Brewing what you've got

[Oberon67]

Well, the weekend got away from me, as they so often do... but today I went and picked up three pounds of honey, and I'll have the "Honey Rye Braggot" in the primary this time tomorrow, God willing.

 

[GHBWNY]

I've got some misc. ingredients (hops and yeast) kicking around, and I've toyed with doing the same thing.

 

[Oberon67]

I've got a jar of US-05 in the fridge... I warm it up and feed it, pour half of it into my latest batch, feed it again back up to original volume and let it bubble for a day... then back in the fridge it goes.

 

[Zepth]

I substitute ingredients and change recipes around more often than I follow them to the letter. The LHBS price on hops by the oz is insane and I can't justify buying a lb for a recipe I found that I want to brew. So I'll try and use something that's close to what it calls for on that front and hope for the best. Cascade = amarillo, hallertau = tett, fuggles = willamette, close enough for me.

Far as malt goes Pale Ale all the way. I never really was a fan of super light beers anyways. But Weyermann pale ale for everything, gets used instead of 2 row, MO, and recently a Belgian Dubbel that would have more appropriately used pils. If memory serves at the moment some munich was cut out of that recipe to lighten it a touch to compensate. Is it the best method? Probably not.

Come to think of it I have only brewed 3 recipes to the letter. I believe it was Yoopers California Common, the simple 50% pale 50% wheat 3068 hefe, and Orfy's Hobgoblin II. The latter of which turned out fantastic once and less so twice. Brewing it again this week at some point and swapping out Notty for US-05 and 1084 split from 1 boil. Because of that falling out with Notty BM Cent Blonde also got a US-05 treatment and turned out great.

I recently went and picked up Brown Malt for an upcoming recipe because there doesn't really seem to be any quick fix substitute. Aside from that I tend to work with what I've got.

 

[Owly055]

Well, the weekend got away from me, as they so often do... but today I went and picked up three pounds of honey, and I'll have the "Honey Rye Braggot" in the primary this time tomorrow, God willing.

Do you really have Columbia? or is it Columbus? I'd love to get my hands on a few ounces of Columbia... Rye is a great ingredient in beer.....in reasonable percentage. I look forward to hearing about the result of your efforts.

Consider buying some amylase. You can buy it in itty bitty bottles at your LHBS.... or do like I do and buy it from R&B Wine Supply in a pound bag. It's a great tool in a situation like this. It makes many items you have in the cupboard potential ingredients in beer in a situation like this. I've used cooked rice, rolled oats, cornmeal, some of the cracked grain cereals you cook up like oatmeal, blackstrap molasses and sorghum and even potatoes in beer........ Your kitchen cupboard is full of potential ingredients............. Amylase makes many of them useable that otherwise might not be.

The joy of brewing small is that you can do this sort of thing without having to worry about having 60 bottles of beer you really don't really care for.

H.W.

 

[Oberon67]

Upon further review of my meager stock, I discovered that my "Columbia" hops are indeed Columbus. I misremembered; my apologies.

And I just ordered a pound of amylase from Midwest. I have several loaves of day-old rye bread in the freezer just now that are awaiting its arrival, and the commencement of a brewing experiment.

 

[myerstyson]

There are websites out there where you input what alcohol you have in your bar, and it pops out a list of cocktails you can make.

Is there a website where you can input all the fermentables, hops and yeasts you have and then it'll pop out recipes, or at least, styles?

 

[masonsjax]

I have a wider selection of grain in my basement than my LHBS stocks. I have probably close to what they have when it comes to hops. They have more yeast strains than me, but many of mine are hard to get wild, brett, bacteria, and blends. With all of that, I substitute ingredients routinely and rarely make the exact same recipe twice. Variety is good.

 

[Owly055]

I have a wider selection of grain in my basement than my LHBS stocks. I have probably close to what they have when it comes to hops. They have more yeast strains than me, but many of mine are hard to get wild, brett, bacteria, and blends. With all of that, I substitute ingredients routinely and rarely make the exact same recipe twice. Variety is good.

I'm relieved to know I'm not alone ;-) ...................


H.W.

 

[Owly055]

There are websites out there where you input what alcohol you have in your bar, and it pops out a list of cocktails you can make.

Is there a website where you can input all the fermentables, hops and yeasts you have and then it'll pop out recipes, or at least, styles?

Yes there is......... It's called "homebrewtalk.com"...... Simply input ingredients and out pops recipes ;-) ............ Well it should work that way anyway. Perhaps we need a forum specifically for that............. It would be fun and challenging.


