than 10 mins the bottom of the pot was warped and I really burned it.

I ended up pouring off the pot of wort and scrubbed the pot clean and then poured the wort back over. At first it had a bit of a burnt smell but it seemed to go away as I boiled, luckily it was an oatmeal brown ale that I had used some darker malts, a lot of caramel producing malts, and d45 candi syrup so i ~think~ it may be ok.

So has anyone tried a diffuser on a flat top electric stove? I figured if I asked this in the GF section other people would understand the struggle of the sediment more than traditional brewers who would probably give the answer "you failed at mashing".

On the flip side I think I am learning this gf brewing thing and have been trying a lot. I have an Oatmeal/Chocolate/Vanilla Stout (i think there it will also be a cream stout as I am considering adding lactose before bottling since it seems a little too dark/bitter) that I am very excited about. I also have an Oatmeal Ale that is showing promise, not amazing but not too bad for my second all grain.

 

[BrewSRQ]

As an previous apartment brewer, I am surprised you scorched wort on a stove top! Mine used to take about 30-40 mins to get 4 gallons to a boil. Are you BIAB? I still am and have never had an issue, even with a jet burner that I borrowed for a bit, but I suppose a super fine milling could cause an issue.

 

[glutarded-chris]

I have had some scorching on a mash when i failed to stir enough while heating and i scorched pretty badly one time on an extract batch when i put a plate on the bottom of the kettle to keep the steeping grain bag off the bottom. Other than that i cant remember ever scorching on the boil and i often get a lot of sediment.

Did you add any syrup while heating? I either kill the heat until everything is dissolved or separate a few quarts and dissolve the syrup before returning to the boil.

How fine is the mesh on your bag? When i went looking for a bag i could not find one on the normal brewing supply sites that was large and fine. I went to a fabric store and got voile cloth (curtain material) and made three for just a few $.

 

[RVAgaffer]

I am not using BIAB. I heat my mash in a pot and do my 125* rest then get it up to temp before pouring off into a cooler lined with a bag. The bag I am using is pretty fine.

I also usually take a very long time for the batch to heat up on the stove so I am not sure what happened here. I did notice what looked like lumps of protein had formed when i was transferring the wort around trying to fix the batch.

I had not added any syrups yet at this point.

I will have to look at the voile material. How do you make sure the bag is clean enough when you are done if it really isn't mesh like to rinse through.

I really think it must be the combo of fine milling and the power mixer (as I don't think i milled much finer than my last batches if at all, but the batch was very cloudy even with whirl flock). I did have some issues draining off the batch sparges a little bit but I am not sure if I was being impatient or if it was really giving me more problems.

 

[glutarded-chris]

When I was looking for a bag, the homebrew supply places didn't carry large size bags in fine mesh. The fine mesh bags they carried were small and usually used for hops and stuff like that. The medium mesh bags are not fine enough in my opinion. I read up on it and everyone seemed to use voile material as it has a fine mesh and you don't have to pay the high price for a custom bag. It is made of polyester, I think. In any case it is not cotton and it cleans up nicely. I just spray it with the hose to get the loose material out of it, soak it in PBW for 15 or 20 minutes and then rinse it out in clean water. I just used a long thin piece, folded it in half and stitched the sides. That way there is no seam on the bottom where the weight of the grain is supported.

I also use the bag in a cooler for the mash. If I read your explanation correctly, you had the scorching issue after you separated the wart from the grain and were heating to boil. The extra material on the bottom must have been thick and dense enough that it did not circulate as it heated like usually happens.

 

[RVAgaffer]

Yeah thats exactly what I did and I think that is exactly what happened with the wort. The bottom of the pot was so overheated that the 5 gallon pot was rocking on a bulging bottom...

I will have to look at making some bags. I guess it's a good excuse to take a trip home to visit the parents and borrow my moms sewing machine.

I guess the finer voile material would help a lot with some of the stuff I end up getting out of my mashes. Do you have any issue with it clogging up like some of the fine mesh bags can? I have been cheating and use the fine mesh bags to filter the last bit of my mashes to get more usable wort but find they can clog up easily.

