Bulk aged beer -> Bottle condition time

[anbowden]

I know the purpose of bottle conditioning is two fold: 1) To carbonate the beer, and 2) To allow the flavors to develop and mature.

If a beer has been bulk aged in a secondary fermenter for months, how much more flavor development happens during bottle conditioning?

As you might suspect, I'm asking because I'm impatiently waiting to drink my first bulk-aged beer(an extract Weizenbock), and it's almost carbed at 1.5 weeks in the bottled(feeling a plastic bottle).
Note: I have ready Revvy's blog on bottling and patience.
Note 2: I did search on the forum and couldn't find an answer to this exact question.

Thanks,
Andy

 

[KepowOb]

I'm a bit interested in what others have to say about this... but if you're really feeling impatient, you can always put a few of them in the fridge for 2 days and try them out.

Wait a week and repeat. Then wait another week and repeat again. Take some notes if you'd like, and you'll get first hand experience on how bottle aging changes the profile of your beer .

 

[Yooper]

Once a beer is at its peak, aging it longer just makes it older.

Now, when is it at its peak? That really depends from beer to beer. As two extremes, an IPA might be at its peak by week 3 after brewday, while an oaked barleywine might be at its peak by year 3! But for most beers, long aging isn't necessary nor recommended.

If the beer tastes great once it's carbed up, with a smoothness that works- it's ready! If it still hasn't "melded" together, and you can taste a separateness of the flavors, then it's not quite there. That's hard to explain, but as an example I have an oatmeal stout that needs about 2 weeks after packaging to be really ready. How I determined that was by the "separateness" of the flavors before then- it's a bit roasty, followed by smoothness, with a hint of caramel after that. Two weeks later, it's all there in the finish at the same time.

Sort of like when you make stew. The first day, you taste meat and carrots and potatoes. But the next day, when you have the lefteovers, you taste "stew". It's the same with beer, if that helps explain what I mean better!

 

[anbowden]

I'm a bit interested in what others have to say about this... but if you're really feeling impatient, you can always put a few of them in the fridge for 2 days and try them out.

Wait a week and repeat. Then wait another week and repeat again. Take some notes if you'd like, and you'll get first hand experience on how bottle aging changes the profile of your beer .

Yeah, I do this with all my beers starting at about 3 weeks in the bottle. This is my first bulk aged beer. I believe I'll do the same this time, but I may start a little earlier(as soon as I feel it's carbed).
Thanks for the input too, Yooper. I've read different opinions on aging a Weizenbock.

Andy

 

[woozy]

I know the purpose of bottle conditioning is two fold: 1) To carbonate the beer, and 2) To allow the flavors to develop and mature.

If a beer has been bulk aged in a secondary fermenter for months, how much more flavor development happens during bottle conditioning?

None.

you've answered your own question. If it's been bulk aged for months... then it's been bulk aged for months. That means the flavors have already developed and matured.

(Nitpick: If it were *me* wording the statement, I'd state that "bottle conditioning" and "bottle carbonation" are two completely different concepts that, coincidentally, both occur in bottles during roughly the same time frame.)

(Thus I'd word it as "The purpose of leaving the beer in bottles before drinking are twofold 1) to allow the beer time to carbonate 2) to allow the beer time to condition and age. So if I have a beer that has conditioned and aged, how much time must I leave it in the bottle to condition and age"?)

(Stated like that, the answer is pretty obvious.)

 

[SteveHeff]

Just as a *possible reference, my LHB dude told me this, "bulk aging is approximately 3X faster than bottle aging," I don't know how true this is but it's something to work with.

 

[Yooper]

Just as a *possible reference, my LHB dude told me this, "bulk aging is approximately 3X faster than bottle aging," I don't know how true this is but it's something to work with.

That's not true, as least as far as my understanding of bulk aging as a winemaker. Winemakers age in bulk because it's a uniform process, and it's actually slower in bulk than in bottles. I don't know where you LHBS guy got his info, but it's backwards of what I've always thought to be true as a winemaker for many years before I started brewing.

I was always taught that wine ages best in bulk because it takes longer for bulk amounts to be affected by temperature changes than for bottled quantities.

I can't think of any reason at all that aging would happen faster in a carboy than in a bottle- the oxygen exposure by headspace would be less, and the temperature changes less. Oxygen (via headspace in the bottle) ages beer and wine faster, causing staling sooner. I think your LHBS has it reversed, but I've never heard the "3x faster" figure before so I have no idea where that comes from.

 

[SteveHeff]

That's not true, as least as far as my understanding of bulk aging as a winemaker. Winemakers age in bulk because it's a uniform process, and it's actually slower in bulk than in bottles. I don't know where you LHBS guy got his info, but it's backwards of what I've always thought to be true as a winemaker for many years before I started brewing.

I was always taught that wine ages best in bulk because it takes longer for bulk amounts to be affected by temperature changes than for bottled quantities.

I can't think of any reason at all that aging would happen faster in a carboy than in a bottle- the oxygen exposure by headspace would be less, and the temperature changes less. Oxygen (via headspace in the bottle) ages beer and wine faster, causing staling sooner. I think your LHBS has it reversed, but I've never heard the "3x faster" figure before so I have no idea where that comes from.

Good to know. I always thought I was a scientific guy, but I could never figure out his statement. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[RIC0]

my 1 cents worth as it's not even worth 2 cents but anywho.

I made a belgian tripel, primary a month, bottle aged it for 1 month and it was/is dam good. Drank on this batch for several months and it got better over time.

I made the same tripel, primary a month, racked to secondary bulk aged in glass carboy for 5 months and it was/is dam good.

The bulk aged one is a little better but to most average drinkers they would not know the difference. The flavor is better on the bulk aged but no HUGE difference as some might or want to think.