Spice, Herb, or Vegetable Beer Bourbon Vanilla Porter (AG)

[smit70136]

Most beautiful smell filling the neighborhood right now. Love this!


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[DrinkNoH2O]

Whenever I brew this beer (about once a year) and do a Google search to re-read up on it this thread inevitably pops up and it always frustrates me.

The recipe in the original post is just wrong. The grain bill was always supposed to have 1.25 lbs. of chocolate malt, not 0.5 lbs. The OG is supposed to be 1.086, not 1.078. Denny's grain bill is scaled for a batch size of 5.0 gallons, not 5.5.

If anyone is ever looking for the original recipe straight from Denny it can be found here:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/de...mperial-porter-144612/index7.html#post3343995

 

[jigidyjim]

It's been a long time since I've read this thread, but I vaguely remember some notes about this not aging well...

I brewed mine in 2011. A few moves and a kid later, I found some homebrew in my garage last weekend... Including a few bottles of this. And it tastes amazing. Better than it did in 2011 (and better than 2012 when I entered it in a competition and got a ribbon).

One of the benefits of moving I guess is finding stuff like this

 

[bolus14]

I also posted in the forum that Denny replies to, but looking for some feedback on what others have tried for the bourbon in this.

Denny replied saying the JB Black seems to be the best tu use from others feedback, where Makers Mark stands out too much rather than blends with the porter.

What are some of your opinions? I currently have a whole bottle of MM, 3/4 of a bottle of JB Devil's Cut, and 1/2 a bottle of regular JD. Liek I stated in the other forum I would prefer to buy JB Black if that's what is needed to make this the best it can be, otherwise if others have tried multiple and believe they have had success with any of those three I'd like to hear opinions on that too.

 

[soupfist]

I also posted in the forum that Denny replies to, but looking for some feedback on what others have tried for the bourbon in this.

Denny replied saying the JB Black seems to be the best tu use from others feedback, where Makers Mark stands out too much rather than blends with the porter.

What are some of your opinions? I currently have a whole bottle of MM, 3/4 of a bottle of JB Devil's Cut, and 1/2 a bottle of regular JD. Liek I stated in the other forum I would prefer to buy JB Black if that's what is needed to make this the best it can be, otherwise if others have tried multiple and believe they have had success with any of those three I'd like to hear opinions on that too.

I intend to use Devil's Cut, just because it's what I have. Bought a bottle of it and thought it was quite nasty. At the quantity called for in the recipe, I doubt it matters much.

Brewed this yesterday...really excited, as this is my first ever "big beer." My fermenter is so happy it's already soiled itself. The sanitizer in my blow-off flask looks about the same color as the beer...

I'm using #1272 because the LHBS was out of practically everything else due to a shipment problem and I really wanted to brew this weekend. Hope that's not a mistake. I'm fermenting it low (60degF) to hopefully suppress the fruitiness.

 

[jtkratzer]

It's been a long time since I've read this thread, but I vaguely remember some notes about this not aging well...

I brewed mine in 2011. A few moves and a kid later, I found some homebrew in my garage last weekend... Including a few bottles of this. And it tastes amazing. Better than it did in 2011 (and better than 2012 when I entered it in a competition and got a ribbon).

One of the benefits of moving I guess is finding stuff like this

I have some that's been in a keg, under pretty constant temp, and constant temp and it's friggin amazing. Fantastic. I have some bottles that have not been cold since they were bottled and I'm curious how they are, but the stuff that's been cold since it went into the keg over two years ago is unbelievable.

I also posted in the forum that Denny replies to, but looking for some feedback on what others have tried for the bourbon in this.

Denny replied saying the JB Black seems to be the best tu use from others feedback, where Makers Mark stands out too much rather than blends with the porter.

What are some of your opinions? I currently have a whole bottle of MM, 3/4 of a bottle of JB Devil's Cut, and 1/2 a bottle of regular JD. Liek I stated in the other forum I would prefer to buy JB Black if that's what is needed to make this the best it can be, otherwise if others have tried multiple and believe they have had success with any of those three I'd like to hear opinions on that too.

I used Woodford Reserve in the only batch I've made. I'd be willing to try a more run of the mill product. Not that Woodford is exceedingly expensive, but it's probably overkill for the intent of the bourbon here.

 

[bolus14]

Grabbed a hydro sample this weekend and mine is still sitting at 1.020 so it doesn't look like it's dropping anymore whihc is a good thing. Since it hit that in about 3 -4 days I was worried I was going to lose the malty sweetness in this. The sample tastes pretty good, more chocolate like than anything else with a little roast in the after taste.

