Attention Texas Beer Drinkers - Celis

[Torchiest]

To all my fellow Texans,

I just bought a six pack of Celis Raspberry a few days ago. I've worked at the same pub for more than ten years, and I remember having Celis White and Raspberry on draft when we first opened. At the time, I wasn't as into beer as I am now, and didn't care for either of them. Seeing them in the local liquor/wine/beer store, however, got me all excited and nostalgic.

I must admit, I was a bit disappointed when I tasted my first Raspberry, shockingly. It tastes pretty decent, except there's this really syrupy finish that I've never experienced with any beer before. I actually think my homebrew raspberry wit is superior, which blows me away, since everyone seemed to hold Celis in such high regard back in the day.

Which brings me to my question. Does anyone remember drinking the Raspberry and White all those years ago, and, have you tried them more recently? Was the Raspberry always syrupy like this? I still think I'll probably give the White a shot, as well as the Pale Bock, but the Raspberry is a big miss for me.

 

[zoebisch01]

I have always seen the cases of Celis at the distro. You kind of confirm my hesitation . You know, speaking of 'in the past'. The Sam Adams Boston Lager used to be way different back when it was first available. Once they became popular, something happened and it never was the same.

 

[Saccharomyces]

I wouldn't know but I have been told that Michigan Brewing has butchered the recipes. So now Kevin over at (512) is trying, with Pierre's guidance, to resurrect for the THIRD time a "real" Wit which hasn't been butchered for the sake of improving its appeal to the BMC swilling masses.

I have not had the original, I have only read about it. The Michigan version has just started showing up so when I find one I will give it a try but I'm not expecting it to be great.

I suspect a lot of people aren't excited about Wits because they have not had a really good one. Fortunately a few guys in the Zealots opened my eyes to how good a Wit can be, so I'm hoping to perfect my own recipe for this style which is quickly going the way of the polar ice cap.

 

[Parker36]

You know, speaking of 'in the past'. The Sam Adams Boston Lager used to be way different back when it was first available. Once they became popular, something happened and it never was the same.

I feel the same way about Fat Tire

 

[Homercidal]

I've had the Celis White at MBC on tap and thought it was very good. I've never had the original for comparison, but according to what I've read, Pierre himself assisted them in coming up with the recipe. I actually liked it much better than the Hoegaarden stuff I bought at the store.

 

[Torchiest]

I'm pretty sure the same thing happened with Shiner Bock, although I could be wrong. It was perhaps the first "different" beer I ever tried, way back in like 1994, and it seemed amazing at the time. Now I can't stand it, and I've heard the same thing, that the recipe has been bastardized to get mass appeal. Actually, I think all of the Shiner beers are pretty awful.

 

[Saccharomyces]

I've had the Celis White at MBC on tap and thought it was very good. I've never had the original for comparison, but according to what I've read, Pierre himself assisted them in coming up with the recipe. I actually liked it much better than the Hoegaarden stuff I bought at the store.

Celis resurrected the Wit as a dead style at the Hoegaarden brewery. He sold to InBev and they butchered the recipe. It has fewer spices, different orange peel, more hop bitterness, less hop flavor, and less orange flavor than the original.

Celis resurrected his wit AGAIN at his Austin brewery. He sold again (didn't learn his lesson the first time), this time to Miller. They butchered the recipe to make it cheaper to produce. They then closed the brewery a few years later after the beer didn't make them millions of dollars in fat profits. Michigan Brewing bought the rights to the Celis name, as well as the recipes, which have probably been modified a second time.

Pierre Celis' daughter still lives in Austin, and while over here to visit he is collaborating with Kevin at the new (512) brewery on a new wit. Hopefully once again the standard will be revived commercially in the US.

In the meantime I am told St Bernardus Wit (St. Bernardus Witbier - Brouwerij St. Bernardus NV - BeerAdvocate) is as close to the Celis original wit as you can get today.

A little project of mine, I started with the Michigan Brewing specs for their Celis White and am trying to dial in a recipe closer to what the Celis original would have been like. Once I get it sufficiently dialed in it will get added to my dropdown... Wits are frustratingly hard to do well, so I may need a lot of practice.

 

[dogbar]

I used to love the old Celis White, but haven't seen the new one around anywhere.

+1 on the 512 Wit. That is some good stuff. It's starting to pop up more places here in town too.

 

[Saccharomyces]

I'm literally going to go out of my way to make sure I find it on Saturday. I've waited too long already to try it.

I think the Dig has it on tap? I think I'm going to head over there at 7pm on Saturday for the Full Moon cask tapping. Anybody who shows up from here I'll buy a beer. I'll wear my Austin Homebrew T-shirt.

 

[Torchiest]

I'll give this a little revival. I've heard more about the 512 brewery recently, specifically that their Pecan Porter is awesome. Has anyone tried it, and does anyone know if they're selling their beers down in Houston yet?

 

[MarsColonist]

I think its Austin only right now... not even sure he can meet demand here!

 

[Torchiest]

That's what I was afraid of! I'll have to con someone into bringing me some of the porter when they come visit Houston.

 

[Torg]

The problem with Shiner is they changed the beer in 1989. They stopped making some of the beers that you can only occasionally find today. They also lightened the Shiner Bock and reduced its alcohol content to make it more mass market appealing.

Today Shiner Bock has to be the lightest Bock I know of. I could even swear an Amber has more taste then Shiners Bock now. Shine makes a Shiner Black that is somewhat closer to what I remember my father getting.