Brewing up a Gluten Free Beer this weekend- anyone else?

[Lcasanova]

ive been libating and scheming,
i was almost thinking of experimenting with a big GF beer, ive been watching this video by brewdog brewery of scotland. they made a 30+% stout called tactical nuclear penquin. so i was thinking about doing a double ferment. fermenting with an ale yeast, waiting for a stuck ferment, then pitching a champange yeast and seeing what it does again. prolly adding 10-15lbs of a sugar. heres a recipie that im kind of pondering.
into 5 gal
mash 4-8# of millet with amalyse
7# tapioca syrup
3.5# sorghum syrup
3-5# clover honey
8oz maltodextrin

something like
8oz of hops

pitch an ale yeast

3 weeks later pitch a champang yeast

find a way to freeze the fermenter and decant everything not frozen from the ice.

keg and force carb and become very very stupid

thoughts, opinions, concerns, alterations?

Hmmm...well, uh...I'm not sure where to start..

Have you had success converting millet in the past? What is your malting schedule like with it? Is the maltodextrin really necessary since you are going to be concentrating it anyways?

It just seems like a lot of fermentable sugar to start with and going into a boil you are going to have some pretty thick wort.

If I were going to do this I might brew a 1080 beer and add the rest of the sugar over the time of the ferment and then switch to champagne yeast later on, you'll probably need a starter for that though...

And to freeze it, I might use 2L coke bottles or something to keep from breaking glass...

Just my .02

 

[DKershner]

Making an Eisbock is one of the most difficult practices to pull off successfully in brewing, and you want to do it with GF grains that don't convert themselves? I cannot advise strongly enough against this unless you have some gobs of brewing experience I am not aware of.

First of all, no maltodextrin. This thing is already going to be a milkshake no matter what you do.

You need lots of stuff in there that finishes LOW. Corn sugar is a good start, I have no idea what tapioca as a primary fermentable tastes like or finishes at. Honey is borderline, but you need something to give this flavor of some sort. Your grain bill is interesting, have you ever tried something similar in composition to this? Making a huge beer certainly won't make it taste any better.

Have you considered how long you are going to age a 20+% beer? If it were me, I would probably wait about a decade. I had some 120min IPA, and it was maple syrup and fire. Unless you want fire, AGE LONG. It doesn't taste good.

When you do the initial giant pitch of ale yeast, maybe 10 packs or so, let it ferment two days, and slowly each day add more sugars. Honey, corn sugar, tapioca, all could easily be added in the fermenter, and therefore should be. Then I would skip champagne and go straight to WLP099. Champagne doesn't have the alcohol tolerance you desire.

Those are just my initial thoughts, there are probably several other variables you have to deal with.

 

[Lcasanova]

Making an Eisbock is one of the most difficult practices to pull off successfully in brewing, and you want to do it with GF grains that don't convert themselves? I cannot advise strongly enough against this unless you have some gobs of brewing experience I am not aware of.

Basically what I thought last night when I read this...I was thinking "theres no way this will work..." Nice thought though, and if you do try it, post your notes please sir

 

[DKershner]

Basically what I thought last night when I read this...I was thinking "theres no way this will work..." Nice thought though, and if you do try it, post your notes please sir

It's possible.

I was contemplating doing something like this on the non-GF side of my brewing, but decided against it due to the aging requirements and the fact that it doesn't taste very good. GF really wouldn't be all that much harder, both would probably need amylase anyway. Although, this would be the most difficult thing I have ever taken on, and I have been brewing for 6 years and hundreds of gallons. Incredible control to not contaminate, knowing what yeast does and what it means in near all brewing scenarios, having yeast culturing equipment, and having brewed several successful 12%+ beers would be what I would consider a baseline for even making an attempt.

 

[Lcasanova]

It's possible.

