BIAB Brewing (with pics)

[Mysticmead]

Ok let me throw in a monkey wrench. Could I buy one of those curtains you guys are making the bag out of and line my plastic cooler mash tun on top of the PVC filter that I already have in there? Best if both worlds? Put in full boil water volume. Could still sparge if you wanted to. Don't have to be concerned about burning the bag. Clean up still kinda easier. Would this work? Thoughts?


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you can even eliminate the PVC manifold. http://www.brewinabag.com/ has examples of just that.

 

[hoppybrewster]

you can even eliminate the PVC manifold. http://www.brewinabag.com/ has examples of just that.

Great looking bags. The only reason I was thinking of leaving the manifold in was to provide hundreds of exit points for the wort as opposed to one. Better efficiency? Don't know.



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[wilserbrewer]

Great looking bags. The only reason I was thinking of leaving the manifold in was to provide hundreds of exit points for the wort as opposed to one. Better efficiency? Don't know.

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The manifold is of no benefit if you are batch sparging, if fly sparging, the manifold will help prevent channeling.

 

[hoppybrewster]

Great looking bags. The only reason I was thinking of leaving the manifold in was to provide hundreds of exit points for the wort as opposed to one. Better efficiency? Don't know.



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So i bought one of the bags from that place for my cooler. I've read quite a bit in this thread. To dummy this down to make sure I understand. I heat up 1.25 qts water/Lb. of grain to 170 deg. Add water to cooler. As quick as possible stir in double crushed grains ensuring no doughy clumps. Close lid, mash for 60-90 min. Lift bag slowly from cooler, squeeze bag a bit. Open valve into brew pot, measure OG, begin boil.

 

[RM-MN]

So i bought one of the bags from that place for my cooler. I've read quite a bit in this thread. To dummy this down to make sure I understand. I heat up 1.25 qts water/Lb. of grain to 170 deg. Add water to cooler. As quick as possible stir in double crushed grains ensuring no doughy clumps. Close lid, mash for 60-90 min. Lift bag slowly from cooler, squeeze bag a bit. Open valve into brew pot, measure OG, begin boil.

I think you've missed a bit with your reading. Are you BIAB or just using a conventional tun with a bag installed instead of a manifold or braid? BIAB was designed for using the full volume of water right from the start, no sparging. Conventional tuns use a water ratio like the 1.2 qts/lb and then sparge to get the proper preboil volume. Somewhere you've crossed the two up.

 

[hoppybrewster]

I think you've missed a bit with your reading. Are you BIAB or just using a conventional tun with a bag installed instead of a manifold or braid? BIAB was designed for using the full volume of water right from the start, no sparging. Conventional tuns use a water ratio like the 1.2 qts/lb and then sparge to get the proper preboil volume. Somewhere you've crossed the two up.

Well I read somewhere I can use full water volume in the cooler instead of the boil pot. So everything that would be done in the brew pot is getting done in the cooler.

 

[RM-MN]

Well I read somewhere I can use full water volume in the cooler instead of the boil pot. So everything that would be done in the brew pot is getting done in the cooler.

You certainly can use all the water in the cooler as long as the cooler is big enough for the water plus grain. However, now you have a different water to grain ration and you have to calculate the temperature of the water plus the grain so you get the right temperature for the water. If you use 170 degree water with that setup your enzymes that you need to convert starches to sugars will be gone before you get the full conversion. I usually use water that is 160 to 162 when I use full volume. That should get me at 152 to 154 for my mash temperature. You might try that for starters and then adjust the temperature for your next brew based on what your mash temperature turns out to be. You can also change your time from the 60 to 90 minutes you posted to 30 to 60 as with your grains double milled your conversion will happen quicker.