H.W.

 

[Oberon67]

Okay, Honey Rye Braggot is now in the jug, yeast is pitched, and the wait begins.

Interestingly, immediately after the boil I noted that the volume seemed a little less than I was shooting for, and the wort had plenty of both body and sweetness. After I got it chilled and in the jug, sure enough, I needed to add about a pint of water to bring it back up to target volume.

So after I did that... this is AFTER I diluted it, mind you, and pitched a half-pint yeast starter... I took a hydrometer reading. The little bobbing tube tells me the OG is 1.140.

So if my little starter of US-05 isn't immediately killed in a diabetic coma, I'm looking at potentially in excess of a fifteen percent ABV from this witch's brew. We'll see if it takes off... but next time I'll use two pounds of honey in the gallon, and not three.

 

[Oberon67]

And if anyone's wondering, that's a modified 1-gallon Hawaiian Punch jug I'm using for a carboy. I drilled a 3/8-inch hole through the lid, and it's a snug fit for my poly tubing.

 

[1977Brewer]

I've been looking at apple juice bottles for the same thing. Kind of want to brew up a Sculpin clone, and rack a gallon or 2 over some grapefruit. I have a gallon glass jug, don't want to drop any more coin on another.

 

[Owly055]

Upon further review of my meager stock, I discovered that my "Columbia" hops are indeed Columbus. I misremembered; my apologies.

And I just ordered a pound of amylase from Midwest. I have several loaves of day-old rye bread in the freezer just now that are awaiting its arrival, and the commencement of a brewing experiment.

I would suggest reducing your 60 minute addition by half, and making the 5 minute addition 6 grams instead of 8 for an IBU of about 37. Columbus is a considerably different hop.

Both are nice hops...... The quantities are based on an alpha acid of 15 for Columbus, and 8.8 for Columbia....... Your package should say what it is. You may want to adjust up or down depending on the bittering you want or the AA of the hop. I like both hoppy beers and mild beers........ I have no idea what your tastes are.


H.W.

 

[Oberon67]

I like both hoppy and mild beers too. I had rather envisioned this as something of a mild beer with a bit of a grainy flavor from the rye, but my tasting of the wort indicates that this will be overall a much bigger beer in ever respect than I was really planning for. More hops and more alcohol, certainly.

Not a problem, though. I like those kind too.

 

[OldWorld]

I got a bag of old malt and stale hops...i'm thinking of doing a bakers yeast low gravity prison hooch style ale.

 

[Oberon67]

I got a bag of old malt and stale hops...i'm thinking of doing a bakers yeast low gravity prison hooch style ale.

My experience thus far is that brewing can be remarkably forgiving.

 

[Zepth]

Okay, Honey Rye Braggot is now in the jug, yeast is pitched, and the wait begins.

Interestingly, immediately after the boil I noted that the volume seemed a little less than I was shooting for, and the wort had plenty of both body and sweetness. After I got it chilled and in the jug, sure enough, I needed to add about a pint of water to bring it back up to target volume.

So after I did that... this is AFTER I diluted it, mind you, and pitched a half-pint yeast starter... I took a hydrometer reading. The little bobbing tube tells me the OG is 1.140.

So if my little starter of US-05 isn't immediately killed in a diabetic coma, I'm looking at potentially in excess of a fifteen percent ABV from this witch's brew. We'll see if it takes off... but next time I'll use two pounds of honey in the gallon, and not three.

For reference point what rye did you use? Mini-mash with malted rye? I just didn't see anything clearly enzymeatic listed in the original recipe.

Could try and bring that OG down a bit with more diluting assuming you've got space for it or another fermenter available.

 

[Oberon67]

I used Maillard crushed malted rye; mash was all-grain, added honey to the wort prior to boil.

Edit: After thinking about it, that OG is too much. I'm going to have to dilute it some. That will be better for the yeast, and will bring the uber-hops down to a more reasonable level.

 

[Oberon67]

Well, now I'm torn. I came home after work to find a lovely big krausen in my punch jug, and the blowoff tube happily ticking away the seconds. We'll see, I guess.

 

[masonsjax]

US-05 has a listed alcohol tolerance of 12% so it may stall out when it approaches that range.

 

[Owly055]

Okay, Honey Rye Braggot is now in the jug, yeast is pitched, and the wait begins.