I was contemplating doing something like this on the non-GF side of my brewing, but decided against it due to the aging requirements and the fact that it doesn't taste very good. GF really wouldn't be all that much harder, both would probably need amylase anyway. Although, this would be the most difficult thing I have ever taken on, and I have been brewing for 6 years and hundreds of gallons. Incredible control to not contaminate, knowing what yeast does and what it means in near all brewing scenarios, having yeast culturing equipment, and having brewed several successful 12%+ beers would be what I would consider a baseline for even making an attempt.

Well at least your advice is a starting point for any takers

 

[DKershner]

I'll help anyone through it, but first brew a Barleywine at 12% that gets to below 1.030. That way you are at least familiar with what it takes to get some lazy yeast in gear.

I wish there was a GF beer you could taste that was 15%+. The best way I can describe it is a combination of winey, sherry, scotch, & maple syrup flavors with the consistency and look of beer. You could and should easily go straight to 100IBU, because it will still taste VERY malty.

 

[Lcasanova]

Anyone else brewing this weekend? I'm brewing up my Gluten Free Pumpkin Ale Saturday- hopefully.

 

[DKershner]

Anyone else brewing this weekend? I'm brewing up my Gluten Free Pumpkin Ale Saturday- hopefully.

I am brewing up a glutenous and a gluten free version of 'Merriment', this year's holiday spice ale. Recipes will probably be finalized over the coming days.

 

[fermentedhiker]

I'm hoping to start my stout-ish GF mash this weekend or by next at the latest.

On freezing to gain ABV(I've done it to make cider jack, but never beer) is the flavors are WAY concentrated so any flaw in the original product will be exaggerated. IE if it's a little sour it's going in it will come out puckering you like lemons etc... you get the point. Getting something to ferment to 12-15% is easy enough with the right yeast and proper control of temperatures, but getting something there that still tastes good.............not so easy.

If you do try definitely take good notes and share your conclusions. Sounds like a fun learning experience if nothing else. I dare say at the least you will be able to make something that can make you act stupid

 

[DKershner]

On freezing to gain ABV(I've done it to make cider jack, but never beer) is the flavors are WAY concentrated so any flaw in the original product will be exaggerated. IE if it's a little sour it's going in it will come out puckering you like lemons etc... you get the point. Getting something to ferment to 12-15% is easy enough with the right yeast and proper control of temperatures, but getting something there that still tastes good.............not so easy.

If you do try definitely take good notes and share your conclusions. Sounds like a fun learning experience if nothing else. I dare say at the least you will be able to make something that can make you act stupid

Yes, I definitely didn't want to discourage anyone from doing this eventually, but maybe make the base beer, then a BIG base beer, then freeze concentrate once you have a REALLY awesome tasting BIG beer. I just didn't want anyone to waste a whole ton of time and not learn anything from the process.

 

[mrtree]

Anyone else brewing this weekend? I'm brewing up my Gluten Free Pumpkin Ale Saturday- hopefully.

I am brewing up a brown based on your recipe, just changed the hops a little. Looking forward to it!

 

[Lcasanova]

Hope it turns out nice!

 

[DKershner]

If you were doing the brown again, how would you change your original recipe? What did the taste come out as? Which ingredient powered the flavor? I ask this because I have never attempted a malty GF beer...since we don't really have a malt I like the flavor of.

 

[Lcasanova]

I will be doing it again soon. My most recent changes are a full boil and slightly increasing the IBU's. I'll also be upping the molasses and maple syrup and adding some BRS. The OG is 1.053 for now but I might play around with that.

I thought the beer was fantastic, it turned out wayyy better than I thought it was going to. The sorghum taste was partly there but there were other things present- it's been a long time since I've had it. I'll say though, I really thought that the blackstrap molasses really came into play in this beer. I was worried that it might be too overpowering but it didn't come out that way in the finished product. I'll probably refine the recipe a little bit but it will be mostly identical to the original.

 

[JerryE]

Anyone else brewing this weekend? I'm brewing up my Gluten Free Pumpkin Ale Saturday- hopefully.

Planning to brew up my 2nd ever batch of GF beer. My goal is to do a basic sorghum beer that tastes pretty good, and I can do easily and consistently. I figure that will be a good starting point to branch off and try different styles and flavors.

