April 11, 2009 Circle City Brew Day

[The Pol]

Yeap, been shaking it periodically as I walked past it all day...

Probably a total of 5 minutes of shaking, then pitched, then shook again.

 

[The Pol]

5.5 hours after pitching, the HDPE fermentor is bubbling away at 68F.

So far my evil plan it working!

 

[bakins]

So, you moved all your late additions 20 minutes later? Was going to experiment with this as well. I'm thinking of doing a pale ale with just 1 oz FWH then 2 oz in the "cube."

Glad you had a good brew day. One of my march's quit working and in my fiddling with it, I dry fired my RIMS element I disassembled the head on the pump and put it back together and it worked fine. Strange. Haven't tried the element again, but box said it can survive being dry fired (it's a "sand" element).

 

[The Pol]

I am VERY scared of dry firing my elements... AHHHH.

The brew day was spot on... between the spreadsheets and the accuracy of ProMash, I hit my target volume spot on and overshot my OG by ONE point. Not bad.

I bet your element is fine, what happened to your pump?

I am getting one bubble/5 seconds 28 hours after transferring 189F wort to the HDPE fermentor.

Yes, I adjusted my hops as such...

FHW- still FWH
90 minute addition- still 90 minute addition
35 minute addition - moved to 15 minutes
20 minute addition - moved to "cube"
My hops below 20 minutes were already moved to FWH in this recipe.

I am basically "assuming" 20 minutes of utilization in the HDPE container... we will see how close I am!

 

[bakins]

I bet your element is fine, what happened to your pump?

No clue. It sounded like something was "lodged" in it. I took it apart and put it back together and it worked fine for recirculating chilling water.

Now if my stuff from US plastics would actually find it's way to my house, I'm going to test "no-chill".

 

[The Pol]

US Plastics is good... they did have a shipping issue when I ordered. The CAP for the fermentor came here about a week before the vessel did

Today the ferment is rockin... uploading a video now!

 

[The Pol]

Here is my no chill ferment 12 hours after pitching, 34 hours after racking to the fermentor at 189F.

http://s168.photobucket.com/albums/u189/PolTavern/?action=view&current=P1020469.flv[/URL

 

[Saccharomyces]

Care to share the part# for the HDPE fermenter? That is one snazzy looking fermenter, even for chill-first brewing. I like the idea it could be sanitized with boiling hot water.

And what size bung is that?

 

[The Pol]

I can get you that info... BRB! It handles HOTTTT fluids like a champ! The bung is #11.5

#75032

Here is the link!
http://www.usplastic.com/catalog/va...ory_name=25&product_id=13648&variant_id=75032

 

[The Pol]

FWIW, I ran my mill at .038" gap. I was too scared to tighten it up. The lauter was capable of running at full open, so I am not SO scared now. I will be running it at .035 on the next batch and noting any eff. differences. I will tighten it .003" at a time to be safe.

 

[bakins]

I got my containers yesterday. I ordered two of these:

5 Gal UN Approved Plastic Carboys - US Plastic Corporation

 

[The Pol]

I got my containers yesterday. I ordered two of these:

5 Gal UN Approved Plastic Carboys - US Plastic Corporation

Nice, they have great products, I assume that you then plan to transfer to another vessel to ferment.

 

[Ryno]

How much head space do you have with these fermenters? Winpak® Tight Head Pail - US Plastic Corporation .....thinking about trying them out. I might try to drill the cap and install a mini keg bung in it for the airlock...works very well on plastic bucket fermenters lids. thanks

 

[bakins]

Nice, they have great products, I assume that you then plan to transfer to another vessel to ferment.

Yes. I bought one of these too:

EZ-Strainers™ - US Plastic Corporation

My plan is to:
-drain about 1-2 quarts hot wort into a small HDPE jug I have. put in fridge.
-drain rest ( 5 gallon or so) into container.
-when small amount is cooled, pitch my yeast.
-next day (or two) when 5 gal is cooled, put strainer on my bucket and dump wort through it. Since I'll probably be cube hoping , this should strain some of that out. It will also help get any break that didn't whirlpool out and help some with aeration.
-Add my yeast infected small batch

The strainer may not help much as leaving the hops in primary is not a big deal, but it was cheap.

I'm thinking this will cut some time off my brew day, but mostly frustration. I'm paranoid about cleaning my plate chiller so I recycle PBW, rinse water, star-san though it and store it in my oven. Not to mention the mess of tubing when I'm chilling and having to use hopbags so it doesn't get clogged. Hopbags are a PITA to clean if you forget about them and leave them overnight!

 

[rcrabb22]

I did what I am going to call a "RWS" It stands for Real Wort Starter.

Basically this is what I did.

Prior to transferring my hot wort to the container, I drained 1 qt into a SS sauce pan. I chilled it in a cold water bath, and took my OG.

Once I did this, I poured the OG sample wort back into the sauce pan and boiled it again to make sure it was good and sterile.

Then cooled in a cool water bath to 65F and transferred to a 1 gal. carboy.

I rehydrated my S-05 as usual in warm water, then transferred it into my 1 gal. carboy to make my 24-hour starter.

No DME, and the yeasties get accustomed to the same worth they are going to get pitched into, tomorrow!

Pol, just curious, why did you make a starter for the S-05 vs just re-hydrating the dry yeast prior to pitching? was it to reduce possibility of adaption issues in the fermenter?

What was the OG of your RWS?

I was thinking (OMG) , I have a refractometer and could take readings during the latter half of the boil cycle and pull the RWS amount when it reached ~1.040 and cool in the sanitized starter flask. That would reduce a couple of the steps you went through.