Interestingly, immediately after the boil I noted that the volume seemed a little less than I was shooting for, and the wort had plenty of both body and sweetness. After I got it chilled and in the jug, sure enough, I needed to add about a pint of water to bring it back up to target volume.

So after I did that... this is AFTER I diluted it, mind you, and pitched a half-pint yeast starter... I took a hydrometer reading. The little bobbing tube tells me the OG is 1.140.

So if my little starter of US-05 isn't immediately killed in a diabetic coma, I'm looking at potentially in excess of a fifteen percent ABV from this witch's brew. We'll see if it takes off... but next time I'll use two pounds of honey in the gallon, and not three.

3/4 pound of honey grew to 3 pounds? That's pretty radical........... That calls for an OG of 1.147 and an ABV of about 14.5 percent...... You like 'em big apparently. You are going to find that your attenuation will fall short, and you will have a very sweet mead.... It's not a braggot anymore due to the percentage of honey. I would suggest getting some WLP 099 and making a good big starter, and pitching it into your "witches brew". This should make it attenuate out enough to be drinkable.


H.W.

 

[Oberon67]

What happened was, silly me misremembered the recipe. Lesson number 1: DO NOT BREW FROM MEMORY.

I will turn this into two batches and dilute about 40 percent by volume with water, which ought to bring the US-05 back into its comfort zone.

EDIT: Yes, this was a stupid mistake. Thankfully I believe I will still ultimately get something drinkable out of it as a result.

 

[Oberon67]

Okay, today I poured somewhat less than half of this batch out of my fermenter improvised from a Hawaiian Punch jug, into a fermenter improvised from a 2-liter Dr. Pepper bottle. It filled the 2-liter to about 60 percent of capacity. I then topped off both fermenters with water, pitched a quarter-teaspoon of Fermax in both, and installed blowoff tubes. Now both fermenters are happily bubbling away, where before there was only one.

 

[Oberon67]

I bottled this last Sunday, by the way... I knew it should not be carbed by today, but I opened a bottle just to sample it; curiosity was driving me mad.

Turns out that the flavor is most interesting. It's too young to be delicious and the carbonation was just beginning, but there's a lot of complexity in this beer already. First impression was SWEET/SOUR/BITTER/HOPS/BOOZE, more or less in that order. Hops were pretty up-front, along with the somewhat harsh rye grain taste.

Can't wait for this to complete a couple more weeks in the bottle.

 

[razyrsharpe]

Brewing is like Sex ........... The joy is in experimentation and unfettered enthusiasm. It's a voyage of discovery

Brewing by slavishly following a recipe works for some folks........ Not for me. Recipes give me ideas, not connect the dots scripted processes I'm interested in following again and again if ever. Do you dress up in character and roll play using a script with your lover, or repeat the exact sequence of steps trying to recreate the same experience again and again? Repetition is for commercial breweries. Like the classic "Rat Burger", Budweiser caters to folks who expect every bottle of beer to be identical... just like every Big Mac. It's an accomplishment, something that takes a great deal of skill and technology. It is NOT what I want. I want interesting and differing products. I know I can go back to something I made last year and hit it pretty damn close from my notes, but homebrew can and should evolve as far as I'm concerned...... Just as sex should change and evolve between partners.
I don't envision EVER wanting to repeat the same thing over and over again..... You've lost the joy of discovery, the sense of adventure.... it's NOT for me, and never will be. I want a consistently good product, but not a consistent product.
I would love to see my local microbrewery get a Braumeister and do a couple of brews a week on it...... exploratory brews, and I suspect that many of his customers would find it interesting and exciting. It could involve the customers and and educate them. If I were in the business, I would want to operate on a scale where I could do this. Where I could run small batches alongside the 15 barrel standbys.

I NEVER stop at the LHBS without buying materials I haven't any plan for, often things I've never used, be they hops, grains,or yeasts. My rule is always buy something I've never used, and often things I really haven't studied. When I sit down to design a brew, I'm frequently juggling ingredients like these, reading about how they are used and deciding what I want or do not want in my brew...........

I guess that makes me crazy by most folks standards......... Crazy in the brew house, crazy in bed.......... Not a bad reputation really!! I was just today relating an incident that happened a number of years back where two children, probably 6 and 7 years old (brother and sister) were splashing in the mud outside the local cafe/post office/grocery store (all one business here). I encouraged them to take off their shoes..... I did too ...... and we walked through the mud puddles, and in the front door. I picked them up one at a time and held them upside down while they walked on the ceiling leaving muddy foot prints, while the proprietor expressed her outrage.... trying to keep from laughing. That was actually quite a few years ago, and it's a story that friends and neighbors still tell. Dorothy has since passed on....... a dear friend (the proprietor) and I held her hand on her death bed. In a more or less comatose state, I spoke to her about old times and incidents like this......... and while her eyes were shut and she couldn't speak, she did squeeze my hand and I new that she treasured our common memories as much as I do.