I am going with a Sorghum Pale Ale recipe from the site I ordered the Briess syrup, but substituting 2-3# of Brown Rice Syrup for sorghum.

My first batch of GF beer turned out surprisingly drinkable, considering I did not have a clue what I was doing, and now I think this hobby may have me hooked

 

[Lcasanova]

Nice, maybe you could do 3# sorghum and 3# BRS- I know Midwest Supplies sells 3# or 6# of Sorghum Syrup. I think you'll be happy with a Pale Ale, is it the Simple Simon recipe?

 

[JerryE]

Nice, maybe you could do 3# sorghum and 3# BRS- I know Midwest Supplies sells 3# or 6# of Sorghum Syrup. I think you'll be happy with a Pale Ale, is it the Simple Simon recipe?

Yeah, I could do 3#. Thanks for the feedback. I already bought 3 1# jars of the Lundberg BRS, but I was not sure how far to go with it.

The recipe was from Austin Homebrew:
Recipe for Gluten-Free Pale Ale (5 Gallon Batch)
6.6 lb. White Sorghum Syrup
1 oz. Cascade hops** (boil for 60 minutes)
1 oz. Cascade hops** (boil 2 minutes)
1 oz. Cascade hops** (dry hop 3-7 days)
1 pkg. Fermentis US-05 dry yeast (gluten free)
1 cup Honey (for bottling)
**Also, try this recipe with other American hops like Ahtanum, Amarillo, Glacier, Palisade, etc. If using high-alpha varieties, such as Columbus, use only 0.5 oz. for the bittering addition.

I will do the 3#/3# sorghum/brs, and I already have the Cascade.
I am not sure about the Honey for bottling. I was thinking about just going with corn priming sugar, which I still have on hand from my first batch.

 

[DirtbagHB]

I got sorghum, time, and 2 empty primaries. Gonna give a go at your pumpkin spice and something else, brown or suggestions. Got a big quinoa ipa in secondary and a light quinoa ipa on oak chips bottle that up in a week or so

 

[Lcasanova]

Yeah, I could do 3#. Thanks for the feedback. I already bought 3 1# jars of the Lundberg BRS, but I was not sure how far to go with it.

The recipe was from Austin Homebrew:
Recipe for Gluten-Free Pale Ale (5 Gallon Batch)
6.6 lb. White Sorghum Syrup
1 oz. Cascade hops** (boil for 60 minutes)
1 oz. Cascade hops** (boil 2 minutes)
1 oz. Cascade hops** (dry hop 3-7 days)
1 pkg. Fermentis US-05 dry yeast (gluten free)
1 cup Honey (for bottling)
**Also, try this recipe with other American hops like Ahtanum, Amarillo, Glacier, Palisade, etc. If using high-alpha varieties, such as Columbus, use only 0.5 oz. for the bittering addition.

I will do the 3#/3# sorghum/brs, and I already have the Cascade.
I am not sure about the Honey for bottling. I was thinking about just going with corn priming sugar, which I still have on hand from my first batch.

I don't know much about using honey at bottling either, I'd use corn sugar myself. Let us know how this one turns out, I've been thinking about an all Cascade Pale Ale at some point.

 

[Lcasanova]

I got sorghum, time, and 2 empty primaries. Gonna give a go at your pumpkin spice and something else, brown or suggestions. Got a big quinoa ipa in secondary and a light quinoa ipa on oak chips bottle that up in a week or so

I think now would be a good time to brew a brown. If you do mine let me know what you think, I'll be brewing it again in a month or so with slight revisions.

 

[DirtbagHB]

I'll give it a shot with the revisions you mentioned here above. More backstrap and more maple syrup. And well see what hops are at the lbhs. I've got some cascade ready for pickin in the backyard. Thanks for everything!

 

[Lcasanova]

Do it to it, I'm just here to share my experience and thoughts

 

[DKershner]

I'll give it a shot with the revisions you mentioned here above. More backstrap and more maple syrup. And well see what hops are at the lbhs. I've got some cascade ready for pickin in the backyard. Thanks for everything!

