Spice, Herb, or Vegetable Beer Bourbon Vanilla Porter (AG)

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Did this as an extract using WL001 (not set up for starter yet so just pitched as is) and WOW am I glad I glad I decided to get blowoff tubes! The wife is also very happy about that. Do have a question. I am soaking 4 oz of oak chips and 2 vanilla beans in Woodford (1 1/4 C roughly) and was going to toss it in the secondary after about 7 days. Should I only put half the oak chips in and add a little bourbon at bottling, or just throw it all in? I don't want to overpower with oak and was originally going to do secondary for two weeks, but now I'm worried that two weeks will be too long. I know this is very subjective based on personal taste, but just looking for opinions....maybe do half the oak chips and vanilla beans for a week and then taste? Also worried about contamination.


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I have made this twice now, my first was the best beer I have made so far (got a 42 and 38 in competition with it) but I do not get the FG that is shown, both times I have started at 1.080/1.078 and ended at 1.024. Still tastes great and rich (in fact I probably like it more at this FG than if it finished at 1.018). Both times I used WLP001 and either reused fresh slurry or a big starter, I get great fermentation and I slowly ramp up temps to finish my yeast out in the temp chamber. (so I can't see it dropping out prematurely).

I use Denny's 1.25 choc malt version with no simple sugar and I am hitting between 152-154 mash temps. I normally do not have attenuation problems--in fact, I just used 001 (not the same pitch) to get an IPA from 1.067 to 1.009 a month beforehand.

Here is the recipe I used both times: http://www.brew365.com/beer_dennys_bourbon_vanilla_porter.php

Any thoughts?
 
I made a ginger beer a while back, and used vodka to sanitize the ginger before it was added to the secondary... So I'm wondering, what do you do to sanitize the vanilla before having the Porter racked onto it?
 
I just bottled a very similar recipe the other day. I split the batch and put 2 oz ok light oak chips soaked in makers mark for 2 weeks. I don't notice a difference between the 2. Hope that helps.


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Finally got around to bottling this one after spending 9 weeks in primary. Hatched 13 chickens right after I brewed this beer, and was raising them in the garage (in a large brooder, not running all over the place - :) ), and there was a bit too much dust and feathers for me to want to bottle beer. They are outside now, and the garage is again clean enough to brew and bottle.

Anyway - the beer tasted good before the addition of vanilla and bourbon, and was very good after I added 2 ounces of a good vanilla extract, and 8 ounces of 7 Devils Bourbon (by Koenig - a local place that also makes wine and vodka). I was not sure how I would like the taste of bourbon in the beer, so I added both the vanilla and bourbon slowly until I got something I liked and would want to drink. Looking forward to drinking this one.
 
Just cracked my first beer after a month and 6 days in the bottle. Not going to say it is my best beer yet, but it is definitely my most complex and interesting beer to date, with many layers of well balanced flavors. I think that with a bit more time in the bottle that this will be one of my favorite brews, and one that I will do again.
 
I have one bottle left from a batch that I made two and half years ago. I gave 1L bottles of this beer to every guy at my wedding rehearsal dinner, and now everyone thinks I'm a master brewer. I'm making another batch this weekend and I can guarantee it won't last more than a year this time.
 
I would like to try this as my second all grain batch (first being a SMASH) but I have one question I can't seem to understand. I noticed mentions of a 90 minute + boil. Why would this be neccessary? Is there more proteins to boil off? Also doing a 90 minute boil would the first hop addition be at the 90 or at 60 still? Sorry I am relatively new and my book How to Brew really isnt explaining much in the way of variable boil times.
Thank you in advance!
 
I noticed mentions of a 90 minute + boil. Why would this be neccessary? Is there more proteins to boil off? Also doing a 90 minute boil would the first hop addition be at the 90 or at 60 still?

From the original post:
"A note on the volumes. This is a big grain bill and requires you to sparge more than normal. You will collect much more wort and will also have to boil for longer (90-120 mins). If you don't, then your efficiency and OG will be low."