 

[hoppybrewster]

You certainly can use all the water in the cooler as long as the cooler is big enough for the water plus grain. However, now you have a different water to grain ration and you have to calculate the temperature of the water plus the grain so you get the right temperature for the water. If you use 170 degree water with that setup your enzymes that you need to convert starches to sugars will be gone before you get the full conversion. I usually use water that is 160 to 162 when I use full volume. That should get me at 152 to 154 for my mash temperature. You might try that for starters and then adjust the temperature for your next brew based on what your mash temperature turns out to be. You can also change your time from the 60 to 90 minutes you posted to 30 to 60 as with your grains double milled your conversion will happen quicker.

Thanks for the help! really dont know what I'm doing, been extract for years. Can I use Beersmith or other calcs to get this right? (72 qt. cooler by the way)

 

[RM-MN]

Thanks for the help! really dont know what I'm doing, been extract for years. Can I use Beersmith or other calcs to get this right?

I haven't used Beersmith but from the questions being asked by others I'd say no at this point. For someone experienced it has a lot of features but it seems to be confusing for starters. I use the calculator here at TastyBrew to get my water temperature. http://www.tastybrew.com/calculators/infusion.html

I usually use something like 2.37 qts/lb in the grain to water ration section.

 

[hoppybrewster]

Thanks, more studying.

 

[lumpy5oh]

Just because you brew with a bag doesn't mean you are BIAB brewing.
BIAB is full volume, no sparge, single vessel brewing. No mash turns or HLT's required.
This thread and entire section needs to get back to that fact. I understand that using a bag can make things easier for multi vessel brewing; but you are not actually BIABing.

 

[chawn]

Just because you brew with a bag doesn't mean you are BIAB brewing.
BIAB is full volume, no sparge, single vessel brewing. No mash turns or HLT's required.
This thread and entire section needs to get back to that fact. I understand that using a bag can make things easier for multi vessel brewing; but you are not actually BIABing.

Live and let live. This thread has been a valuable resource to many by explaining different techniques using bag rather than a lot of expensive equipment. I think it's a great thread.

 

[copper2hopper]

This is what I call maximizing the squeeze!

 

[hoppybrewster]

Just because you brew with a bag doesn't mean you are BIAB brewing.
BIAB is full volume, no sparge, single vessel brewing. No mash turns or HLT's required.
This thread and entire section needs to get back to that fact. I understand that using a bag can make things easier for multi vessel brewing; but you are not actually BIABing.

Is the method I'm talking about above going to work?


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[lumpy5oh]

This thread has been a valuable resource to many by explaining different techniques using bag rather than a lot of expensive equipment.

Exactly. One kettle, one bag, one burner. Those who want to use bags in mash tuns are buying/using unnecessary equipment. If they are looking for help and guidance they are better off looking at the traditional AG threads. True BIAB is cheaper and easier and what I'm saying is that is what the focus of this section needs to be.

 

[lumpy5oh]

Is the method I'm talking about above going to work?


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Possibly. It's just that in true BIAB you don't need the cooler.
The burr under my saddle is the increasing discussions in the BIAB section of water to grain ratios and sparging and multiple vessels. The start of this thread is fantastic for beginners looking at BIAB, but I fear the extra info I mentioned could be confusing.

 

[eulipion2]

Possibly. It's just that in true BIAB you don't need the cooler.
The burr under my saddle is the increasing discussions in the BIAB section of water to grain ratios and sparging and multiple vessels. The start of this thread is fantastic for beginners looking at BIAB, but I fear the extra info I mentioned could be confusing.

Agreed. BIAB is single vessel, full-volume mash. For the longest time I even heated the grain and water together with great results. The only "enhancement" I've made was to fashion a bag press out of some plastic buckets because I really hate squeezing by hand.

 

[BrewinBromanite]

Not disagreeing, but there is more than one way to do BIAB. It doesn't necessarily have to be a single vessel full volume mash. I mash 10-12 lbs of grain at about 1.25 qts/lb, in a bag, in a 5 gal round cooler. Drain and squeeze into my 10.5 gal kettle. Batch/dunk sparge back in the cooler with enough water to reach pre-boil volume. Drain and squeeze and combine in kettle. Maybe it's a hybrid of sorts, but it's still essentially BIAB.