Let me know when you are ready to make a GF pale, I have a recipe that I think will really rock. I may just make it when I get some time.

Make sure if you are using wet hops to use approx 3-5x as much weight-wise. Visually it will appear to be the same amount as normal though. Or, you can let em sit on a window screen with a fan over em for a few days.

 

[stefan1011]

I don't know much about using honey at bottling either, I'd use corn sugar myself. Let us know how this one turns out, I've been thinking about an all Cascade Pale Ale at some point.

I have an all Cascade Pale Ale fermenting at the moment. I dry hopped with 1 oz. Cascade a week ago. The recipe was from the Breiss website and it is called "Hoppy to be Gluten-Free Pale Ale."


Hoppy to be Gluten-Free Pale Ale
Recipe for 5 US gallons (19L)
Description: The higher BU’s and aroma hops blend well with the sorghum flavor to make a beer reminiscent of Pale
Ales brewed in Northern California.
Quantity Ingredients Comments
7.5 lbs BriesSweet™ White Sorghum Syrup 45DE High Maltose
1 oz Cascade Hops (6.5% AA) (Beginning of boil)
0.5 oz Cascade Hops 5 minutes before end of boil
1 oz Cascade Hops End of Boil
1 oz Cascade Hops Dry hop
2 pkgs Nottingham dry ale yeast or Wyeast 1272GF gluten free yeast
1 cup Honey Bottling
Brewing Procedures:
Mix syrup and water and bring to boil. Add bittering hops. Boil 40 minutes. Add second hops. Add remaining hops
according to schedule. Quickly chill wort. Ferment for 1.5 weeks at 65-70º F. Add dry hops after primary fermentation or
after transfer to secondary. Force carbonate or bottle condition with honey (recommended).
OG 1.056
FG 1.016
ABV 5.2%
IBUs 37


I followed this recipe exactly so far, but I plan on using corn sugar for bottling. It looks and smells good so far three weeks into fermentation.

 

[Lcasanova]

Do you really NEED 2 packages of yeast? I've always just used 1 in my 5.5 gallon batches.

 

[stefan1011]

Do you really NEED 2 packages of yeast? I've always just used 1 in my 5.5 gallon batches.

I don't think it hurts. I don't use any yeast nutrient or make a yeast starter, and at $1.99 a package I feel it is cheap insurance for a good fermentation. As far as taste, I cannot tell a difference between a 1 or 2 package batch.

 

[DKershner]

Do you really NEED 2 packages of yeast? I've always just used 1 in my 5.5 gallon batches.

You can decide for yourself, here is a many-page topic on overpitching: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f163/why-not-pitch-your-yeast-cake-166221/

 

[DirtbagHB]

icas, i did a variation of your pumpkin spice.... 2 5 gal batches.. ill post my recipes later tonight

 

[mrtree]

I brewed up a brown based on Lcasanova's recipe.
Bucket was bubbling away first thing the next morning and smells great.
This could become a regular.

6.00 lb Sorghum Liquid Extract
1.00 lb Rice Extract Syrup
1.00 lb Buckwheat, roasted
1.00 lb Millet, roasted

1.00 oz Target [11.00 %] (60 min)
0.75 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] (15 min)
0.25 oz Goldings, East Kent [5.00 %] (0 min)

1.00 tsp Irish Moss (Boil 10.0 min)
1.00 tsp Yeast Nutrient (Boil 5.0 min)
8.00 oz Malto-Dextrine (Boil 5.0 min)

0.50 lb Candi Sugar, Dark
0.50 lb Maple Syrup
0.50 lb Molasses

1 Pkgs SafAle English Ale (DCL Yeast #S-04) Yeast-Ale

Any comments on the recipe are appreciated as this is only my 4th batch.

 

[Lcasanova]

icas, i did a variation of your pumpkin spice.... 2 5 gal batches.. ill post my recipes later tonight

Nice, I just got mine finished on Saturday, maybe we can do a swap once they are ready.