With that said, I have no problem collecting just the amount of wort needed to hit the OG with my setup, so if you can too, then you can make the adjustments needed with water volume to go with a 60 min boil. Also, the first hop addition is at 60 min whether you do a 60 or 90 min boil.
 
My brother-in-law and I are going to try this one next weekend. I have made a few wines so I have fermenters and carboys and such, but this will be our first beer. My neighbor is a frequent brewer so he is letting us borrow his mill, keggle, and supervising the boil.

We plan on making two 6 gallon batches using Denny's recipe (with the additional chocolate malt), one batch sticking to the directions and one batch we were going to try to go for a creamier, thicker mouthfeel.

Would we do that with lactose, or something like oats? And if so, how much and when does it get added?

Thanks!
 
Lactose will add creaminess, but also make it sweeter. I think I'd do it with flaked oats. Substitute flaked oats for some of the base malt so that the oats make up about 10% of the total grain bill. They go in the mash with the rest of the grains. No need to mill them. You can also mash at a higher temp to increase mouthfeel. Maybe go with the oats and try mashing at 154. Those combined will give you a little bit of a different beer.

I just looked back at the recipe and realized there's already flaked barley present. I'd probably remove it completely and then add in 10% flaked oats.
 
Ah, I had not thought about the added sweetness from the lactose. The oats and brewing at 154 instead of 153 sounds easy enough. Thanks! I look forward to being able to compare the two batches when they are done.

Thanks!
 
I just wanted to say thanks for the help I hit the og in the nose in a 60 minute boil and the beer smells delicious. Looking forward to the finished product!
 
One more question. I thought I was good! I pitched the wyeast packet about 20 hours after popping it. After pitching I noticed the packet said good to og 1.060. Should I go buy a second pack and pitch?
 
Should I go buy a second pack and pitch?

Maybe. Assuming your brew is at the recipe OG of 1.078, you definitely underpitched with only one pack of yeast. I'd say if there are no signs of active fermentation showing yet, then it would be beneficial to pitch another pack as soon as you can. Once active fermentation begins, the window of opportunity for adding more yeast is pretty much closed and you just have to accept the outcome.

As a general rule, if you're using liquid yeast you should be making starters or pitching multiple packs. I would completely ignore the instructions stating that one pack is good for 5 gals of <1.060 wort. This is simply not true. Yes, it will result in beer, but if you want the best beer possible, you'll need quite a bit more yeast than what you will get in one pack. Since starters are much less expensive than yeast, economically, it makes more sense to buy one pack/vial of yeast and make a starter. In addition to growing the yeast colony to the proper size for pitching, starters tell you that your yeast is viable. And, since you have no idea what environmental conditions your yeast has been subjected to prior to landing in your possession, this is no trivial assurance, as it is not unheard of to buy a new pack/vial of liquid yeast only to find out after pitching that the cells are no longer viable.

I use this calculator to determine yeast viability and plan my starters.
 
A note on the volumes. This is a big grain bill and requires you to sparge more than normal. You will collect much more wort and will also have to boil for longer (90-120 mins). If you don't, then your efficiency and OG will be low.





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Brewing this up today, getting ready for the winter.

ImageUploadedByHome Brew1407687050.911957.jpg


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It looks like I was able to save it. I pitched another pack of yeast about 12 hours after the first and last night about another 12 hours later it was bubbling away. Time to sit back relax and let the easy part take place. Thanks again!
 
ImageUploadedByHome Brew1408315715.499861.jpg
Most beautiful smell filling the neighborhood right now. Love this!


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Whenever I brew this beer (about once a year) and do a Google search to re-read up on it this thread inevitably pops up and it always frustrates me.

The recipe in the original post is just wrong. The grain bill was always supposed to have 1.25 lbs. of chocolate malt, not 0.5 lbs. The OG is supposed to be 1.086, not 1.078. Denny's grain bill is scaled for a batch size of 5.0 gallons, not 5.5.

If anyone is ever looking for the original recipe straight from Denny it can be found here:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f14/de...mperial-porter-144612/index7.html#post3343995
 
It's been a long time since I've read this thread, but I vaguely remember some notes about this not aging well...

