belgian wit stuck fermentation

[thomasben]

After 10 days fermentation is at 1.018, should I be concerned?

 

[jlaureanti]

what was the o.g?

 

[Native302]

Mine is stuck also. OG was 1.065 and I used a 2 L starter. After 9 days it was only 1.030! I'll never use that yeast again.

 

[bullinachinashop]

Extract batch?

What yeast?

 

[Native302]

Extract batch?

What yeast?

All grain, mashed low for 90 min, white labs Belgian Wit with a 2 L starter.

 

[bigbeergeek]

Wait another week, people often complain that this yeast takes its time. Did you have a high % of adjunct in there (flaked grains)? If so, did you include any enzyme rich grains to compensate (6 row)? You could have had some residual unfermentable sugars survive the long low mash, in which case a couple of teaspoons of amylase will save the batch. Austin homebrew has it for cheap.

 

[MNDan]

What yeast did you use? WLP400 takes forever. I prefer WLP410.

 

[paraordnance]

WLP400 will take at least 12-14 days to complete job, dont rush it

 

[Calder]

What yeast, what temp, what OG, what ingredients, etc. Can't help without information.

 

[thomasben]

What yeast, what temp, what OG, what ingredients, etc. Can't help without information.

3944 wyeast, 72 ferment all grain 1.050

 

[bullinachinashop]

I make a Belgin Wit 6-8 times a year. I will typically use a Wlp400 vial for the first batch and then wash or re-use the yeast for all the additional batches.

I brew AG and my OG is +/- 1.048.

The recipe is basically 50% 2 row, 40% flaked wheat, 10% wheat malt.

The beer typically attenuates down to +/-1.008 in 10 days @ 65-68 degrees. Warmer if I want more esters.

So, that being said, it sounds like your yeast are being lazy and or are unhealthy.

At this point, I'd give the fermentor a good swirl every day for 2-3 days and warm it up a couple of degrees. They'll finish the job and the swirling of the fermentor will break up the floating krausen and let it settle out.

I love this style because I can go from grain to glass in under 2 weeks.

Bull

 

[thomasben]

I make a Belgin Wit 6-8 times a year. I will typically use a Wlp400 vial for the first batch and then wash or re-use the yeast for all the additional batches.

I brew AG and my OG is +/- 1.048.

The recipe is basically 50% 2 row, 40% flaked wheat, 10% wheat malt.

The beer typically attenuates down to +/-1.008 in 10 days @ 65-68 degrees. Warmer if I want more esters.

So, that being said, it sounds like your yeast are being lazy and or are unhealthy.

At this point, I'd give the fermentor a good swirl every day for 2-3 days and warm it up a couple of degrees. They'll finish the job and the swirling of the fermentor will break up the floating krausen and let it settle out.

I love this style because I can go from grain to glass in under 2 weeks.

Bull

Won't shaking it up create off flavors? Also their is no krausen and the yeast is healthy because I made a starter...it was rapidly fermenting within two hours!

 

[AmandaK]

Won't shaking it up create off flavors?

No. Rouse the yeast, warm it up a bit. Report back. Cheers!

 

[thomasben]

I've always been worried about swirling fermented wort...

 

[Calder]

I've always been worried about swirling fermented wort...

Use a racking cane to gently rouse the yeast.

 

[lou2row]

I don't think they mean swirl like aerating. Just swirl it lightly to loosen up the yeast cake on the bottom. I did that to keep mine working. I think I read it on white labs site for a belgian yeast to do this from several posters.

 

[thomasben]

Use a racking cane to gently rouse the yeast.

How would you do exactly?

 

[bullinachinashop]

You can actually pick up the fermentor and give it a big swirl for a couple of minutes. The gas in the head space is co2 so it won't cause any oxydation and then you don't have to open it up to outside contaminates. If you've already been messing with your beer numerous times, then as stated earlier, just stir gently for a couple of minutes with a sanitized spoon or racking cane.

BTW, just because you made a starter, doesn't mean you have healty yeast. Did you feed it and aerate it? What was the gravity of the starter wort? Did you aerate you wort before pitching?

The reason I question the health of the yeast is because when I use the Belgin Wit yeast, after 10 days I could float a dime on the 1.5-2 inches of dense Krausen. I either swirl and let it flock out or if I have time, I just forget about it for a few more weeks.

Good luck
Bull

 

[thomasben]

You can actually pick up the fermentor and give it a big swirl for a couple of minutes. The gas in the head space is co2 so it won't cause any oxydation and then you don't have to open it up to outside contaminates. If you've already been messing with your beer numerous times, then as stated earlier, just stir gently for a couple of minutes with a sanitized spoon or racking cane.

BTW, just because you made a starter, doesn't mean you have healty yeast. Did you feed it and aerate it? What was the gravity of the starter wort? Did you aerate you wort before pitching?

The reason I question the health of the yeast is because when I use the Belgin Wit yeast, after 10 days I could float a dime on the 1.5-2 inches of dense Krausen. I either swirl and let it flock out or if I have time, I just forget about it for a few more weeks.

Good luck
Bull

Ya I made a starter of 1.038, did intermittent shaking every chance I got. Cold crashed it after two days and decanted the wort and pitched the slurry

 

[bullinachinashop]

Sound good, did you let it warm up to pitching temp before you pitched? As I said earlier, you may just have some lazy or stressed yeast. The good thing about that is that in this style of beer, some of the banana/clove easters created by stressed yeast are in the style guidelines.

 

[petep1980]

3944 wyeast, 72 ferment all grain 1.050

I used this yeast about two weeks ago, mashed @ 151F, used a .5L stir starter and it went from 1.041 to 1.012, but I think it took 7 days.