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[PackerfaninSanDiego]

View attachment 227652
This is what I call maximizing the squeeze!

I discovered this squeeze process during my last brew. I used the clamps only. Haven't had the time yet, but my plan is to somehow attach 2-2 x 6's to one clamp.

 

[lumpy5oh]

Not disagreeing, but there is more than one way to do BIAB. It doesn't necessarily have to be a single vessel full volume mash. I mash 10-12 lbs of grain at about 1.25 qts/lb, in a bag, in a 5 gal round cooler. Drain and squeeze into my 10.5 gal kettle. Batch/dunk sparge back in the cooler with enough water to reach pre-boil volume. Drain and squeeze and combine in kettle. Maybe it's a hybrid of sorts, but it's still essentially BIAB.


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Just curious do you heat your sparge water?
I think we could call your hybrid; Brewing With A Bag.
Granted if you are only using 2 vessels you are saving in equipment and space compared to full 3 vessel brewing; which is part of the beauty of Biab.
What I think some are missing is that in pure Biab you use the full volume of water you will need in the mash. The extra water rinses the grains just as sparging does.
A 90 min Biab full volume mash and a 60 min mash with a sparge really keep the grains in contact with water for approximately the same amount of time. I just think that doing the full volume route is simpler.
For those who do use the cooler set up; how do you regulate your mash temps? In using my brew kettle as the mash tun ( with a blanket wrapped around it) if my temp falls out of range I just add heat.

Using your current setup; I would suggest trying full volume. As long as the cooler can hold your mash temps; you may want to join the dark side of pure Biab.

 

[lumpy5oh]

Agreed. BIAB is single vessel, full-volume mash. For the longest time I even heated the grain and water together with great results. The only "enhancement" I've made was to fashion a bag press out of some plastic buckets because I really hate squeezing by hand.

I've read some on heating the grains with the water. I think I will try this next time.
I need to steal some of these squeeze techniques!

 

[MaxStout]

View attachment 227652
This is what I call maximizing the squeeze!

That just gave me a really cool idea. I have a bunch of these handscrews in my wood shop. I might have to attach some pieces of 3/4" plywood to the insides of the jaws on one to make a big bag-squeezin' press thingy.

 

[copper2hopper]

Do it! We did this again on our last brew day and forever will. It's so easy and saves time and the hands from burning. The grain absorption is practically nonexistent once finished.

 

[BrewinBromanite]

Just curious do you heat your sparge water?

>>. Yes. I heat the initial water in my 10.5 gal kettle, and add to the round cooler with grains in a bag. Drain and squeeze when done mashing into that kettle. Heat the remaining mash out water in my old 5 gal pot, and add that and the grain bag back into the cooler for the mash out. Drain and squeeze again after 10-15 mins. Combine volumes into the big kettle and commence boil.<<


I think we could call your hybrid; Brewing With A Bag.

>> Really all we are doing is "mashing in a bag," right? You do a full volume mash in a bag, I do it with a batch/dunk sparge step. Once you get your runnings, do you leave the bag in? I suppose you could add another clean bag to the kettle to catch the hops and other gunk during the boil, but I'm assuming most take the grain bag out after the mash and boil without another bag in the kettle. The fact that my mash is accomplished in 2 steps rather than a full volume doesn't negate that we are both simply mashing in a bag.<<

Granted if you are only using 2 vessels you are saving in equipment and space compared to full 3 vessel brewing; which is part of the beauty of Biab.

>> I started with extract, and have the old 5 gal pot laying around, which I use to heat the mash out water. So I guess I have a 3 vessel setup. 5 gal round cooler plus a 10.5 gal and a 5 gal pot.<<


What I think some are missing is that in pure Biab you use the full volume of water you will need in the mash. The extra water rinses the grains just as sparging does.
>> If it works and you like it, then great. I'm not going to argue whether BIAB is a purist technique to begin with. We are still simply mashing in a bag.<<