I brewed mine in 2011. A few moves and a kid later, I found some homebrew in my garage last weekend... Including a few bottles of this. And it tastes amazing. Better than it did in 2011 (and better than 2012 when I entered it in a competition and got a ribbon).

One of the benefits of moving I guess is finding stuff like this :)
 
I also posted in the forum that Denny replies to, but looking for some feedback on what others have tried for the bourbon in this.

Denny replied saying the JB Black seems to be the best tu use from others feedback, where Makers Mark stands out too much rather than blends with the porter.

What are some of your opinions? I currently have a whole bottle of MM, 3/4 of a bottle of JB Devil's Cut, and 1/2 a bottle of regular JD. Liek I stated in the other forum I would prefer to buy JB Black if that's what is needed to make this the best it can be, otherwise if others have tried multiple and believe they have had success with any of those three I'd like to hear opinions on that too.
 
I also posted in the forum that Denny replies to, but looking for some feedback on what others have tried for the bourbon in this.

Denny replied saying the JB Black seems to be the best tu use from others feedback, where Makers Mark stands out too much rather than blends with the porter.

What are some of your opinions? I currently have a whole bottle of MM, 3/4 of a bottle of JB Devil's Cut, and 1/2 a bottle of regular JD. Liek I stated in the other forum I would prefer to buy JB Black if that's what is needed to make this the best it can be, otherwise if others have tried multiple and believe they have had success with any of those three I'd like to hear opinions on that too.

I intend to use Devil's Cut, just because it's what I have. Bought a bottle of it and thought it was quite nasty. At the quantity called for in the recipe, I doubt it matters much.

Brewed this yesterday...really excited, as this is my first ever "big beer." My fermenter is so happy it's already soiled itself. The sanitizer in my blow-off flask looks about the same color as the beer... :)

I'm using #1272 because the LHBS was out of practically everything else due to a shipment problem and I really wanted to brew this weekend. Hope that's not a mistake. I'm fermenting it low (60degF) to hopefully suppress the fruitiness.
 
It's been a long time since I've read this thread, but I vaguely remember some notes about this not aging well...

I brewed mine in 2011. A few moves and a kid later, I found some homebrew in my garage last weekend... Including a few bottles of this. And it tastes amazing. Better than it did in 2011 (and better than 2012 when I entered it in a competition and got a ribbon).

One of the benefits of moving I guess is finding stuff like this :)

I have some that's been in a keg, under pretty constant temp, and constant temp and it's friggin amazing. Fantastic. I have some bottles that have not been cold since they were bottled and I'm curious how they are, but the stuff that's been cold since it went into the keg over two years ago is unbelievable.

I also posted in the forum that Denny replies to, but looking for some feedback on what others have tried for the bourbon in this.

Denny replied saying the JB Black seems to be the best tu use from others feedback, where Makers Mark stands out too much rather than blends with the porter.

What are some of your opinions? I currently have a whole bottle of MM, 3/4 of a bottle of JB Devil's Cut, and 1/2 a bottle of regular JD. Liek I stated in the other forum I would prefer to buy JB Black if that's what is needed to make this the best it can be, otherwise if others have tried multiple and believe they have had success with any of those three I'd like to hear opinions on that too.

I used Woodford Reserve in the only batch I've made. I'd be willing to try a more run of the mill product. Not that Woodford is exceedingly expensive, but it's probably overkill for the intent of the bourbon here.
 
Grabbed a hydro sample this weekend and mine is still sitting at 1.020 so it doesn't look like it's dropping anymore whihc is a good thing. Since it hit that in about 3 -4 days I was worried I was going to lose the malty sweetness in this. The sample tastes pretty good, more chocolate like than anything else with a little roast in the after taste.

Need to get my vanilla beans in now, debating between 1 or 2 whole beans, I have used 8 out of 10 on other beers and these beans carry quite a kick and have been taking a lot of time to mellow out so I'm leaning more towards 1 bean.

