Bud Light Clone - (Ducking for cover)

[shildebr]

OK, OK, So just hear me out!

I recently had a friend over to try some homebrew. He appreciates beer, doesn't know much about styles (except "light" and "dark"), knows even less about brewing, but nonetheless, will enjoy a good IPA.

He mentioned that although he appreciates and enjoys craft brews, his favorite beer is budweiser. OK, I may not agree, but I appreciate his opinion.

However, what really got me is when he said "Why don't you make a budweiser clone?" I told him thats like asking picasso, "Why don't you do connect the dots?" (OK, I'm no picasso, but its the first name that came to mind) He says to me "You just don't do it because nobody can make a beer as good as budweiser, thats why its the best selling beer in the world"

So this is my attempt to prove my buddy wrong (and win a bet)

5.5 Gallons

5 lbs 2-row
1 lb 12 oz - flaked corn
12 oz - minute rice
Almost any bittering hops ~ 12 IBU's
1 packet US-05

Mash at 151 for 2 hours.
90 Minute Boil

Beano in primary for 2-3 weeks.

I apologize for the format, don't have beersmith at work. But I expect to get about a 4% ABV beer with the addition of the beano, and maybe around 110 calories per 12 oz serving.

Anybody have any comments besides how wrong/stupid/sinful/waste of time it is to clone a BMC?

 

[BlindLemonLars]

However, what really got me is when he said "Why don't you make a budweiser clone?" I told him thats like asking picasso, "Why don't you do connect the dots?"

The irony here is that connecting those "dots" is probably going to be harder than painting the Picasso masterpiece! For all their watery, flavorless glory, American lagers are amongst the hardest beers to brew or copy, precisely because there is so little flavor or color to mask imperfections.

Obviously it's not going to be a lager, with the US-05. That's a pretty clean yeast though, not a bad choice. Let us know how it turns out!

 

[BigEd]

OK, OK, So just hear me out!

I recently had a friend over to try some homebrew. He appreciates beer, doesn't know much about styles (except "light" and "dark"), knows even less about brewing, but nonetheless, will enjoy a good IPA.

He mentioned that although he appreciates and enjoys craft brews, his favorite beer is budweiser. OK, I may not agree, but I appreciate his opinion.

However, what really got me is when he said "Why don't you make a budweiser clone?" I told him thats like asking picasso, "Why don't you do connect the dots?" (OK, I'm no picasso, but its the first name that came to mind) He says to me "You just don't do it because nobody can make a beer as good as budweiser, thats why its the best selling beer in the world"

So this is my attempt to prove my buddy wrong (and win a bet)

5.5 Gallons

5 lbs 2-row
1 lb 12 oz - flaked corn
12 oz - minute rice
Almost any bittering hops ~ 12 IBU's
1 packet US-05

Mash at 151 for 2 hours.
90 Minute Boil

Beano in primary for 2-3 weeks.

I apologize for the format, don't have beersmith at work. But I expect to get about a 4% ABV beer with the addition of the beano, and maybe around 110 calories per 12 oz serving.

Anybody have any comments besides how wrong/stupid/sinful/waste of time it is to clone a BMC?

#1 Your buddy is an ignoramus. By his reasoning McDonald's makes the best hamburgers and Wonder makes the best bread. #2 You're not going to make Bud Light clone with dry ale yeast although that guy's taste buds may not know the difference. If you have the time and experience to do a lager it is possible to brew a homebrew version of BMC but unless you are a big fan of the style, which most homebrewers are not, it is only worth doing to enter a comp IMO. This guy's lack of knowledge is to his advantage in the bet. When you serve him the beer chill it in ice water and pour it in a frozen glass.

 

[DeathBrewer]

a friend of mine just made an american light lager. it was amazing. it's a REALLY GOOD damn beer. more of the style should be like this, it has a perfectly balanced hop and malt taste, but it's very light. the taste is there when you drink it, you get slight malt in the back and then it's GONE like you just drank a glass of water.

pretty incredible. i say go for it.

using dry ale yeast is not going to give you the style, though. why don't you make a cream ale instead? very light and nice...look into it

 

[shildebr]

#1 Your buddy is an ignoramus. By his reasoning McDonald's makes the best hamburgers and Wonder makes the best bread. #2 You're not going to make Bud Light clone with dry ale yeast although that guy's taste buds may not know the difference. If you have the time and experience to do a lager it is possible to brew a homebrew version of BMC but unless you are a big fan of the style, which most homebrewers are not, it is only worth doing to enter a comp IMO. This guy's lack of knowledge is to his advantage in the bet. When you serve him the beer chill it in ice water and pour it in a frozen glass.