Need to get my vanilla beans in now, debating between 1 or 2 whole beans, I have used 8 out of 10 on other beers and these beans carry quite a kick and have been taking a lot of time to mellow out so I'm leaning more towards 1 bean.

For the bourbon I'm going with some local stuff, McKenzie Bourbon, it's in the Finger Lakes of NY. I'm not a bourbon aficionado so I read some online reviews and most rate this pretty well. It doesn't have much of a burn like I get with MM and it comes across very smooth mouth feel wise. I actually pick up caramel and toffee notes which I rarely am able to in bourbon's, it also has a slight hint of orange peel in the back. Main reason I decided on this is my father-in-law has it and doesn't care for it and because after tasting MM, JD, McKenzie's, and JB Devil's Cut I actually like the McKenzie's the most.

 

[BrianP728]

Just brewed this a few weeks ago and bottled today. Had an og of 1084 and fg of 1024. This gives me the same abv as the recipe but I feel like it should have fermented atad bit more. Anyone have any thought?

 

[LLBeanJ]

Agreed. Your numbers give you an apparent attenuation of 71%. If you went with WLP001 per the recipe, I would have expected about 75% AA, which would put FG around 1.020.

A few questions...

1) What yeast did you use? If liquid, did you make a starter or pitch 2 vials? If dry, did you rehydrate first?
2) Did you oxygenate the wort prior to pitching?
3) How well did you control your mash temps?

 

[BrianP728]

71% is what I calculated as well.

1) What yeast did you use? If liquid, did you make a starter or pitch 2 vials? If dry, did you rehydrate first?I used whitelabs American Ale blend yeast. I pitched two vials in the wort.
2) Did you oxygenate the wort prior to pitching? yes oxygenated the wort.
3) How well did you control your mash temps?the temp was kept within 2 degrees. around 68. This is the lower end of the range I believe. This is where the problem might be

 

[LLBeanJ]

3) How well did you control your mash temps? the temp was kept within 2 degrees. around 68. This is the lower end of the range I believe. This is where the problem might be

68?

Is that 68°C (154°F) mash temp? Or is that 68°F ferm temp?

 

[BrianP728]

68?

Is that 68°C (154°F) mash temp? Or is that 68°F ferm temp?

Sorry, mash temp was all over the place. 68°F is the ferm temp. I had to do my pale malt as DME light and then all other grains were BIAB in the pot. the middle of the grains i have no idea what the temp was, surrounding water was in the 152 range, so I assume the middle of the grains was much above that.

How would the mash temp effect the outcome other than being too low and not extracting the sugar, or being too high and extracting tannins?

 

[bolus14]

Higher mash temps give you less fermentable sugars, lower give you more sugars. Having less fermentable sugars leads to higher FG and usually more body to the beer. More sugars means lower FG and a dryer finished beer.

The yeast strain plays a role in the FG as some attenuate more than others, so you can get varying FG's depending on the yeast used.

 

[arborman]

Hey Guys....

Gonna brew this up this weekend, and looks like I need a massive starter... 4L starter, according to yeastcalc.. Is that too large to do in one step? I don't really have the time to make a 2 step and be able to brew this weekend, so I would have to push it off to next weekend.. Got the hall pass to brew this weekend, but don't want to rush it with rushed starter

 

[arborman]

Hey Guys....

Gonna brew this up this weekend, and looks like I need a massive starter... 4L starter, according to yeastcalc.. Is that too large to do in one step? I don't really have the time to make a 2 step and be able to brew this weekend, so I would have to push it off to next weekend.. Got the hall pass to brew this weekend, but don't want to rush it with rushed starter

 

[BrewCityBaller]

Hey Guys....

Gonna brew this up this weekend, and looks like I need a massive starter... 4L starter, according to yeastcalc.. Is that too large to do in one step? I don't really have the time to make a 2 step and be able to brew this weekend, so I would have to push it off to next weekend.. Got the hall pass to brew this weekend, but don't want to rush it with rushed starter

I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>

Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?

 

[bunt1828]

You can always brew it over the weekend and just wait to pitch until the starter is ready.. I've started doing this more frequently this summer since the ground water in houston is too hot to chill much below 90F, so I've been placing the batches in my ferm chamber and waiting for 12-24 hours until the temp drops all the way before I pitch. Sometimes I forget or am too busy and it goes a few days before I get the starter added. So far no issues...

 

[arborman]

I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>



Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?

Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday



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[arborman]

I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>



Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?

Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday View attachment 231371





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[arborman]

I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>



Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?

Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday View attachment 231371














Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[LLBeanJ]

Sorry, mash temp was all over the place. 68°F is the ferm temp. I had to do my pale malt as DME light and then all other grains were BIAB in the pot. the middle of the grains i have no idea what the temp was, surrounding water was in the 152 range, so I assume the middle of the grains was much above that.