For the bourbon I'm going with some local stuff, McKenzie Bourbon, it's in the Finger Lakes of NY. I'm not a bourbon aficionado so I read some online reviews and most rate this pretty well. It doesn't have much of a burn like I get with MM and it comes across very smooth mouth feel wise. I actually pick up caramel and toffee notes which I rarely am able to in bourbon's, it also has a slight hint of orange peel in the back. Main reason I decided on this is my father-in-law has it and doesn't care for it and because after tasting MM, JD, McKenzie's, and JB Devil's Cut I actually like the McKenzie's the most.
 
Just brewed this a few weeks ago and bottled today. Had an og of 1084 and fg of 1024. This gives me the same abv as the recipe but I feel like it should have fermented atad bit more. Anyone have any thought?
 
Agreed. Your numbers give you an apparent attenuation of 71%. If you went with WLP001 per the recipe, I would have expected about 75% AA, which would put FG around 1.020.

A few questions...

1) What yeast did you use? If liquid, did you make a starter or pitch 2 vials? If dry, did you rehydrate first?
2) Did you oxygenate the wort prior to pitching?
3) How well did you control your mash temps?
 
71% is what I calculated as well.

1) What yeast did you use? If liquid, did you make a starter or pitch 2 vials? If dry, did you rehydrate first?I used whitelabs American Ale blend yeast. I pitched two vials in the wort.
2) Did you oxygenate the wort prior to pitching? yes oxygenated the wort.
3) How well did you control your mash temps?the temp was kept within 2 degrees. around 68. This is the lower end of the range I believe. This is where the problem might be
 
68?

Is that 68°C (154°F) mash temp? Or is that 68°F ferm temp?

Sorry, mash temp was all over the place. 68°F is the ferm temp. I had to do my pale malt as DME light and then all other grains were BIAB in the pot. the middle of the grains i have no idea what the temp was, surrounding water was in the 152 range, so I assume the middle of the grains was much above that.

How would the mash temp effect the outcome other than being too low and not extracting the sugar, or being too high and extracting tannins?
 
Higher mash temps give you less fermentable sugars, lower give you more sugars. Having less fermentable sugars leads to higher FG and usually more body to the beer. More sugars means lower FG and a dryer finished beer.

The yeast strain plays a role in the FG as some attenuate more than others, so you can get varying FG's depending on the yeast used.
 
Hey Guys....

Gonna brew this up this weekend, and looks like I need a massive starter... 4L starter, according to yeastcalc.. Is that too large to do in one step? I don't really have the time to make a 2 step and be able to brew this weekend, so I would have to push it off to next weekend.. Got the hall pass to brew this weekend, but don't want to rush it with rushed starter
 
Hey Guys....

Gonna brew this up this weekend, and looks like I need a massive starter... 4L starter, according to yeastcalc.. Is that too large to do in one step? I don't really have the time to make a 2 step and be able to brew this weekend, so I would have to push it off to next weekend.. Got the hall pass to brew this weekend, but don't want to rush it with rushed starter
 
Hey Guys....

Gonna brew this up this weekend, and looks like I need a massive starter... 4L starter, according to yeastcalc.. Is that too large to do in one step? I don't really have the time to make a 2 step and be able to brew this weekend, so I would have to push it off to next weekend.. Got the hall pass to brew this weekend, but don't want to rush it with rushed starter

I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>

Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?
 
You can always brew it over the weekend and just wait to pitch until the starter is ready.. I've started doing this more frequently this summer since the ground water in houston is too hot to chill much below 90F, so I've been placing the batches in my ferm chamber and waiting for 12-24 hours until the temp drops all the way before I pitch. Sometimes I forget or am too busy and it goes a few days before I get the starter added. So far no issues...
 
I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>



Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?


Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday ImageUploadedByHome Brew1414161535.920423.jpg



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I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>



Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?


Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday View attachment 231371





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I think 4L will probably take too long to ferment out before the weekend, and I would be surprised if you had a 4L flask (assuming you have a stir plate)>



Could you buy another pack of yeast and then do a smaller starter with both?


Actually, my flask is close to 6L! It's awesome, got it from MoreBeer . Went with the starter, and this is it after 36 hours. Seems to have peaked, so I'll cold crash for brew day Sunday View attachment 231371














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