Yeah, I should have mentioned it won't be a lager. I've done one before, but got rid of my extra fridge and its currently about 100 deg highs every day here, so the lager is pretty much out.

 

[shildebr]

using dry ale yeast is not going to give you the style, though. why don't you make a cream ale instead? very light and nice...look into it

You can call it a cream ale, light american lager, nectar of the gods, or horse piss, I'm not really going for style guidelines, just something so that I can give him a pint and collect on our bet.

 

[DeathBrewer]

then use the cream ale yeast (WLP080) and ferment as low as you can. 60°F would be ideal, but anything up to 70°F would work.

i would pick a nice soft hop, like saaz for your bittering.

 

[cactusgarrett]

Toss an offspeed pitch and give him a Czech Pils. Just similar enough in taste for your buddy to recognize, but vastly different enough to give him a little "worldly experience".

 

[Edcculus]

I had a similar argument with my roomate a while back. Luckily it didn't end in a bet for me to make a Bud clone. The REAL reason Budweiser is the #1 beer producer is not because it is the best beer, its because of mass marketing and cheap prices. Instead, I made it my mission to make my roomate like good beer. Fast foward a year later, and I have him hooked on Sierra Nevada.

 

[ohiobrewtus]

The last time someone told me Bud was the best beer in the world I smacked him upside the head, kicked him in the jewels, and poured his magical Budweiser on him while he twitched on the ground.

Seriously though, the recipe looks like it will end up pretty clean. I did a beer like this once and it turned out pretty close. I'd recommend using flaked rice over minute rice just because I used it in my BMC clone and it turned out well, but I lagered it for like 4 months. I'm going to be trying a similar ale recipe soon for SWMBO.

 

[Alamo_Beer]

Look at BierMuncher's Cream of 3 Crops.....

Read this:

http://www.byo.com/feature/1401.html

And this:

http://byo.com/recipe/702.html

 

[Grinder12000]

OK - I'm a newbie but have friends like yours.

What you are looking for is a very little malt character, very little hop character and very little yeast-derive character.

Avoid strong flavored ingredients.

Here is one recipe

Pre-Boil Gravity 1.032
Extract
Light LME (2.2L) 5.0 ibs
Rice Syrup(0L) 1.3 ibs

Hops
Happertau 4.0% AA for 60 minutes 0.61oz

Three Wyeast 2007 Pilsen Lager

4.94oz Corn Sugar for carbonating.

4 weeks before botteling

"Brewing Classic Styles"

 

[shildebr]

Look at BierMuncher's Cream of 3 Crops.....

His recipe was my starting point for this recipe, just with the addition of beano to really dry it out and make it real light.

I do think that this recipe would benefit from strictly controlled fermentation temperatures, which I rarely get this time of year. I think I might make Chimone's Bombshell Blonde Ale instead. It seems close in color, with a moderate flavor, and subtle hoppiness. I think it will really please my buddy as sort of a trade-off between the BMC and craft beer. (No offense to Chimone)

 

[DeathBrewer]

have you ever used beano in beer?

 

[Displaced MassHole]

Just wanted to say good luck with the BL clone, its all my wife usually drinks and ive tried 3 times to do a clone. It's no joke how hard it is to perfect, the lack of color and flavor makes any off flavor really come through. The best I can do is close to BL but has a stronger malt profile. Post the tasting results when its all said and done.

 

[shildebr]

have you ever used beano in beer?

Once, as an experiment. Brewed a 5 gallon batch of wheat. Pitched yeast into entire 5 gallons, shook, then siphoned a gallon for experimenting. Left 4 gallons as control and 1 gallon as experiment with a couple crushed up beano tablets. The beano wheat fermented out to a 1.003 while the control fermented to a 1.011.

My thinking with the beano for the BL was to use a smaller grain bill, but keep the ABV roughly the same by using the beano, which reduces the unfermentable sugars and , therefore, the caloric content, taste, mouthfeel, etc...... but not the alcohol.

 

[Brandon O]

Hope this helps you.


This recipe was written by jim baker. Jim says he has this beer on hand
for that person who just insists Budweiser is the best beer. He serves up one of these and says: "I thought you said a bud like". Its a light crips ale that tastes remarkably like a butt......i mean bud, only better.