 

[The Pol]

Pol, just curious, why did you make a starter for the S-05 vs just re-hydrating the dry yeast prior to pitching? was it to reduce possibility of adaption issues in the fermenter?

What was the OG of your RWS?

I was thinking (OMG) , I have a refractometer and could take readings during the latter half of the boil cycle and pull the RWS amount when it reached ~1.040 and cool in the sanitized starter flask. That would reduce a couple of the steps you went through.

I pulled my RWS after the boil, because it was 1.040 OG AFTER the boil anyway. I made the starter because I did a "no chill" brew day and wanted to get a nice healthy yeast starter into the wort after the 24 hour cooling period. Trying to reduce any lag time.

Since the brew was cooling for 24 hours, seemed like a no brainer to go ahead and make a 24 hour starter for this brew. It was fermenting 5.5 hours after pitching the starter.

 

[rcrabb22]

Pol, Your actions make perfect sense to me.

This thread prompted me to re-read the March-April BYO article on the Aussie brewing methods and it stated the wort could be kept in a properly sanitized cube for "several" weeks prior to pitching the yeast. The article did advise to chill the cube if you weren't pitching yeast right away to reduce wort color darkening.

 

[The Pol]

I am hoping to pave the way for more U.S. no chill brewers... experimenting with the late hop additions etc. to make it less of a guessing game since it is not a widely used method here.

I like that ProMash gives me the PRE-boil gravity so that in most cases I can choose to use the PRE boil wort of POST boil wort depending on the planned OG of the beer. This way I can keep my starters around 1.035-1.050.

 

[The Pol]

Corrected gravity reading on 4-19-09 is 1.007

That is about 82% attenuation.

As for the flavor... well... I can taste the botulism and there is a very distinct flavor like cooked corn in it!

 

[The Pol]

FWIW... I am JOKING. This hydro sample tastes JUST like all of the other CCB Haus Ales I brewed. All of the numbers match for attenuation and such. I don't see a reason to ever chill my beer again, thus far.

Darn, I REALLY love cooked corn!

 

[bakins]

FWIW... I am JOKING. This hydro sample tastes JUST like all of the other CCB Haus Ales I brewed. All of the numbers match for attenuation and such. I don't see a reason to ever chill my beer again, thus far.

Darn, I REALLY love cooked corn!

I hope to be trying this soon as well. I'll post an update.

Really glad to see this working.

 

[G-E-R-M-A-N]

Really interested to see the final outcome of this.

 

[The Pol]

I am really pleased so far... it made brew day easier and saved me some water for sure. I also HATE cleaning that damn IC...

I liked using real wort for my starter too... no more DME.

 

[Mainebrew]

I really like this idea, though putting 200+deg wort into my glass carboys does not turn me on, handling and such. As summer approaches it will take longer for the wort to cool while in the keggle than fall winter and spring. Any ideas?

 

[The Pol]

I really like this idea, though putting 200+deg wort into my glass carboys does not turn me on, handling and such. As summer approaches it will take longer for the wort to cool while in the keggle than fall winter and spring. Any ideas?

#1 you NEVER put hot liquids in glass. This is why I had to source the HDPE fermentor.

#2 the wort doesnt cool in the keggle, the HDPE container cooled in my house, so the season (winter, fall, summer) will not matter. If I really wanted to cool it "faster" I could place it in my ferment. fridge at say 63F and that would help.

 

[humann_brewing]

#1 you NEVER put hot liquids in glass. This is why I had to source the HDPE fermentor.

#2 the wort doesnt cool in the keggle, the HDPE container cooled in my house, so the season (winter, fall, summer) will not matter. If I really wanted to cool it "faster" I could place it in my ferment. fridge at say 63F and that would help.

Ahh.... summer brew sessions it is that time again (96 degrees today :cross Anyways, I am taking note of your experiment and thanks for doing so. I guess I don't need to upgrade my chilling system.

I still plan on chilling the wort to safe temps to put in the fermentor, but I don't think I will be worried about the fastest method possible. I try to get it below 140* quickly and then wander around cleaning up more while it gets into the 80s and I am good with that.

 

[The Pol]

There is a benefit to getting it into the container while it is hot.

#1. Cooling between 140 and 80 is PRIME time for critters to enter into your wort that you do not want.

#2. The hot wort further sterilizes the fermentor.

#3. It is not sitting out in the open long at all, much less time than if you actually chill it.

Those are a couple of the reasons that I did, what I did.

 

[humann_brewing]

There is a benefit to getting it into the container while it is hot.

#1. Cooling between 140 and 80 is PRIME time for critters to enter into your wort that you do not want.

#2. The hot wort further sterilizes the fermentor.

#3. It is not sitting out in the open long at all, much less time than if you actually chill it.

Those are a couple of the reasons that I did, what I did.

hmm.... so what is a safe temperature to transfer to a glass carboy?

 

[The Pol]

hmm.... so what is a safe temperature to transfer to a glass carboy?

Um, I dunno... but Id say less than 140F. Probably depends on the glass, but that just scares me. ALSO when the wort cools, it shrinks, along with the headpsace. I am not sure what a vaccuum will do to your glass carboy.

 

[humann_brewing]

Um, I dunno... but Id say less than 140F. Probably depends on the glass, but that just scares me. ALSO when the wort cools, it shrinks, along with the headpsace. I am not sure what a vaccuum will do to your glass carboy.

Yeah... ok enough said, I will not mess around with that. I guess mostly cooled wort (80*) into the glass for me.

I think the idea of the RWS is great though. While the yeast is beginning to munch away on the wort that is actually the soon to be beer. I can stabilize the temp of the fermenter and get it ready for the yeast that will soon follow.