Astringency in my latest BIAB brew, looking for advice.

[TkmLinus]

Greetings everyone!
I recently brewed a Zombie Dust clone (Soulless Hop Pale Ale Zombie Dust® Clone - Soulless Hop Pale Ale (All Grain) | MoreBeer) and I noticed some astringency, my friend was drinking it and mentioned that his tongue was a touched numbed by it. Taste was otherwise just fine. I was thinking it may be tannins, or it may have been caused by the carrageenan tablet(this was my first time using one).

I have an eight gallon kettle, so I brought 5.5 gallons of water up to 160 degrees, shot for a mash temp of 151-152. Placed my bag, mixed in grains and let it sit for 90 minutes. Then I brought the other 2.5 gallons up to 170 degrees(in a different kettle) and dunked the grains in there. The temp dropped after I put in the grains, so I fired the burner back up until I got to 170, then I let the grains steep for another 30 minutes(I think this was my screw up). Drained then combined everything in my big kettle, then went on with the boil following the hop additions according to the recipe sheet. Added a carrageenan tablet during the last 5 minutes. Cooled to 68 degrees, pitched BRY-97 yeast, spent 3 weeks in fermenter at 68. Bottled with honey to carb it up and let sit for two weeks before enjoying.

My guess is that bringing the water to 170(possibly higher when trying to increase the temp) extracted tannins, if so should I skip this step next time since I don't need to sparge with BIAB? Is there anything else that may have caused this? Thanks in advance!

 

[doug293cz]

Most likely your mash pH was too high (greater than about 6.0.) High temperatures alone won't extract tannins (otherwise all decocted beer would be astringent.) Do you do anything to adjust the pH of your mash? Do you have a water report that gives you mineral concentrations and alkalinity?

You don't need hot water to do a sparge. In fact you can sparge in room temp, or cooler, water. The only time hot water would make a difference is if your conversion was not complete at the end of your mash. In that case, you could get some additional conversion during the sparge. Also, no need for a dwell when batch sparging - just stir aggressively for a few minutes.

Brew on

 

[Sammy86]

You don't need hot water to do a sparge. In fact you can sparge in room temp, or cooler, water.

I was almost todays years old when @Yooper taught me this very fact...gotta love HBT!

 

[TkmLinus]

Most likely your mash pH was too high (greater than about 6.0.) High temperatures alone won't extract tannins (otherwise all decocted beer would be astringent.) Do you do anything to adjust the pH of your mash? Do you have a water report that gives you mineral concentrations and alkalinity?

You don't need hot water to do a sparge. In fact you can sparge in room temp, or cooler, water. The only time hot water would make a difference is if your conversion was not complete at the end of your mash. In that case, you could get some additional conversion during the sparge. Also, no need for a dwell when batch sparging - just stir aggressively for a few minutes.

Brew on

Thanks for the info on sparging, that will be a huge time saver! I have been brewing for about 2 years now and have yet to start messing with water chemistry. I do have fairly hard water, pH from tap is about 7.8-8.0, pH from my fridge water filter is about 7.2 which is what I brew with. I have never measured the pH of my mash, I'll check into it next time. I found a water report but it just covers heavy metals, chlorine, fluoride, etc. I'll check into finding a better report with more information.

 

[doug293cz]

pH of the starting water is almost irrelevant. The most important parameter is the alkalinity, as that determines how easy it is to shift the mash pH into an acceptable range. A simple filter will not significantly affect water alkalinity. A reverse osmosis (RO) system will remove almost all of the alkalinity, as well as all other minerals. RO water needs to have minerals added back for brewing, but they are cheap and easy to add.

Call your water supplier to see if they have a report that lists: hardness, alkalinity, bi-carbonate, calcium, magnesium, iron, sodium, sulfate, chloride (not chlorine), etc. If not, you can send a sample to Wards labs for their brewing water analysis.

Brew on

 

[TkmLinus]

pH of the starting water is almost irrelevant. The most important parameter is the alkalinity, as that determines how easy it is to shift the mash pH into an acceptable range. A simple filter will not significantly affect water alkalinity. A reverse osmosis (RO) system will remove almost all of the alkalinity, as well as all other minerals. RO water needs to have minerals added back for brewing, but they are cheap and easy to add.

Call your water supplier to see if they have a report that lists: hardness, alkalinity, bi-carbonate, calcium, magnesium, iron, sodium, sulfate, chloride (not chlorine), etc. If not you can send a sample to Wards labs for their brewing water analysis.

Brew on

Thanks so much for the info. I will look into it!

I love this hobby, feels like there is always new stuff to learn!

 

[Waunabeer]

pH of the starting water is almost irrelevant. The most important parameter is the alkalinity, as that determines how easy it is to shift the mash pH into an acceptable range. A simple filter will not significantly affect water alkalinity. A reverse osmosis (RO) system will remove almost all of the alkalinity, as well as all other minerals. RO water needs to have minerals added back for brewing, but they are cheap and easy to add.

Call your water supplier to see if they have a report that lists: hardness, alkalinity, bi-carbonate, calcium, magnesium, iron, sodium, sulfate, chloride (not chlorine), etc. If not, you can send a sample to Wards labs for their brewing water analysis.

Brew on

When I started brewing in my new house, the first 5 batches all had that weird flavor. Because I have an RO system throughout the house, I sent my water into Ward Laboratories and have been adding calcium chloride, epsom salt and gypsum ever since. All beers have normal, great taste now. Money well spent.