4lb extra light DME
1lb Rice syrup solids
1.5lb Dextrose
1.5oz Saaz Hops
1 tsp Irish moss, 1 tsp gypsum
Wyeast 1056 American ale yeast

Instructions:
In 2 gallons of water, add DME, Rice syrup soids, Dextrose and Gypsum and bring to boil. Add 1 Oz. of the Saaz Hops. Boil for 45 minutes, add Irish Moss and other 1/2 oz of Saaz Hops. Boil for a final 15 minutes. Top off to 5 gallons, Cool wort to 80 degrees or colder and pitch yeast. Ferment 10-14 days at 68 - 72 degrees. You can also go from primary to secondary after 4 days and leave in secondary 10 days or until FG is 1.010 - 1.012.

 

[sirsloop]

So you're going to brew 5 gallons of beer so you can give your moron buddy a 16oz glass that he will spit up and talk trash about... and you'll be left with 4.9 gallons of piss water to dump down the drain. Sounds like pissin in the wind if you ask me.

 

[DeathBrewer]

So you're going to brew 5 gallons of beer so you can give your moron buddy a 16oz glass that he will spit up and talk trash about... and you'll be left with 4.9 gallons of piss water to dump down the drain. Sounds like pissin in the wind if you ask me.

you're the one talking trash, buddy. he wants to make a nice light recipe, not piss water.

i've often made light beers for parties so everyone can have a beer they enjoy and i'm happy to say it's always turned out well. i've even had bud drinkers say how wonderful it tastes. i've always liked them, too. even though i prefer dark, strong beers, i can appreciate a crisp, light lager or cream ale any day of the week.

also:

Anybody have any comments besides how wrong/stupid/sinful/waste of time it is to clone a BMC?

so:

 

[sirsloop]

whatever...the OP wanted a comment and that was mine. A "nice light recipe" is pretty much a nice way of saying piss water. If he wants to make an American lager for his friends and drink it, by all means.

 

[Bob]

Though the message could have been more tactfully delivered, I find I agree with sirsloop.

shildebr - if you like the style and would look forward to drinking it all yourself, go ahead. If you're not, if you're going through all this just to prove a point or win a bet, don't bother. While you might very well convert another beer aficionado, it's just as likely that he couldn't care less. And then you're out-of-pocket for a batch you'll end up giving away at a party because you couldn't care less about it.

I think a more successful mehod would be to invite him over to help you brew the beer, and every time you care for the beer (rack, bottle, etc.). He'll gain a new appreciation for the process, certainly.

Bottom line, I wouldn't bother. I don't care for the style except in July and August right after I finish cutting the lawn. It'd take me three years to get through a five-gallon batch. That doesn't work for me. YMMV!

Cheers,

Bob

 

[BierMuncher]

...A "nice light recipe" is pretty much a nice way of saying piss water...

I find that to be narrow minded.

 

[tagz]

if you like the style and would look forward to drinking it all yourself, go ahead. If you're not, if you're going through all this just to prove a point or win a bet, don't bother.

Couldn't it be that he just wants to do something nice for a friend?

Edit: Oh, nevermind. Just reread the original. You are correct sir.

 

[shildebr]

The deed is done, I took some of your "advice". I'm going to make Chimone's Bobmshell Blonde and step back the hops a little bit to around 15 IBU's.

Does that make everybody happy? I didn't clone a BMC. You'd think I was trying to clone anthrax. Geez.

 

[Revvy]

The deed is done, I took some of your "advice". I'm going to make Chimone's Bobmshell Blonde and step back the hops a little bit to around 15 IBU's.

Does that make everybody happy? I didn't clone a BMC. You'd think I was trying to clone anthrax. Geez.

I've been out and about this weekend with the Sailboat race in town, or else I would have weighed in with some actual advice for you...

Don't let some of the EAC's on here get to you...There's actually quite a few brewers on here who have attempted brewing regular Budweiser for the sheer challenge of brewing such a difficult beer...in fact iirc there was even a challenge a couple months back, where a handful of people on here were going to attempt it....

One thought to consider if you do do it and don't want to do a full five gallon batch, scale whatever recipe you do down to a 2.5 gallon batch..that will make a case of beer for your buddy.....

There are actually a few good threads on here with tips to brewing the light lager style of beer...of course you have to wade through posts of trash talking in and out of the threads...but here's a couple.

I wish I could find the thread about the challenge...it was actually a civil discussion, that had a lot of good advice.