That was one of my more sluggish ferments.

 

[jlaureanti]

Ya I made a starter of 1.038, did intermittent shaking every chance I got. Cold crashed it after two days and decanted the wort and pitched the slurry

You cold crashed a starter??? Why would anyone do that? IMO, the goal of a starter is, one - to take a small amount of yeast and amplify them to a higher quantity and two - to introduce that now higher quantity of yeast in an active state and not a dormant state. When you crash cool, you kill some of your yeasties and you put them into a dormant state. Even when you warm them back up they are just awake not active. Which might describe the slow fermentation? Do you crash cool them often?

 

[thomasben]

You cold crashed a starter??? Why would anyone do that? IMO, the goal of a starter is, one - to take a small amount of yeast and amplify them to a higher quantity and two - to introduce that now higher quantity of yeast in an active state and not a dormant state. When you crash cool, you kill some of your yeasties and you put them into a dormant state. Even when you warm them back up they are just awake not active. Which might describe the slow fermentation? Do you crash cool them often?

I usually have let them almost ferment out then decanted the wort on top after letting the yeast settle and let it get to room temp before I pitch.

 

[jlaureanti]

and that works fine to increase the number of yeast cells in solution, but if you would like to increase fermentation rate, it is better to add yeast that has already started fermentation and is still fermenting when you pitch. There are four main stages in a yeast life cycle, lag, log, stationary and death. By adding yeast that has completed fermentation you have already went through the four stages and are restarting the process all over again. Which adds more time to your fermentation. If you add in yeast that is actively fermenting (wort in starter and all) to your fresh wort ready to ferment you are starting in the second stage (a healthy active stage)...

So what you are doing is fine and if it works for you thats awesome... But just so you know my last 3 fermentations have taken less than 6 days to reach my F.G.

 

[thomasben]

and that works fine to increase the number of yeast cells in solution, but if you would like to increase fermentation rate, it is better to add yeast that has already started fermentation and is still fermenting when you pitch. There are four main stages in a yeast life cycle, lag, log, stationary and death. By adding yeast that has completed fermentation you have already went through the four stages and are restarting the process all over again. Which adds more time to your fermentation. If you add in yeast that is actively fermenting (wort in starter and all) to your fresh wort ready to ferment you are starting in the second stage (a healthy active stage)...

So what you are doing is fine and if it works for you thats awesome... But just so you know my last 3 fermentations have taken less than 6 days to reach my F.G.

What if my starters are big...you just add a gallon starter to your wort?!

 

[jlaureanti]

You're not really making a starter... you're pitching a higher volume of yeast than you started with. Which will ferment faster than the original amount, but you still are having to go back through the life cycle. Think of it this way... You are fighting a war and the yeast are your soldiers. When you pitch yeast without a starter you are basically sending in scrawney teenagers, that have to grow and bulk up first before they can fight the war. The starters you are making are taking those scrawney guys, bulking them up and then allowing them to partially die off (assuming you let them ferment all available sugars in the starter). Now, when you pitch an active starter (still actively fermenting) in to your new beer you are essentially throwing in steroid freaks as soldiers. They have already bulked up, made more of themselves and are already actively fighting a war before you throw them in there. Activity from a healthy starter will take no more than a few hours.

For my starters I am only using 800mL of water, Light DME (about 1.040) and a vial of yeast. Once you pitch your yeast into your starter you need to shake the **** out of it and get it all nice and frothy. Then stir it as much as possible if you dont have a stir plate (which would give you an even healthier starter).

All yeast needs is sugar and oxygen to grow. That is the goal of a starter grow your yesties and prepare them for a war against simple sugars

 

[thomasben]

So for beers between 1.050-1.060 you could just use a quart starter pitch the yeast and within the day or next pitch all of that onto your wort?

 

[MNDan]

You cold crashed a starter??? Why would anyone do that? IMO, the goal of a starter is, one - to take a small amount of yeast and amplify them to a higher quantity and two - to introduce that now higher quantity of yeast in an active state and not a dormant state. When you crash cool, you kill some of your yeasties and you put them into a dormant state. Even when you warm them back up they are just awake not active. Which might describe the slow fermentation? Do you crash cool them often?

There is a fair amount of mis-information in this response. Most people don't want to pitch the entire starter since the beer that was created is usually pretty nasty due to elevated fermentation temps & excess oxidation. So cold-crashing is the best way to get the yeast to drop out of suspension so you can decant the nasty beer and be left with just yeast.

Cold-pitching yeast is a very popular way of pitching, and people often report shorter lag times than they do with "active" pitching. I've cold-pitched for the last couple of years with great results. Some good reading here:

http://www.brewboard.com/index.php?showtopic=26969

 

[jlaureanti]

mis-information? No. Differing of ideas maybe. For the record there will be zero oxidation to your starters, ever... starters produce CO2 which creates a blanket between the starter and the environment... even with a piece of foil for a cap the O2 will not be able to penetrate the CO2 layer due to density issues. Therefore, never creating any oxidation. Furthermore, any "nasty beer" that was created during making a starter will be cleaned up and refined by the yeast during the fermentation...

Mis-information is in the eye of the beholder... While cold pitching may work for some (i know breweries that do, but they pitch higher than recommended to make up for the initial temperature differential) but in the TRUE spirit of a 'starter' one should be pitching active yeast into their beer AND not dormant yeast that has been amplified in volume... Just sayn

 

[jlaureanti]

Here is a link to Mr. Malty. It is a pitching rate calculator from Jamil of the brewing network... which I would check out if you like to hear people talk about beer, I highly recommend these drunk guys

The pitching rate calculator has a few different setting so you can choose the one most like your setup at home.

I hope to have helped you out, if not I'm sorry for the rants