Bleach as sanitizer?

[PseudoChef]

EDIT: nm. dfdfdfdfdfdf

 

[jds]

If you dunk items in it, you will use a lot more... if you place a no rinse in a spray bottle to spray your equipment, you will use almost nothing.

QFT. Plus, that spray bottle is a really effective way to get iodophor into tubing without having to fight it to lay flat in a wallpaper tray. Plus, it's handy in the kitchen, too.

I beleive that you sir have just explained my overusage! I feel like a moron lol.

Nope, it's a trick everybody learns. I usually mix a half-gallon of iodophor on brewday, which I first use to sanitize a carboy. Then, some goes into a pan ot tray for sanitizing utensils, and the rest goes into a spray bottle. One brewday, 1.5 ml of iodophor used. Easy Peasy.

I'll admit it.

I'm a bleacher.

Never overly concerned with exact concentrations because I rinse everything under 135 degree tap water.

Bleach still has its place in my process, too. Every now and then, I think it's a good idea to really nuke everything (except stainless stuff) with a strong bleach solution (especially buckets). Afterward, I rinse well, then use as normal.

When I first started brewing, most home brewers used bleach, and rinsed well. The paranoid rinsed with boiled water. I always used tapwater, and didn't have a problem. Honestly, the reason I switched to iodophor was purely for the convenience of having a no-rinse sanitizer.

 

[BierMuncher]

True, but how many GALLONS of mixture do you make for a brew day? If you make 3 gallons to my one quart, you are using 12x as much solution as I am.

I don't mix up a batch for brew day. I always have the right side of this sink filled with a mild bleach/dawn solution. All my utensils, hops bags, racking canes, etc... get dropped in here for an indefinite soak. When I get around to it, I remove, hot rinse and let drip dry.

Now and again I'll drop a fresh splash of bleach in and usually drain and refresh once a week or so.

Gotta remember I'm in my brewshop every night and most Saturdays and Sundays. I've always got some beer chores to do down there whilst watching some sports and sampling the wares. A constant pool of sanitizer is just more convenient.

 

[ArcaneXor]

That looks like what this guy is talking about.

1oz Bleach
1oz Vinegar
5gal water

I'll have to give this a shot next bottling, would effectively cut my water usage down to a mere five gallons, instead of five gallons plus whatever I end up using on rinsing.

Don't kill yourself!

 

[pizzaman]

I don't mix up a batch for brew day. I always have the right side of this sink filled with a mild bleach/dawn solution...

/me druels at BierMunchers' setup.

 

[EoinMag]

There is no danger once you add one of the reagents to the water and then add the other, just don't mix bleach and vinegar together.

I'm not sure if it does release chlorine, but it's never advised to mix straight bleach with anything stronger than water.

I've also used this solution over two days in a large bucket, although someone on here say's that the half life is not good, I think it'll work a few days.

 

[NewBrew75]

I hear that Star San is good as long as the PH is less than 3.5, how do you test for the PH? Just ordinary litmus tests?

 

[Sucram]

OMG! DO NOT MIX VINEGAR AND BLEACH UNLESS YOU KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOUR DOING!! Listen to the brewing network Brew-Strong podcast on sanitation. If you lower the PH too much, the solution will release chlorine gas. You will die.

 

[EoinMag]

OMG! DO NOT MIX VINEGAR AND BLEACH UNLESS YOU KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOUR DOING!! Listen to the brewing network Brew-Strong podcast on sanitation. If you lower the PH too much, the solution will release chlorine gas. You will die.

Mild bleach, kitchen vinegar, 30ml:30ml in 20l of water, that's exactly how to do it, mix the bleach to the water then add the vinegar, do not mix vinegar and bleach neat.
If it scares you, then don't do it.

 

[Bigsnake]

Bleach is DEFINATELY NOT no-rinse. You want to rinse it well or your brews will be nasty. The dilution rate is something that eludes me now, something along the lines of a tablespoon or so per 5 gallons water.

I use StarSan, mix it up, place it in a spray bottle and you will use like 1/2 quart of mixed solution per session... it is CHEAP!

I agree. I mix up StarSan 1 gallon at a time in a glass jug with distilled water. When it's time to brew I test the pH to make sure it's still good and pour some in a spray bottle to spray everything down. At most I probably use 1/2 gallon a brew session if I pour a bunch in a fermenter to slosh around.

 

[pizzaman]

What is everyone using to test PH? Is it those paper strips I used to use in chemistry lab? do most hbs sell these?

 

[flyangler18]

Bleach still has its place in my process, too. Every now and then, I think it's a good idea to really nuke everything (except stainless stuff) with a strong bleach solution (especially buckets). Afterward, I rinse well, then use as normal.

Yes sir! This is exactly what I do, usually once a month. Iodophor is cheap from the local Tractor Supply, something like $8/gallon. Star San is my first choice, and I've had the same batch mixed up for about 3 months now. The key is using distilled water.

 

[Bigsnake]

What is everyone using to test PH? Is it those paper strips I used to use in chemistry lab? do most hbs sell these?

I just use the pH paper strips you can purchase at HBS.

I always wanted an electronic pH meter but unless I'm using it a lot and have the spare change, I don't think they're really worth it. Plus the probes wear out and have to be replaced. Save those for working in a lab.

 

[HP_Lovecraft]

OMG! DO NOT MIX VINEGAR AND BLEACH UNLESS YOU KNOW EXACTLY WHAT YOUR DOING!!