And as much as some people here may not want to stomach it...BYO magazine actually published a clone recipe and a lot of tips on attempting it....there is a thread about it here https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=49395

Orfy offered some good tips as well...https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=23302&highlight=budweiser

Also listen to this Basic brewing Podcast it has a lot of good info as well.

December 21, 2006 - Brewing American Pilsner
Chris Colby, editor of Brew Your Own magazine walks us through the hoops and hurdles home brewers have to go through to brew American Pilsner, the most maligned of all styles.

http://media.libsyn.com/media/basicbrewing/bbr12-21-06.mp3

As much as I love heavy ales with lots of hops, I've been experimenting lately with brewing small batches of extremely light blondes and cream ales, lighter than any style I normally drink/brew...concentrating on things like low fermentation temps, long boils to blow off any dms, fermentation temp control.....I may even try to brew a gallon to two gallon batch of an american pilsner to lager...I figure if anything, if I can brew a crisp and clean tasting beer in that style, I will learn a lot and help me dial in my process for brewing the kinds of beers I normally like....

And if you brew a small batch it won't cost that much...my 2.5 gallon experimental batches have cost me under 10 bucks in grain...add another 4-5 bucks for hops and yeast...so it's not a lot of out of pocket change to pimp my brewing process...and if I don't like the beer, I'm sure I will find someone who would appreciate a free case of beer in a style they like...as long as they give me my bottles back.

After reading Maureen Ogle's book on the history of American Brewing, Ambitious Brew I've come to understand that AB in coming up with their version of the Bohemian Pilsner didn't do anything that American's consumers weren't asking for.

I've written up some of what I read here, https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showpost.php?p=741021&postcount=12

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showpost.php?p=721436&postcount=26

I can't stand budweiser, and don't like their business practices (especially after reading Maureen's book) but no longer blame them for "ruining beer" by forcing budweiser on a population that didn't want it...sadly American tastes had changed and our grandparents and great grandparents actually wanted a lighter less bodied, and hoppy beer, than what was available at the time, even from the established German breweries which were brewing a heavier style at the time, and watching their sales dwindle...

 

[JustDave]

shildebr, I say brew what you want and to hell with all the naysayers!

I think we're all forgetting that every beer has its place. I mowed the lawn yesterday, and it was hot as hell outside. When I got done, that Coors Light tasted pretty damn good at that point.

 

[GunnerMan]

I agree, although I don't like BMC I will drink it on some occasions. What you have there would be a decent beer I think and even if you don't like the style im sure you could give it to friends pretty easily. Put up a sign in the office 'Free Beer.'

It's like Enchiladas if you order one in Georgia it is going to taste worlds different from the one you ordered in Mexico. So if you grew up with the GA flavor then you might not like the Mexican version. Same with beer, grew up with BMC you might not like those heavy stouts or those IPA'
I belive most of the people got hooked on BMC because it is cheap, they have grown accustomed to it and that is their beer. So chances are you wont change his mind by trying to make a clone.
If you want him to appruciate beer more, everytime you finish a batch give him a 12oz botle of it and challenge him to take a week to drink it and take notes on what he found wrong with it/or what he liked about it. Im sure over time he will start asking for more than his one bottle per brew. Give him different styles of beers, give him a malty beer or a hoppy beer etc and let his tastebuds learn what each are and how they affect the beer profile. After a while he will drink his Bud and start to feel like one or more of the beer attributes are missing.

So go for the clone, worst that can happen is he dosen't like it, you give the beer away, and present him with your challenge.

 

[Schlenkerla]

shildbre - I'm with you. I've been making some lighter beers lately. I have several friends (from work) that know I make beer but they haven't tried any of mine yet. I like simple lawnmower beers during the summer.

There is nothing wrong with BMC's. In my opinion they are just plain. They have their place as sessions beers. Lets face it a majority of the beer drinking public are ignorant to beer flavors and styles. They don't have the knowledge or palate to appreciate anything else.

I just made Jamil Zainasheff's Blonde Ale & BierMuncher's Cream of Three Crop.

One thing to remember is to let this age 2-3 months before your buddy passes judgment. Let him have one every month, see if he tell the difference.

 

[shildebr]

Thank you for the actual information and intelligent responses. What a relief!

 

[Philip1993]

IMHO, the effort far exceeds the reward and you should resort to cheating. Go buy a keg of bud light and push it into a corny. Let him have that, and if he says it tastes like crap, you know he's full of it. If not, all is cool...

Oh, and let him out of the bet. Not cool to cheat to win a bet.