brewers, 2-row, pale vs pale ale...

[odie]

Great, another stupid base malt question... I like to keep a lot of grains on hand. 6 base grains and probably a couple dozen different crystal, kilned and roasted grains.

To the point...I've always used roughly 3L 2-row Pale Ale/MO as my usual base grain for most styles unless Pilsner is specified.

Should I consider adding Brewers/2-row/Pale (regular "non-ale" pale) to the mix? It's about the same Lovibond as Pilsner but I assume it's a different kinda grain/malt. Maybe close but different.

All my recipes that call for "2-row" or "Pale" I've been using Pale-Ale or MO cause that's the only kind I buy.

I don't mind having another base malt on hand.

Is "Brewers" "2-Row" and "Pale" all around 1-2L and basically a different style/type grain than "Pale Ale" and "Marris Otter" around 3-4L? Something in between Pilsner and MO/Pale-Ale?

 

[Bobby_M]

"brewer's malt", aka "2 row" is generally 1.5 to 2L and "pale ale" or "pale malt" is usually 1L darker which to my palette is like 2 row with 1% biscuit malt added.

 

[IslandLizard]

That^
Also, MO is not just any barley or mix, it's 100% Maris Otter, a UK barley variety specially bred for brewing.
Others that come to mind are Golden Promise (UK), Optic (UK), Harrington, Metcalf, etc. etc.

https://www.brewcabin.com/malted-barley/https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...jUJ0NYtY_7Lov_Vue_k_hZPf8/edit#gid=1152407184Select the right tab. It's a wide spreadsheet, you'll need to scroll to the right quite a bit to see the descriptions.

 

[odie]

well that's just repeating what's in my OP and what I've gotten from all the data sheets collected.

I guess I should have asked what are your "conclusions" or "interpretations" of the published specs and differences and does it warrant stocking all three of these base grains in bulk? Pils, basic 2-row and a pale ale? Would "you" stock all three?

Are they different enough to make it worth while to buy all 3 grains in bulk/sack or just substitute when needed and/or desired? this 2-row stuff seems to fall in-between pilsner and pale ale malts.

 

[bracconiere]

Would "you" stock all three?

i wouldn't..but i'm not "him", lol

if i was playing the versatility, i'd stock just pils, and throw each batch in the oven at low temps before a brew, to taste for each batch...should help freshen it up too.

 

[odie]

i'd stock just pils, and throw each batch in the oven at low temps before a brew

interesting...so are you implying that you only stock pilsner as your base malt and you "kiln" it yourself into 2-row, pale ale, MO, munich, Vienna, etc as needed?

 

[IslandLizard]

I guess I should have asked what are your "conclusions" or "interpretations" of the published specs and differences and does it warrant stocking all three of these base grains in bulk? Pils, basic 2-row and a pale ale? Would "you" stock all three?

Are they different enough to make it worth while to buy all 3 grains in bulk/sack or just substitute when needed and/or desired? this 2-row stuff seems to fall in-between pilsner and pale ale malts.

If you'd be brewing through them fast enough to warrant stocking all 3, then yes.

A (good quality) Pilsner, a U.S. or Canadian 2-row, and a high flavor UK ale malt, such as MO or GP. That's what I do.
You can always mix the latter 2 at any ratio you see fit, and/or use some biscuit malt. There's really no equivalent to either MO or GP, they're both unique enough, IMO.

 

[bracconiere]

interesting...so are you implying that you only stock pilsner as your base malt and you "kiln" it yourself into 2-row, pale ale, MO, munich, Vienna, etc as needed?

no i make a lot of my own base malt, but when i'm kilning it..i'll go anywhere from 160->180f for 12 hours for "what i feel like" for the batch. and pilsner is the lightestest, so you could always give it 220-250f for an hour or two to slightly darken it. you'd have to play around with the flavor profile and get a feel for it. but you can add degrees lovibond, you can't take them out.

and i think the freshly toasted grain would be special tasting....just like dry pan heating spices before using them....

 

[odie]

no i make a lot of my own base malt,

I am so not worthy...

 

[bracconiere]

I am so not worthy...

LOL, well............i don't even try to make good beer with it, so you're SO MUCH MORE WORTHY! but i did let some other people use it they said it made delicious beer....i just got a giggle that they brewed a batch of good beer, 6.5 gallons, with what cost me $4 worth of barley! (shipping is a beeeeatch though)


i do kiln to how feel that week though!

edit: but i do think freshening up base malt, or all malt before milling, should be played around with.