H.W.

Amen Owly. the recipes i read are for guidelines, i use what i have or i can borrow from my brother. i get close, but i also like to tweak a recipe to "make it my own".

 

[Oberon67]

I would suggest getting some WLP 099 and making a good big starter, and pitching it into your "witches brew". This should make it attenuate out enough to be drinkable.

UPDATE: As you're aware, Owly, I decided to dilute this batch rather than ferment it at original strength. Now it's been three weeks in the bottles, and I cracked one today to evaluate.

First impression: It carbed up nicely for me, but there is very little head retention. The head appears, lasts about a minute, and goes away... because there's not much malt in the brew, is there. The fermentables were almost all from the honey, so there's little protein there to sustain the head.

No matter. My US-05 left a significant yeast haze in the brew, which bothers me not at all. Even diluted, the flavors are big... big rye, big yeast, and a not inconsiderable alchohol bite. The hop bitterness is just right, and lingers in the mouth as it should.

The honey rye braggot leads with the "graininess" of the rye... it's hard to explain, but there it is... followed by the dryness of the yeast. There is a bit of saison-like quality to this brew, due to its pronounced yeast character. The dilution to correct for too much honey really allowed the yeast flavor to shine through.

Note: Bottle conditioning led to a fair amount of yeast residue in the bottles, which requires a bit of a careful pour for the squeamish. Perhaps tomorrow I will post a photo.

I will make this again. It is a winner.

 

[Owly055]

UPDATE: As you're aware, Owly, I decided to dilute this batch rather than ferment it at original strength. Now it's been three weeks in the bottles, and I cracked one today to evaluate.

First impression: It carbed up nicely for me, but there is very little head retention. The head appears, lasts about a minute, and goes away... because there's not much malt in the brew, is there. The fermentables were almost all from the honey, so there's little protein there to sustain the head.

No matter. My US-05 left a significant yeast haze in the brew, which bothers me not at all. Even diluted, the flavors are big... big rye, big yeast, and a not inconsiderable alchohol bite. The hop bitterness is just right, and lingers in the mouth as it should.

The honey rye braggot leads with the "graininess" of the rye... it's hard to explain, but there it is... followed by the dryness of the yeast. There is a bit of saison-like quality to this brew, due to its pronounced yeast character. The dilution to correct for too much honey really allowed the yeast flavor to shine through.

Note: Bottle conditioning led to a fair amount of yeast residue in the bottles, which requires a bit of a careful pour for the squeamish. Perhaps tomorrow I will post a photo.

I will make this again. It is a winner.

I'm glad it worked out.......... It was a comedy of errors with your initial addition of 4x the amount of honey needed, then diluting down half and half with water. The Rye was bound to come through as the dominant flavor by far even with only half a pound, considering the fact that honey, even in that quantity doesn't add a lot of flavor to a beer.

It would be interesting to do the same thing using invert sugar syrup instead of honey. It's cheap and easy to make using ascorbic or citric acid or lemon juice or cream of tarter to do the conversion. It's 100% fermentable, consisting of glucose and fructose broken down from the more complex sucrose table sugar. The trick is to monitor the temp of the boil and always boil down to a specific temp so the concentration is the same. I get 3 pints of syrup out of 3 pounds of sugar, boiling down to 122F. It's a good ingredient for bumping the gravity up without adding body or flavor as more malt would. I've brewed a few beers where I duplicated a brew I liked, but bumped it with invert sugar syrup to a higher ABV. The result is the same brew, but with a bit more of a kick.....if you keep it within reason.

I use a lot of US-05, and it ferments clean, very little yeast flavor, and nice clear beer. "yeast haze" is a new one?? I also have very little bottle sediment, but my procedure is not typical. After the typical 10 day to 2 weeks in the fermenter, I rack into a clear glass container with a spigot, add bottling syrup, and cold crash for at least 3 days before bottling. I often add gelatin for finings right in the bottling syrup. This procedure results in very nice beer with no haze whatsoever, and minimal bottle sediment.

H.W.