How would the mash temp effect the outcome other than being too low and not extracting the sugar, or being too high and extracting tannins?

As others have stated, mash temp directly affects the fermentability of the wort and, therefore, FG. Lower mash temps will result in lower FG and vice versa.

I think your issue is a result of a couple of things:

1) Partial mash. It's not uncommon for extract to result in a higher FG than expected. Since you brewed this as a partial mash with a high percentage of extract, I would speculate that the extract is mostly responsible for the high FG. Next time, try replacing some of the extract with table or corn sugar to help lower the FG;

2) Mash temp too high. Granted, the partial mash results in a much lower grain bill than you'd have if it were an all-grain batch, so the mash temp will have less of an affect on the FG than it would if it were all-grain, but it will have some affect nonetheless. Also, unless you added some pale malt to the mash, the Munich is the only base malt you have there. Munich is not very high in diastatic power, but it is high enough to self-convert and convert other grains as well; it may just take longer than 60 minutes. Fortunately, the higher mash temp would have aided in the conversion process. Regardless, I would think that whatever sugars you did get from the mash were probably less fermentable than they would have been if you better controlled the mash temp and held it to around 150° for, say, 90 minutes. The lower temp would produce a more fermentable wort and the longer mash would ensure full conversion of the starches.

 

[BrewCityBaller]

Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday View attachment 231371
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Wow I am genuinely impressed! That thing is huge. Okay, I take it all back. Good on you hahaha

 

[bunt1828]

What stir plate do you have? Does it have any trouble with the 6L? Mine just crapped out so I'm in the market and 2L is no longer adequate..

 

[arborman]

What stir plate do you have? Does it have any trouble with the 6L? Mine just crapped out so I'm in the market and 2L is no longer adequate..

I have the "stirstarter", which you can get off ebay. Cant remember the cost, but do remember it was pretty cheap. Works great with this flask. Have not had any issues, and have done at least 15 starters with this flask

 

[arborman]

Got a mash question: I am doing this tomorrow, but all of a sudden just realized I may be really tight on mash room. I have a 15 gallon cooler, and looks like I will be at 14 gallon capacity, which could be really, really close to overfilling. I am doing 1.25 qt/lb, and wondering how this would work if I went 1qt/lb and did more on my sparge? I would def have to sparge in two steps to make this work

 

[LLBeanJ]

Got a mash question: ...

Other than being a bit on the thick side, it should be okay.

 

[Hub151]

It is really really good


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[Orrin1988]

So I am about to try my first All-Grain Batch and this is the recipe I am doing first (Big first AG beer, I know). I've already bought the ingredients and I have the starter going now. My brew day is Sunday.

I did have an idea that I am sure someone else has had before, but I didn't see anyone from the pages I have read on this thread mention it (I haven't read all 69 pages, but I did read 10+ pages).

My idea was to go ahead and get the vanilla beans cut up and scraped up now, thrown into about 10 oz of bourbon and left there to soak until my beer is ready to be thrown into secondary with the vanilla beans that have been soaking in the bourbon, as well as the bourbon itself.

Am I thinking wisely here or am I missing something in my logic?

 

[LLBeanJ]

That'll work fine.

I do something similar. I don't bother with secondary, so instead I soak the vanilla beans in an ounce or so of bourbon for a few weeks. At the same in another container time I soak the oak chips in the remainder of the bourbon for 3-4 weeks, which will extract the oak flavor from the chips. Once ready to transfer from primary to keg (or bottling bucket), first strain the vanilla solids and oak from the bourbon and add the bourbon to the keg, then transfer the beer over the top.

Lots of ways to skin this cat.

 

[BrewCityBaller]

So I am about to try my first All-Grain Batch and this is the recipe I am doing first (Big first AG beer, I know). I've already bought the ingredients and I have the starter going now. My brew day is Sunday.

I did have an idea that I am sure someone else has had before, but I didn't see anyone from the pages I have read on this thread mention it (I haven't read all 69 pages, but I did read 10+ pages).

My idea was to go ahead and get the vanilla beans cut up and scraped up now, thrown into about 10 oz of bourbon and left there to soak until my beer is ready to be thrown into secondary with the vanilla beans that have been soaking in the bourbon, as well as the bourbon itself.

Am I thinking wisely here or am I missing something in my logic?

Yup, you're thinking wisely! I did the exact same thing. Cut and scraped my beans and put them in about 60% total of the bourbon volume for the entire duration of the primary. Then added the bean/bourbon combo and the rest of my bourbon in the secondary. Turned out fantastic!