 

[odie]

If you'd be brewing through them fast enough to warrant stocking all 3, then yes.

twice a month or more. Sometimes 4 beers a week.

My brewing styles have expanded greatly in recent years. I think I spent the first 20 using nothing except pale ale and MO with some crystal and roasted grains. Just APA/IPA and stouts really.

Now I've got like 9 different base malts plus maybe 2 dozen other crystal and kilned malts.

I've always seen the basic 2-row sacks and brewers malt at LHBS but never gave it much thought. But might just grab a sack as it seems to fill a void for beers that I really don't really call for MO or pale ale malts.

 

[IslandLizard]

Now I've got like 9 different base malts plus maybe 2 dozen other crystal and kilned malts.

Shakes hands...

 

[bracconiere]

Now I've got like 9 different base malts

you're intimidating me now....i think i'm going to kiln the batch i got drying now LoDo, and do it in the oven in a sealed container...lol

 

[odie]

Pilsner
Kolsch (German, once in a lifetime score)
Wheat
US Pale Ale
Belgian Pale Ale
Marris Otter
Vienna
Munich light
Munich dark

another sack of plain 2-row would last maybe 7 beers. If it suck it's gone fast anyway...

 

[Bramling Cross]

I've gotten by with two bins for MO and pils. When I do a US-style beer I'll mix between 25%-50% MO with the pils, depending on the recipe. It's not the same as US two row or even US pale malt, but it gets the job done--especially for older recipes that call for the obligatory 1lb of C-40.

With that in mind, though, I've been flirting with the idea of buying a third bin and stocking 55lbs of US two-row. I'll likely do that sooner rather than later.

 

[day_trippr]

fwiw, I all of my base malts to be as light as I can reasonably get as it's impossible to make a beer lighter but easy to make it darker. So my annual bulk base malt buy is 50 kilos each Golden Promise and Weyermann Pilsner, and 100 pounds of either Brewers Malt or Pale Malt - either way, something sub 2L. If I need the beer to be darker I add some specialty grain, which obviates the need to store more varieties of base malt...

Cheers!

 

[odie]

The Vienna and munich are kinda the upper end for base malts I think.

 

[bwible]

Maris Otter is a more expensive malt (at least here) that is usually called for in British styles. It is thought of as richer than some other pale malts and definitely more than the generic 2-row.

Two-row is just a generic term for how barley grows. Maris Otter is a kind of two-row. When people say two-row, I usually take that to mean specifically Breiss 2-row, since that is the most common brand specifically labelling their malt that way.

I generally keep 3 base malts by the sack - 1) Breiss 2-row. Its cheap, some guys don’t like it. I use it in anything American. 2) Pilsener malt. Right now I have BestMalz. I use it for pseudo-lagers, blonde ales and lighter beers. 3) either Maris Otter or Golden Promise. I use that mainly for British styles. Sometimes I buy some mild ale malt and mix some of that in when I want something to be fuller or richer. I don’t buy mild ale malt by the sack.

I know some people regard Munich malt and Vienna malt as base malts. Those are not base malts to me. They are specialty grains, some that can be used in high percentages for certain beers.

 

[odie]

My thinking is a lot along the same lines...

MO is a bit more $ than Pale Ale or 2-row. It's also a bit sweeter when I munch on it. I like it but kinda save that for more British styles since it's not common to find when I run out.

Briess Pale Ale is my main base malt for more "American" style pale/IPA beers or anything not specifically British or Belgian. But thinking about trying a sack of basic 2-row.

I do a fair amount of stuff that calls for larger amounts of Munich or Vienna malts. I agree they are on the upper range of what one might consider a "base malt", but they can be used in high % in some beers. Even the majority grain.

I do fine it very strange that I'm trying to expand my assortment of base malts but trying to "simplify" my collection of crystal, kilned and roasted malts...

 

[porterguy]

It doesn’t appear $$ is an issue for you, but regular 2-row is $20-$35 cheaper than Maria Otter. I just happen to like English ales a lot, so use it for most of my beers. Regular 2-row is a cheaper, and viable alternative for many beer styles, though.

 

[odie]

oh I'm cheap...grain prices have gotten ridiculous. I buy in bulk as a result but even sack prices are getting crazy. But I brew often enough to make bulk grain storage worth the savings.

 

[bwible]

I go on different binges. It will be American ales for awhile, then German beers for awhile, then English ales for awhile, and the cycle starts over. I brew all kinds, just not so much Belgians.