A 90 min Biab full volume mash and a 60 min mash with a sparge really keep the grains in contact with water for approximately the same amount of time. I just think that doing the full volume route is simpler.
>> I agree, it may be simpler for some, but my process is pretty simple, too. I, probably like some others, like the ability to control water to grain mash ratios. Does it matter much in the end in for a 5 gal batch?...I really don't know. I've read that there could be issues with ph with full volume, which I've never needed to mess with with my setup.<<

For those who do use the cooler set up; how do you regulate your mash temps? In using my brew kettle as the mash tun ( with a blanket wrapped around it) if my temp falls out of range I just add heat.
>>. Hmm. One of the benefits of an insulated cooler is that they hold their heat really well. It takes a little trial and error, and a calculator helps. It also helps in my setup if I preheat the cooler/MT. For example, if I add 165-170 deg water at dough-in, it will regulate down to my mash temp very quickly, and will hold it there for a good hour. It does the heat regulation for you.<<

Using your current setup; I would suggest trying full volume. As long as the cooler can hold your mash temps; you may want to join the dark side of pure Biab.
>> So, I could do a full volume in my 10.5 gal kettle (may try it out one day). I cannot do a full volume mash in my 5 gal cooler, though, hence the drain and batch sparge extra step. For me, the cooler holds mash temps wonderfully, and it frees me up for an hour to do other things. I don't have to worry about wrapping the kettle, or monitoring and adding heat among the way. Again - if it works for you and others, that's great and I'm not tying to convince anyone to do it otherwise. Maybe one day I'll try a full volume mash for the hell of it. I'm open to trying new things.<<

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[lumpy5oh]

BrewinBromanite
Excellent reply. Thank you.
I have a 15 gal pot and can see how your process allows you to do full 5 gal batches with a smaller kettle. I do pull the bag at the end of the mash and use smaller bags for my hops.
I questioned the cooler holding temps only because I have read a number of posts where people have had issues. Glad to hear yours seems to work wonderfully.
I am a pure Biab purist and a deciple of Pat Hollingdale. I need to remember sometimes that not everyone has the same setup and modifications need to be made.

 

[BrewinBromanite]

lumpy5oh - It is definitely one of the things about home-brewing that I love. There's so many ways to do it, and experimenting and finding what works and fun to do at the same time is why I do it! (Not to mention the obvious - great beer at the end!)

I do have a question for you full-volume mashers. I mentioned I've read about ph issues coming into play, requiring measuring and tweaking ph, water adjustments, etc. Do you find, from your experience, that ph is an issue with your full-volume mashes? Do you adjust for it?

I've always used ozarka spring water water (not distilled or R/O) jugs from the gas station down the street, and have never had any issues with flavor, so I've never bothered messing with it.


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[lumpy5oh]

In my experience I haven't had to do much with my water. I've used a couple of online calculators to look at my water initially. My tap water is perfect for stouts. I typically use half tap water and half R/O water with a little gypsum. My ph's have all been in range with that.

 

[Walzenbrew]

What's the best way to do this without a propane burner?

 

[wilserbrewer]

What's the best way to do this without a propane burner?

Many options, stove top, heatstick, electric element installed in kettle, induction burner, hot plate, wood fire, steam kettle, electric turkey fryer, large electric coffee urn, $$$braumiester$$$, $$$$blichmann boil coil$$$$.

Easiest is likely stovetop for smallish batches, or stovetop w/ heatstick for larger batches.

Best way, how big is your check book?

 

[Walzenbrew]

Many options, stove top, heatstick, electric element installed in kettle, induction burner, hot plate, wood fire, steam kettle, electric turkey fryer, large electric coffee urn, $$$braumiester$$$, $$$$blichmann boil coil$$$$.

Easiest is likely stovetop for smallish batches, or stovetop w/ heatstick for larger batches.

Best way, how big is your check book?

Not big. I have a keggle and propane burner i'll sell (probably get around $300). I definitely wnat to do full batches (5.5 gallons) and definitely want to do all grain (BIAB).

Ideally, i'd like to figure something out ahead of time so that I don't buy something and have to resell etc. That seems to be the brewer's dilemma