I use a cooler for my mash but since it is a cheap coleman cooler I am using the stock spigot system and just use a small strainer with the handle snaped off to keep the bag off of the spigot port. I have a 10 gallon igloo converted cooler w/ false bottom on my wish list but thats a few months out at least. Seeing as I can manage up to in the 1.060+ range with a 5 gallon cooler i figure a 10 gallon cooler could let me mash in with out having to apply heat to a kettle with grain in it and allow a larger grain bill for when I really want to do some crazy high gravity stuff (cause lets be honest, whats the fun in low alcohol brews).

 

[glutarded-chris]

I made a proper mash tun with a manifold and after a few stuck sparges i abandoned for the bag. Perhaps i gave up on it too soon as others seem to have no trouble with similar grain bills. In any case, i just pull the bag up and let it gravity drain. Most of the wart drains in 5 minutes. For a 16 pound grain bill i use two coolers and two bags so that each bag is a reasonable weight.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1458523144.983918.jpg

 

[RVAgaffer]

Ah interesting, yeah my Coleman is the 5 gal drink dispenser. I was expecting to use a mash tun with the false bottom and the bag, I've been having good luck as long as I keep pulling the bag up off the bottom of the cooler to allow space for it to drain into. I suspect a false bottom and ball valve spigot would allow me to drain easier and not have to try and hold a bag while trying to hold the stock spigot open.

What kettle so you have? I have been looking for a better kettle but some of them are just out side of my range

 

[jtratcliff]

The bags that @wilserbrewer makes are very fine. And he custom makes them to your kettle size. Reasonably priced too.

His combo with BIAB bag, hop sock, pulley is a pretty good deal too.

 

[glutarded-chris]

Not a bad thing to buy a mash bag that meets your needs and someone else sews it etc. With 8 pounds per bag I don't need handles etc. so the home made one is easy and works well. With a single bag for 14+ pounds of grain, pulleys etc. you are going to want handles. The first bag I made had handles and it was a lot of effort. The voile is pretty hard to sew because it slips around so much.

I sort of went all out on my brew kettle. I got it from brewers hardware with tri-clamp fittings. I was tired of lifting 4 gallons of wart for transfers and wanted to do all grain and larger batches. I wanted to be able to do 10 gallon full boils and therefore needed a drain valve. I think it was a good investment.

I have a less expensive 10 gallon kettle that I may eventually convert into a mash tun with false bottom etc. I think it is a good idea to line with a vole bag anyway to be able to recover from a stuck sparge. I have seen that others do that. For now, with 16 lb grain bill my two cooler system works ok. If I ever want to go larger I will have to take the plunge to a proper mash tun.

 

[RVAgaffer]

I will have to look into wilserbrewer's stuff (i could make them but that pricing isn't bad and I won't be visiting the parents for a few months so no access to a sewing machine until then).

I will have to get a nicer kettle before the year is out. I really would like one that has heating elements in it since I can't use gas burners (apartment living and plan to be here a while) and am working with a flat top stove. I guess once I upgrade I will have to also invest is a wort chiller (currently just putting the kettles into ice baths). I can at least swing all grain batches at decent gravities but it would be nice to do it as one boil and then just hook a line up and drain right into the fermenter instead of syphoning and trying to strain out sediment.

 

[glutarded-chris]

I have considered going electric so that i could brew inside in the AC during Florida summers. You have to have high amp 220 to get enough power to boil quickly. Still might do it some day. Wart chiller is easy. You can buy one or make one with 50 foot of copper tubing and some fittings.

 

[RVAgaffer]

Yeah the 220 isn't really an option for me in my current situation... but if I buy my condo like I plan I could get one put in if I remodel the kitchen (the layout is the dumbest layout you could have put in the space and I could triple my usable counter space and cabinets with a small change). I would even consider just using electric elements in combination with my stove.

I was considering making a wort chiller... but i also just don't want one more thing to have to clean when I am done brewing right now hahaha.

Once I have a bigger kettle and mash cooler I will probably do it. I figure with the 10 gallon cooler I can get 20+lbs of grains in the cooler and just keep batch sparring extra times for a big and small beer in one day... and then I would need to save all the time I can.

Also I think I finally figured out my bitterness I was having in some of my other batches... the gypsum I was adding to my mash and sparge water. A few more batches will confirm or deny this but I think that was a major part of it.