Argon/CO2

[bigears]

My local gas supplier does not have any C02 bottles as he says that everyone (welders) now prefers an Argon/CO2 mix - I'm not familiar with Argon and I presume it's not a good idea to use this mix to carbonate my beer. Any thoughts?

 

[Focus]

Argon is a noble gas meaning that it doesn't comine with anything - ever. So, technically it can't be poisonous b/c it can't combine with anything in your body. The worst I'd think it could do would be to replace some other gas in solution in your body (like nitrogen which is in solution in your blood all the time). You of course wouldn't want to breathe it b/c just because it's not poisonous doesn't mean it can't asphyxiate you if it replaces all the air in a given space. I still sure as hell wouldn't carbonate my beer with it until I heard it from a doctor, though. It could be an interesting gimick, though and may catch on - like the CO2-nitrogen mix you use in Guiness that I've seen in some microbrews.

I say again, though: don't carbonate your beer with it on my recommendation!

 

[Walker]

Argon is a noble gas meaning that it doesn't comine with anything - ever.

That's not exactly true, Focus. Under *normal* conditions a noble gas won't combine with any other element, but it can and does happen. This is exactly why the scientific world stopped calling them "inert" gasses in the early 60's... some crazy guys in Helsinki found ways to make stable compounds using the noble gasses.

But, I agree with the sentiment that I wouldn't be carbonating my beer with it! It's probably safe, and is about as soluable as oxygen in water, but.... I'd hate to find out 5 years down the road that argon causes your pecker to fall off or something.

 

[Radarbrew]

Offer him a beer, I bet he finds some Co2 for ya!

 

[drost]

Are there any scuba gear places in your area? They will refill tanks some times, too.

 

[Yuri_Rage]

Your local welding supply is a bit chincy! As a welder, I'd be pissed if I couldn't get pure Argon, Helium, Oxygen, Acetylene, Nitrogen, AND CO2 from any supplier (not to mention the common mixes like 75/25 Argon/CO2). In the states, the Yellow Pages telephone directory has a section for "Gas - Industrial & Medical - Cylinder & Bulk." That usually yields a few places to try other than just the welding supply shops.

 

[bikebryan]

Are there any scuba gear places in your area? They will refill tanks some times, too.

I don't think I'd frequent a SCUBA shop that refilled tanks with CO2. Why, oh why, would they have need of CO2 at a shop like that?

 

[brackbrew]

Just because under normal conditions, a noble gas can't bond with anything doesn't necessarily make it NOT poisonous. Radon is a noble gas and is suspected to cause cancer! Straight CO2 is the way to go, my friend.

BREW ON

 

[Bernie Brewer]

I don't think I'd frequent a SCUBA shop that refilled tanks with CO2. Why, oh why, would they have need of CO2 at a shop like that?

Damn, you beat me to it!

 

[Bernie Brewer]

Your local welding supply is a bit chincy! As a welder, I'd be pissed if I couldn't get pure Argon, Helium, Oxygen, Acetylene, Nitrogen, AND CO2 from any supplier (not to mention the common mixes like 75/25 Argon/CO2). In the states, the Yellow Pages telephone directory has a section for "Gas - Industrial & Medical - Cylinder & Bulk." That usually yields a few places to try other than just the welding supply shops.

I agree. We electricians use CO2 sometimes to shoot string through our pipes. Every town has a gas shop in it somewhere.

 

[user 574]

I know the "where do I fill my CO2 tanks" comes up often. I've said it before and will say it again. We all probably head to the bar/pub on occasion considering our hobbies . I asked my local pub and they told me where to go. I pay .75 per lb. which is from the company that pretty much fills all the CO2 tanks in town. The bars/restaraunts aren't getting them filled at the welder. Find the distribution source; they'll take your $ too!

 

[bigears]

Thanks for all the replies guys. I suspect the supplier can get CO2 bottles, I'll ring them again and ask, maybe I got the wrong guy on the phone last time.

I called BOC gases - the supplier who deals with most of the pubs - they won't deal with the public once they hear you want the gas for beer I might just tell them I want the bottle for welding - is it likely to have the same connection for my regulator as the beer gas bottle - is it the same bottle in fact?

 

[aleander]

My local gas supplier does not have any C02 bottles as he says that everyone (welders) now prefers an Argon/CO2 mix - I'm not familiar with Argon and I presume it's not a good idea to use this mix to carbonate my beer. Any thoughts?

I have a lot of experience with Nitrogen in Packaging Beer, the main reason it is used it Cost. Secondly the size of the bubbles formed when the nitrogen breaks out of solution. These Bubbles are smaller than CO2 bubbles giving the creamy texture and soother taste to the liquor. Argon is costly and the bubble sizes are different this will in turn alter the texture of the finished liquor.

 

[mysterio]

Hi bigears.

BOC are known to be pretty expensive, and charge unreasonable rental to boot.

I got my CO2 (in the UK) in Edinburgh through a Calor outlet, maybe you could try phoning around your local calor suppliers to see if they can point you in the right direction?

Theres a UK based forum where we discuss this kind of thing so a bit of digging around and you might have some luck:

http://www.forumforfree.com/forums/index.php?mforum=jimsbrewingforu&act=idx

NB I know Dublin isn't the UK but i'm sure there are members from the R of I that you can ask.

 

[runhard]

Another benefit of carbon dioxide is that when dissolved in liquid is forms carbonic acid which adds or detracts from the flavour profile. Good luck finding a place to refill your tank; they're out there somewhere.