It was the owner of Starsan that said that adding a SMALL AMOUNT of vinegar and bleach seperatly to water adjusts its PH, and dramatically increases its sanitizing potential.

So much that it would be possible to use such a dilluted batch as to not require rinsing. Thats a pretty big deal, since when I started homebrewing 15 years ago, I was one of those paranoid types that used bleach, then rinsed with boiled (or bottled) water.

But since I've discovered Starsan, I really do not care. I'll use bleach or oxiclean as cleaners, rinse completely, then just use starsan on everything. Love the foam. Starsan seems pricey, but I mostly use it in spray bottles, so a little lasts me months and months.

 

[TallyMaltyAle]

If you are too cheap to buy iodophor or Starsan you can use bleach but it is not a no-rinse sanitiser. Bleach also takes longer to work so you need a much longer contact time than iodine products. A small bottle of iodophor lasts a long time, doesn't cost all that much, is very fast acting and can be mixed as a no-rinse solution. I do use bleach for cleaning glass carboys. A couple of ounces and fill with water followed by just letting them soak. It's easy and low maintenance but I still rinse the hell out of them afterwards and then use iodophor to sanitize before using. It's up to you but to me the advantages of modern sanitizing products have it all over bleach.

How long do you let your carboys soak? Additionally, is there a time limit on letting a better bottle/bottling bucket soak in bleach?

Thanks,

 

[Braufessor]

+1 to listening to this podcast:

03-29-07 Basic Brewing Radio - Sanitizing with Bleach and Star San ...
http://itunes.apple.com/au/podcast/basic-brewing-radio/id75092679

Just search it out on itunes or google.

Personally, I have used every sanitizer and cleaner out there. For the life of me, I can't understand why someone would want to use anything other than starsan. It is so easy and effective. It has to be one of the cheapest aspects of brewing, and it also happens to be the most critical. It is far easier to make mistakes and have problems with bleach than with starsan. Plus, if you ruin just one batch of beer with bleach, you lose about 5 years worth of the $ you were trying to save in the first place.

 

[Braufessor]

pH strips - I use these:

http://www.capitolscientific.com/estylez_item.aspx?item=PH1160-2

Not as good as a meter, but a lot better than the paper ones.

 

[Glynn]

I've been using bleach as a sanitizer since 93 with no problems. I give all my glass carboys, racking canes, hose and bottles a good 5 min soaking then let them air dry. I also use iodophor as well. I prefer to use bleach on my hose only because iodophor turns them orange.

 

[AndyInSoCalif]

Ive heard there are people who use bleach as sanitizer out there, and im sick of paying for iodophor! Does this stuff really work? How do i use it? And is it safe for consumption no-rinse? Also wondering if itd make sense to store my carboys full of bleach water?

- I've used bleach for 30 years with excellent results.

I use a glass measuring cup and pour the bleach between the 1/4 cup and 1/3 cup lines. It does not have to be precise. Get it between those lines, and you will have it right.

Pour this into a 5 gallon fermenting bucket then start filling the bucket with tap water. Swirl the water with your plastic mixing spoon. When it's almost full, sink everything you want to sterilize into this bucket. Top it up all the way to the very tip top with water. Then gently swirl some more.

Let it sit for 40 minutes, then pour the water out. Have a freshly opened new jug of spring water ( I use Walmart's) and pour a cup or two into the bucket. Swirl it around and dump out. Do that again and your good to go.

When it comes time to bottle your beer, wash them (I use my dishwasher), then sink them into the bucket for 40 minutes. If you have two 5 gallon buckets, you can sanitize a lot of bottles all at once. Rinse twice with 2 tablespoons of fresh spring water in each bottle and you're good to go. You'll save money on sanitizer and it works every time with no off flavors.

- Don't store your carboys full of bleach water. Just clean them well and cover the top with saran wrap and a rubber band after they are dry to keep dust and bugs out until you're ready to use them again. Wash and sanitize as stated above before use.

 

[rbenn]

I also used bleach due to the cheap price. I never rinsed it, I just made sure there was no liquid left and I haven't noticed any off flavors yet. However I just upgraded to star san and it seems to work very well. Star san does not cost very much if you use a spray bottle.

 

[porto88]

I used bleach for years as well, but I recently switched to starsan, its much easier. if you reuse it, you can save alot of money

 

[chicken]

I also used bleach for many years with no problems, but thought I'd give Star San a try to see if it worked any better. And I haven't looked back.

It's so much easier to use. You don't have to soak anything to sanitize --just get it wet, and after 30 seconds you're good to go. Use a spray bottle to spray things down, or dunk them in the Star San, or put just a little in a bucket or carboy and swirl it around. No rinsing, no need to let it dry. No worries if you splash some on your clothes (maybe I'm just clumsy, but I was always getting bleach spots on things).

No need to mix up a fresh solution each time. I mix up 2.5 gallons at a time with distilled water, put some in a spray bottle, and store the rest in plastic jugs. A little goes a long way, and even though I'm rather profligate in my use of it, and always spill some (did I mention I'm clumsy ), it lasts me awhile before I have to mix up more.

 

[Russ_G]

Concentration would be 1tsp per gallon. And yes, you need to rinse out unless you like the bleach aftertaste.

 

[Gzuufy]

Nice PDF on bleach use for sanitation in food processing

http://ucfoodsafety.ucdavis.edu/files/26437.pdf